X-Virus-Scanned: clean according to Sophos on Logan.com From: "Dennis Havarlah" Received: from [107.14.166.227] (HELO cdptpa-oedge-vip.email.rr.com) by logan.com (CommuniGate Pro SMTP 6.0.9e) with ESMTP id 6915010 for flyrotary@lancaironline.net; Sun, 01 Jun 2014 23:40:25 -0400 Received-SPF: pass receiver=logan.com; client-ip=107.14.166.227; envelope-from=clouduster@austin.rr.com Return-Path: Received: from [70.113.112.169] ([70.113.112.169:60603] helo=DWHPC) by cdptpa-oedge01 (envelope-from ) (ecelerity 3.5.0.35861 r(Momo-dev:tip)) with ESMTP id 67/C6-06582-702FB835; Mon, 02 Jun 2014 03:39:52 +0000 Message-ID: <4A71B578AD614F51BB2D62CB31EDE469@DWHPC> To: "Rotary motors in aircraft" References: In-Reply-To: Subject: RD1 - C Questions Date: Sun, 1 Jun 2014 22:39:49 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_05C9_01CF7DEA.65A9CD80" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Windows Mail 6.0.6002.18197 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.0.6002.18463 X-RR-Connecting-IP: 107.14.168.118:25 X-Cloudmark-Score: 0 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_05C9_01CF7DEA.65A9CD80 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="Windows-1252" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Tracy, I hope you are doing well. I'm sorry I could not attend the fly-in at = Charlie England's. I really wanted to be there with all the guys! When running my Renesis powered RV -7A on the ground at idle (1600 rpm) = I noticed a random tick noise in the front bearing area of the RD1 - C = When prop rpm was increased to 2000 rpm the noise went away. I removed = the prop output shaft and had several mechanics inspect the bearing and = none thought it was bad. I have purchased a replacement bearing (MRC = #209SZZ) and still want to replace the bearing. The bearing has a = bearing retainer ring (part # 58505 R) pressed on the shaft against the = bearing. The machine shop wants to heat the 58505 R retainer and press = it and the old bearing off - then reuse the bearing retainer with the = new bearing - is this OK or should I get a new retainer? If I need a new = retainer who supplies them? My prop gear lash has increased from about 3/8 in. when new to about 5/8 = in with 600 hrs. of run time. After disassembly of the RD1- C it appears = the input shaft spline has a very small amount of play between it and = the flex plate spline. Is this any problem? No noticeable play was found = in the planetary gear system. Thanks, Dennis Haverlah ----- Original Message -----=20 From: Stephen Izett=20 To: Rotary motors in aircraft=20 Sent: Tuesday, May 27, 2014 8:11 AM Subject: [FlyRotary] Re: Re [Fly Rotary]: start Thanks very much Jeff The engine is a Renesis 4 port, it was one of a batch of Mazda=92s = test engines that a number of us here in Australia purchased. We have done nothing to it internally as yet. We have an expansion tank being welded up and when we install it = hopefully this weekend we will then pressure test and compression test = to ascertain primary engine health parameters. Cheers Steve Izett On 27 May 2014, at 8:53 pm, Jeff Whaley = wrote: Steve, attached is the Hanover cooling system diagram =85 note all = the cooling elements (radiator, hoses, filler bottle) are completely = full of glycol (green); only the expansion tank (approx 1 litre, with = stant lever cap) has room for air, filled only about 1/3. The location = of the expansion tank is shown higher than everything else in the = diagram but can actually be located lower; what is important is the = connections be as shown, i.e., highest point of saturated cooling system = connects to bottom of expansion tank, expansion tank is only 1/3 full = and this is where you install the pressure cap. Attached is also a = photo of my swirl-pot/expansion-tank; note it is not the highest point = in the system; the bottom connects to the highest point (water pump = outlet); the top is connected to an tire valve for pressurization and = also the system pressure gauge. Not shown but later installed, is the = rear iron (closest to prop) was T=92d into the TOP port of the expansion = tank with 1/8=94 restrictors in hose to remove air from the engine = block. Gurgling sounds are not good; there are two o-rings per iron, per = rotor housing. The inner is the combustion o-ring and the outer is the = water-jacket o-ring. If you are getting gurgling sounds then it is = possible that coolant is getting past the compression o-ring into the = combustion chamber. This can be checked easily but removing your = exhaust, turning over the engine by hand and watching for signs of = coolant being expelled when the apex seals pass over the exhaust port. = If there is a milky film on the dip stick then it is possible that = coolant is also getting past the coolant o-ring at bottom of engine and = leaking into the oil sump. Either situation if true constitutes an = engine tear-down and rebuild. The Bruce-T video is what I used to = overhaul my engine/s. This leads to the question: =93Where did your engine come from and = what was done to it prior to installation on your project=94? Jeff From: "steve Izett" =20 Subject: start=20 Date: Sat, 24 May 2014 07:57:48 +0800=20 To: Rotary motors in aircraft = =20 =20 =20 Hi guys We are just finishing our Glasair SIIRG with a Renesis 4 port. Started her up after finishing main wiring and she burst into = life. (without prop at the moment). ~70psi oil pressure oil and water temps building. Ran it for 5 = mins or so before shutdown not wanting temps above 200. We worked out that if we lifted the tail up we could get some = more air out and water in. I have some questions/concerns: 1. Gurgling sound emanating from oil filler/breather with = white substance on the oil dip stick. Concerned water may be getting = into sump. What are the symptoms of o-ring failure? So much to learn re = rotaries. 2. If we do need to tear it down, any great sources of how to = go about it. Remembering years ago seeing Bruce T had a video? 3. We are working on an expansion tank design and wondered if = someone could share the important elements of a good cooling system = design. Looking at photos of other aircraft I=92ve seen lines to = expansion tanks from A. Rear iron port. B. Radiator tank top. etc. A. Is = height of tank significant? B. Volume required? C. How much air should = be left in the tank? D. Cap style?. So much appreciate having this list. Steve Izett Perth Western Australia =20 This message, and the documents attached hereto, is intended only = for the addressee and may contain privileged or confidential = information. Any unauthorized disclosure is strictly prohibited. If you = have received this message in error, please notify us immediately so = that we may correct our internal records. Please then delete the = original message. Thank you. -- Homepage: http://www.flyrotary.com/ Archive and UnSub: = http://mail.lancaironline.net:81/lists/flyrotary/List.html No virus found in this message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 2014.0.4592 / Virus Database: 3950/7568 - Release Date: = 05/26/14 ------=_NextPart_000_05C9_01CF7DEA.65A9CD80 Content-Type: text/html; charset="Windows-1252" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Tracy,
I hope you are doing well. I'm sorry I = could not=20 attend the fly-in at Charlie England's. I really wanted to be there with = all the=20 guys!
 
