X-Virus-Scanned: clean according to Sophos on Logan.com From: "Ernest Christley" Received: from nm16-vm7.access.bullet.mail.gq1.yahoo.com ([216.39.63.194] verified) by logan.com (CommuniGate Pro SMTP 6.1c2) with ESMTPS id 7427939 for flyrotary@lancaironline.net; Wed, 21 Jan 2015 09:09:40 -0500 Received-SPF: none receiver=logan.com; client-ip=216.39.63.194; envelope-from=echristley@att.net Received: from [216.39.60.167] by nm16.access.bullet.mail.gq1.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 21 Jan 2015 14:09:04 -0000 Received: from [216.39.60.243] by tm3.access.bullet.mail.gq1.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 21 Jan 2015 14:09:04 -0000 Received: from [127.0.0.1] by omp1014.access.mail.gq1.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 21 Jan 2015 14:09:04 -0000 X-Yahoo-Newman-Property: ymail-3 X-Yahoo-Newman-Id: 358733.47884.bm@omp1014.access.mail.gq1.yahoo.com Received: (qmail 14571 invoked by uid 60001); 21 Jan 2015 14:09:04 -0000 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=att.net; s=s1024; t=1421849344; bh=5sgbLr1rjC4mWvTM+o6p6Oe6LZF1gnhTv/rSKbC9A34=; h=References:Message-ID:Date:From:Reply-To:Subject:To:In-Reply-To:MIME-Version:Content-Type; b=ALbXnJ+Rzpt7g0+FFF6mwpHPDNas6hCHznS68IQExBegOCO7jt9QJpTSilXNEKiqBA5WLytCYyzxaPhrxKveR3PgxoSbNcrxuLaCfObZpEFKe0Pu3CvgYQNG94JpC1baNdYNmviwYPmjjGO8m0c0kNUsWqjSTV+vMDfbACtjxU4= X-YMail-OSG: AqbxDIEVM1kGGFIFdJePUc.LSlu_tY5xeZZ77kgHdzNDcKq 0EDdeWaPrCM5hIYEzwWqIe3hICJQZPecnafvWqVnY0K1nw0ZZLN3xk9Mj3zT yPuLb0ue5ILi2v8CsyKotQjYE8HtzZorVaFeWbIEV2puZDW1piIvi140rXsG xuZMv4Bi44s0EQT04We1Zf3HLQctSsgwSMOhIJpsCpyfLxk8cnLj47oAsJEI jqvgQRa_s7qgUMqtm34ym9BaprXZKWmCZ5N_uNyonzVa82fV57nA0P6AqAaz vaAx8wpEMerAaPeHJlnJkvyXk1RBEL66O9Y4N7lkh.BnrqG9L0IhuASZ5AKK yLwh6HD2Pg5_HK_xwxmS6BW6z1qSi7xWF5JVXSR6xFYXI0hXtuaKQmCtRHsP gWJEz47l9jypyd5.8Ymi9f7CAmnPdAzTuknVNz.VmeN7REs2QytNY_pRxxP7 urI8kLg69sixVqC0Cklrf2h7gwOo2_FjZw2TUpuMiTdQk39AoXRI6lt8MxOI rCYZ7n7C9KoAC0EXqei6Ty.dvyLwBH4G7ob2ZNdm0Bw-- Received: from [67.202.75.55] by web181605.mail.ne1.yahoo.com via HTTP; Wed, 21 Jan 2015 06:09:03 PST X-Rocket-MIMEInfo: 002.001,SSdtIG5vdCBzdXJlIHRoaXMgZml0cyBoZXJlLCBidXQgaXQgaXMgYSBzdXJwcmlzaW5nIGxlc3NvbiBJIGxlYXJuZWQgYW5kIEknZCBsaWtlIHRvIHBhc3MgaXQgb24uICBNeSBzZXR1cCBoYWQgYSByYWRpYXRvciBvbiB0aGUgcmlnaHQgc2lkZSBvZiB0aGUgY293bC4gIFRoZSBvcGVuaW5nIHdhcyBqdXN0IGEgZmV3IGluY2hlcyBiZWhpbmQgdGhlIHByb3AsIGFuZCB0aGUgZXhpdCB3YXMgdGhlIHRyYWRpdGlvbmFsIG9wZW5pbmcgYXQgdGhlIGJvdHRvbS4gIEkgY291bGQgbm90IGdldCBpdCB0byBjb29sIHMBMAEBAQE- X-Mailer: YahooMailWebService/0.8.203.740 References: Message-ID: <1421849343.73780.YahooMailNeo@web181605.mail.ne1.yahoo.com> Date: Wed, 21 Jan 2015 06:09:03 -0800 Reply-To: Ernest Christley Subject: Re: [FlyRotary] Re: Cooling To: Rotary motors in aircraft In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="1885600119-679908148-1421849343=:73780" --1885600119-679908148-1421849343=:73780 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable I'm not sure this fits here, but it is a surprising lesson I learned and I'= d like to pass it on. My setup had a radiator on the right side of the cow= l. The opening was just a few inches behind the prop, and the exit was the= traditional opening at the bottom. I could not get it to cool sufficientl= y at idle even on a 60 degree day. I finally figured out the problem when = my manifold pressure line melted on the top LEFT of the engine bay.