X-Virus-Scanned: clean according to Sophos on Logan.com Return-Path: Received: from nskntmtas06p.mx.bigpond.com ([61.9.168.152] verified) by logan.com (CommuniGate Pro SMTP 6.0.9e) with ESMTP id 6824409 for flyrotary@lancaironline.net; Fri, 11 Apr 2014 18:28:58 -0400 Received-SPF: pass receiver=logan.com; client-ip=61.9.168.152; envelope-from=neil.unger@bigpond.com Received: from nskntcmgw08p ([61.9.169.168]) by nskntmtas06p.mx.bigpond.com with ESMTP id <20140411222822.HJAL7536.nskntmtas06p.mx.bigpond.com@nskntcmgw08p> for ; Fri, 11 Apr 2014 22:28:22 +0000 Received: from UserPC ([124.184.179.181]) by nskntcmgw08p with BigPond Outbound id omUJ1n00G3vDCr801mUKZF; Fri, 11 Apr 2014 22:28:22 +0000 X-Authority-Analysis: v=2.0 cv=D6DF24tj c=1 sm=1 a=Q0teCSWE9nJErW+bcDszbg==:17 a=_Eb2_8OXJN4A:10 a=JDadKst33uMA:10 a=1IlZJK9HAAAA:8 a=3oc9M9_CAAAA:8 a=74-frODtE0DTiW7WRWYA:9 a=QEXdDO2ut3YA:10 a=U8Ie8EnqySEA:10 a=rtZyNJ3v5mkA:10 a=w7A4_GYLwL21R6wi:21 a=kRQXLAunfp_cvy5o:21 a=pGLkceISAAAA:8 a=Ia-xEzejAAAA:8 a=KMtL2SfkPMJvruJFxs8A:9 a=_W_S_7VecoQA:10 a=MSl-tDqOz04A:10 a=EzXvWhQp4_cA:10 a=Q0teCSWE9nJErW+bcDszbg==:117 Message-ID: <7F3F85CD3855456DAA3CBADA0811B967@UserPC> From: "Neil Unger" To: "Rotary motors in aircraft" References: In-Reply-To: Subject: Re: [FlyRotary] Re: Switcheroo from turbo to not Date: Sat, 12 Apr 2014 08:28:05 +1000 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_000B_01CF5629.207A7D60" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Importance: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Windows Live Mail 15.4.3555.308 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V15.4.3555.308 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_000B_01CF5629.207A7D60 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Your EGT is interesting. I could easily get up to 1850 degrees at WOT. = over about 5 hours I managed to burn out 2 sets of EGT probes due to = heat. Then I managed to stuff up Tracy;s ECU which mandated a return = for repair. While waiting for it=E2=80=99s return I had the offer of a = different ECU. Once wired in and set I found that the max EGT that I = now get is 1725 degrees. Nothing else has been changed. The only = difference between this unit and Tracy=E2=80=99s is that this has a = trigger box which I suspect gets the spark away just that fraction = quicker and may in fact make the spark advanced over Tracy=E2=80=99s. = The new unit sits at 27 degrees BTDC at WOT. Would like Tracy to chime = in on this one as my expertise is mechanical, certainly not electrical. = It may also be imagination, but the exhaust seems quieter. Neil. From: Mark Steitle=20 Sent: Saturday, April 12, 2014 8:14 AM To: Rotary motors in aircraft=20 Subject: [FlyRotary] Re: Switcheroo from turbo to not Sounds like a prudent plan to me. Sent from my iPad On Apr 11, 2014, at 4:51 PM, shipchief@aol.com wrote: I went out to the Hangar last Tuesday to start installing the = intercooler. Well, at least to fit a few tubes and hoses, then hold up = some parts and make plans. As I took the air discharge tube off the compressor, I noticed the = whole turbo compressor & bearing assembly wiggling around on the turbine = housing! I checked all the mounting bolts and clips, everything was tight.=20 So I took the turbo off the engine, and realized that I probably = cooked the turbine housing. I did see EGT excursions to 1800F. What's = worse, I had a new turbo blanket. I think a heat shield would have been = better, so some cooling air could pass over the housing, but still block = radiant heat. Bummer.=20 So I decided to go with Plan B: I ordered the bits and tube bends to = switch to naturally aspirated operation. I'm keeping the exhaust header = that the turbo sat upon, and replacing everything else past the bottom = of the firewall, to the new pipe & muffler I recently added. I'm retaining the ability to 'Go Turbo' later, but I've become curious = about what the turbo must boost to equal full throttle of 'Naturally = Aspirated'. I did build and have been running a tuned intake manifold. The exhaust = won't be a tuned header, but it is pretty good, possibly better than the = stock exhaust reactor and a whole lot lighter. It has port discharge = nozzles (reversion cones) EGT probes and a gentle sweeping shape. Plus = it's proven strong while carrying the weight of the turbo beyond 1800F, = and it passed inspection. I trust it. So I hope to run it, find the performance satisfactory, the fuel = consumption significantly reduced, and use 87 octane ethanol free mogas = instead of 92. (low compression rotors) Also, I can advance the timing to the NA spec. =20 Anyone see a problem or have advise? ------=_NextPart_000_000B_01CF5629.207A7D60 Content-Type: text/html; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Your EGT is interesting.  I could easily get up to 1850 = degrees at=20 WOT.  over about 5 hours I managed to burn out 2 sets of EGT probes = due to=20 heat.  Then I managed to stuff up Tracy;s ECU which mandated a = return for=20 repair.  While waiting for it=E2=80=99s return I had the offer of a = different=20 ECU.  Once wired in and set I found that the max EGT that I now get = is 1725=20 degrees.  Nothing else has been changed.  The only difference = between=20 this unit and Tracy=E2=80=99s is that this has a trigger box which I = suspect gets the=20 spark away just that fraction quicker and may in fact make the spark = advanced=20 over Tracy=E2=80=99s.  The new unit sits at 27 degrees BTDC = at  WOT. =20 Would like Tracy to chime in on this one as my expertise is mechanical,=20 certainly not electrical.   It may also be  imagination, = but the=20 exhaust seems quieter.   Neil.
 