When running my Renesis powered RV -7A = on the=20 ground at idle (1600 rpm) I noticed a random tick noise in the front = bearing=20 area of the RD1 - C When prop rpm was increased to 2000 rpm the noise = went away.=20 I removed the prop output shaft and had several mechanics inspect the = bearing=20 and none thought it was bad. I have purchased a replacement bearing (MRC = #209SZZ) and still want to replace the bearing.  The bearing has a = bearing=20 retainer ring (part # 58505 R) pressed on the shaft against the = bearing. =20 The machine shop wants to heat the 58505 R retainer and press it and the = old=20 bearing off - then reuse the bearing retainer with the new bearing - is = this OK=20 or should I get a new retainer? If I need a new retainer who supplies=20 them?
 
My prop gear lash has increased from = about 3/8 in.=20 when new to about 5/8 in with 600 hrs. of run time. After disassembly of = the=20 RD1- C it appears the input shaft spline has a very small amount of play = between=20 it and the flex plate spline. Is this any problem? No noticeable play = was found=20 in the planetary gear system.
 
Thanks,
Dennis = Haverlah
----- Original Message -----
From:=20 Stephen Izett
Sent: Tuesday, May 27, 2014 = 8:11 AM
Subject: [FlyRotary] Re: Re = [Fly Rotary]:=20 start

Thanks very much Jeff
The engine is a Renesis 4 port, it was one of a batch of = Mazda=92s test=20 engines that a number of us here in Australia purchased.
We have done nothing to it internally as yet.

We have an expansion tank being welded up and when we install it=20 hopefully this weekend we will then pressure test and compression test = to=20 ascertain primary engine health parameters.