=0A=0AAi= r was being pushed in by the prop. As it left the radiator, it hit the fir= ewall and turned left. The momentum carried it across the red hot muffler,= straight past the exit opening and back up the other side of the engine. = Basically, I had turned my cowling into a convection oven. The solution wa= s a simple baffle to scoop the air out the exit. At 1500 RPM, the temps wo= uld stabilize at 190 on a 90 degree day. Idling faster or slower would inc= rease temps.=0A=0AMoral of the story, track the airflow all the way out of = the plane.=0A=0A=0A=0AOn Tuesday, January 20, 2015 6:04 PM, Stephen Izett <= flyrotary@lancaironline.net> wrote:=0A =0A=0A=0AThanks Jeff and Neil=0AStev= e Izett=0A=0AOn 21 Jan 2015, at 5:45 am, Jeff Whaley wrote:=0A>=0A>Steve, my setup will cool on the ground <80 F OAT pro= vided that engine rpm is Both my o= il air intake and radiator air intake plenums are within a few inches of th= e prop.=0A>If you open the throttle during stationary ground operation you = should expect it to overheat. Stationary engine dynamometers have HUGE rad= iators/coolers with ducted fans.=0A>Jeff=0A> =0A>From: Neil Unger =0A>Subject: Re: [FlyRotary] Cooling =0A>Date: Wed, 21= Jan 2015 07:39:29 +1100 =0A>To: Rotary motors in aircraft =0A>=0A> =0A>Steve, I can run = full noise on the ground with no heating problems, but then I do have 900 c= ub inches of cooling. 600 for water and 300 for oil. I did insist that PW= R make a rad that WILL cool. It does regardless of OAT. I had to put a the= rmostat in to get the water over 60 degrees. I have too much cooling. Nei= l.=0A>=0A>-----Original Message----- From: steve Izett=0A>Sent: Tuesday, Ja= nuary 20, 2015 6:35 PM=0A>To: Rotary motors in aircraft=0A>Subject: [FlyRot= ary] Cooling=0A>=0A>Hi Guys=0A>=0A>So what are your experiences of running = on the ground.=0A>Do your setups cool on the ground at any throttle setting= ?=0A>=0A>I=E2=80=99m still not in a position to open the throttle as Im in = a garage at home.=0A>After start and running at about 1500RPM (engine) with= an OAT 90+=0A>temps slowly rise till i shut it down before it gets past 21= 0F.=0A>This takes probably 20 Minutes.=0A>=0A>What do you guys see on the g= round in your various climates and cooling setups?=0A>=0A>Steve Izett=0A>Pe= rth Western Australia =0A> This message, and the documents attached hereto,= is intended only for the addressee and may contain privileged or confident= ial information. Any unauthorized disclosure is strictly prohibited. If you= have received this message in error, please notify us immediately so that = we may correct our internal records. Please then delete the original messag= e. Thank you. --1885600119-679908148-1421849343=:73780 Content-Type: text/html; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
I'm not sure this fits here, but it is a surprisin= g lesson I learned and I'd like to pass it on.  My setup had a radiato= r on the right side of the cowl.  The opening was just a few inches be= hind the prop, and the exit was the traditional opening at the bottom. = ; I could not get it to cool sufficiently at idle even on a 60 degree day.&= nbsp; I finally figured out the problem when my manifold pressure line melt= ed on the top LEFT of the engine bay.