Sent: Saturday, April 12, 2014 8:14 AM
Subject: [FlyRotary] Re: Switcheroo from turbo to=20 not
 
Sounds like a prudent plan to me.

Sent from my iPad

On Apr 11, 2014, at 4:51 PM, shipchief@aol.com = wrote:

I went out to the = Hangar last=20 Tuesday to start installing the intercooler. Well, at least to fit a = few tubes=20 and hoses, then hold up some parts and make plans.
As I took the air discharge tube off the compressor, I noticed = the whole=20 turbo compressor & bearing assembly wiggling around on the turbine = housing!
I checked all the mounting bolts and clips, everything was tight. =
So I took the turbo off the engine, and realized that I probably = cooked=20 the turbine housing. I did see EGT excursions to 1800F. What's worse, = I had a=20 new turbo blanket. I think a heat shield would have been better, so = some=20 cooling air could pass over the housing, but still block radiant = heat.
Bummer.
So I decided to go with Plan B: I ordered the bits and tube bends = to=20 switch to naturally aspirated operation. I'm keeping the exhaust = header that=20 the turbo sat upon, and replacing everything else past the bottom of = the=20 firewall, to the new pipe & muffler I recently added.
I'm retaining the ability to 'Go Turbo' later, but I've become = curious=20 about what the turbo must boost to equal full throttle of 'Naturally=20 Aspirated'.
I did build and have been running a tuned intake manifold. The = exhaust=20 won't be a tuned header, but it is pretty good, possibly better than = the stock=20 exhaust reactor and a whole lot lighter. It has port discharge nozzles = (reversion cones) EGT probes and a gentle sweeping shape. Plus it's = proven=20 strong while carrying the weight of the turbo beyond 1800F, and it = passed=20 inspection. I trust it.
So I hope to run it, find the performance satisfactory, the fuel=20 consumption significantly reduced, and use 87 octane ethanol free = mogas=20 instead of 92. (low compression rotors)
Also, I can advance the timing to the NA spec. 
Anyone see a problem or have=20 advise?
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