Cheers
Steve Izett




On 27 May 2014, at 8:53 pm, Jeff Whaley <flyrotary@lancaironline.net>=20 wrote:

Steve,=20 attached is the Hanover cooling system diagram =85 note all the = cooling=20 elements (radiator, hoses, filler bottle) are completely full of = glycol=20 (green); only the expansion tank (approx 1 litre, with stant lever = cap) has=20 room for air, filled only about 1/3.  The location of the = expansion=20 tank is shown higher than everything else in the diagram but can = actually be=20 located lower; what is important is the connections be as shown, = i.e.,=20 highest point of saturated cooling system connects to bottom of = expansion=20 tank, expansion tank is only 1/3 full and this is where you install = the=20 pressure cap.  Attached is also a photo of my = swirl-pot/expansion-tank;=20 note it is not the highest point in the system; the bottom connects = to the=20 highest point (water pump outlet); the top is connected to an tire = valve for=20 pressurization and also the system pressure gauge. Not shown but = later=20 installed, is the rear iron (closest to prop) was T=92d into the TOP = port of=20 the expansion tank with 1/8=94 restrictors in hose to remove air = from the=20 engine block.
Gurgling=20 sounds are not good; there are two o-rings per iron, per rotor = housing. The=20 inner is the combustion o-ring and the outer is the water-jacket=20 o-ring.  If you are getting gurgling sounds then it is possible = that=20 coolant is getting past the compression o-ring into the combustion = chamber.=20 This can be checked easily but removing your exhaust, turning over = the=20 engine by hand and watching for signs of coolant being expelled when = the=20 apex seals pass over the exhaust port.  If there is a milky = film on the=20 dip stick then it is possible that coolant is also getting past the = coolant=20 o-ring at bottom of engine and leaking into the oil sump.  = Either=20 situation if true constitutes an engine tear-down and rebuild.  = The=20 Bruce-T video is what I used to overhaul my = engine/s.
This=20 leads to the question: =93Where did your engine come from and what = was done to=20 it prior to installation on your project=94? Jeff
From: "steve=20 Izett" <flyrotary@lancaironline.net> Subject: start Date: Sat,=20 24 May 2014 07:57:48 = +0800 To: Rotary=20 motors in aircraft <flyrotary@lancaironline.net>
<image001.gif>

<image002.gif> Hi=20 guys

We are = just=20 finishing our Glasair SIIRG with a Renesis 4 port.
Started = her up=20 after finishing main wiring and she burst into life. (without = prop at=20 the moment).
~70psi = oil=20 pressure oil and water temps building. Ran it for 5 mins or so = before=20 shutdown not wanting temps above 200.
We = worked out that=20 if we lifted the tail up we could get some more air out and = water=20 in.
I have = some=20 questions/concerns:

1. = Gurgling sound=20 emanating from oil filler/breather with white substance on the = oil dip=20 stick. Concerned water may be getting into sump. What are the = symptoms=20 of o-ring failure? So much to learn re rotaries.

2. If we = do need=20 to tear it down, any great sources of how to go about it. = Remembering=20 years ago seeing Bruce T had a video?

3. We = are working=20 on an expansion tank design and wondered if someone could = share the=20 important elements of a good cooling system design. Looking at = photos=20 of other aircraft I=92ve seen lines to expansion tanks from A. = Rear iron=20 port. B. Radiator tank top. etc. A. Is height of tank = significant? B.=20 Volume required? C. How much air should be left in the tank? = D. Cap=20 style?.

So much = appreciate=20 having this list.


Steve=20 Izett
Perth = Western=20 Australia   This=20 message, and the documents attached hereto, is intended only for the = addressee and may contain privileged or confidential information. = Any=20 unauthorized disclosure is strictly prohibited. If you have received = this=20 message in error, please notify us immediately so that we may = correct our=20 internal records. Please then delete the original message. Thank = you. <Lynns=20 Plumbing.jpg><Tank2.jpg>--
Homepage: =  http://www.flyrotary.com/
Archi= ve=20 and UnSub:   http:= //mail.lancaironline.net:81/lists/flyrotary/List.html

No virus found in this=20 message.
Checked by AVG - www.avg.com
Version: 2014.0.4592 / = Virus=20 Database: 3950/7568 - Release Date: = 05/26/14

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