Air was being pushed in by the prop.  A= s it left the radiator, it hit the firewall and turned left.  The mome= ntum carried it across the red hot muffler, straight past the exit opening = and back up the other side of the engine.  Basically, I had turned my = cowling into a convection oven.  The solution was a simple baffle to s= coop the air out the exit.  At 1500 RPM, the temps would stabilize at = 190 on a 90 degree day.  Idling faster or slower would increase temps.=

<= div style=3D"color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-size: 16px; font-family: HelveticaNe= ue,Helvetica Neue,Helvetica,Arial,Lucida Grande,sans-serif; background-color: transparent; font-style: normal;">Moral of the sto= ry, track the airflow all the way out of the plane.


On Tuesday, January 20, 2015 6:04 PM, Stephen Izett <flyro= tary@lancaironline.net> wrote:


Thanks Jeff and NeilSteve Izett
O= n 21 Jan 2015, at 5:45 am, Jeff Whaley <flyrotary@lancai= ronline.net> wrote:

Steve, my setup will cool on the ground &= lt;80 F OAT provided that engine rpm is </=3D 3000 with zero wind; it wi= ll do a bit better than that if airplane is taxiing or there is a strong br= eeze.
Both my oil air intake and r= adiator air intake plenums are within a few inches of the prop.
If you open the throttle during stationary ground operation you= should expect it to overheat.  Stationary engine dynamometers have HU= GE radiators/coolers with ducted fans.
Jeff
 
From:
Neil Unger <flyrotary@lancaironline.net>
Subjec= t:
<= div style=3D"margin:0in 0in 0.0001pt;font-size:11pt;font-family:Calibri, sa= ns-serif;" class=3D"yiv8274710807">Re: [FlyRotary] Coolin= g
Date:
Wed, 21 Jan 2015 07:39:29 +1100
To:
Rotary motors in aircraft <flyrotary@lancaironline.net>
<image001.gif>

<image002.gif>
Steve,  I can run full noise o= n the ground with no heating problems, but then I do have 900 cub inches of= cooling.  600 for water and 300 for oil.  I did insist that PWR = make a rad that WILL cool.  It does regardless of OAT. I had to put a = thermostat in to get the water over 60 degrees.  I have too much cooling.  Neil.

-----Original Message----- From: steve Izett
Sent: Tuesday, January 20, 2015 6:35 PM=
To: Rotary motors in aircr= aft
Subject: [FlyRotary] Cooling<= br class=3D"yiv8274710807">
Hi G= uys

= So what are your experiences of running on the ground.=
Do your setups cool on the= ground at any throttle setting?
<= br class=3D"yiv8274710807">I=E2=80=99m still not in a position to open the throttle as Im in a garag= e at home.
After sta= rt and running at about 1500RPM (engine) with an OAT 90+
temps slowly rise till i shut it down= before it gets past 210F.
= This takes probably 20 Minutes.

What do you guys see on the ground in your various clim= ates and cooling setups?

Steve Izett
Perth Western Australia
&= nbsp;
This message, and the documents= attached hereto, is intended only for the addressee and may contain privil= eged or confidential information. Any unauthorized disclosure is strictly p= rohibited. If you have received this message in error, please notify us imm= ediately so that we may correct our internal records. Please then delete th= e original message. Thank you.



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