X-Virus-Scanned: clean according to Sophos on Logan.com Return-Path: Received: from [64.129.170.194] (HELO VIRCOM1.fcdata.private) by logan.com (CommuniGate Pro SMTP 5.4.0) with ESMTP id 5052582 for flyrotary@lancaironline.net; Fri, 15 Jul 2011 05:32:13 -0400 Received-SPF: none receiver=logan.com; client-ip=64.129.170.194; envelope-from=cbarber@texasattorney.net Received: from FCD-MAIL06.FCDATA.PRIVATE ([fe80::697f:d6aa:b87:78d8]) by FCD-MAIL05.FCDATA.PRIVATE ([fe80::809d:a06e:5913:452e%13]) with mapi id 14.01.0289.001; Fri, 15 Jul 2011 04:31:18 -0500 From: Chris Barber To: Rotary motors in aircraft Subject: RE: [FlyRotary] Re: Oil Pressure Again Thread-Topic: [FlyRotary] Re: Oil Pressure Again Thread-Index: AQHMQsTkbAwAcuzOlUaihnno7wsU/ZTtGV2+ Date: Fri, 15 Jul 2011 09:31:01 +0000 Message-ID: <2D41F9BF3B5F9842B164AF93214F3D307DC68431@FCD-MAIL06.FCDATA.PRIVATE> References: In-Reply-To: Accept-Language: en-US Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: x-originating-ip: [99.98.105.202] Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="_000_2D41F9BF3B5F9842B164AF93214F3D307DC68431FCDMAIL06FCDATA_" MIME-Version: 1.0 --_000_2D41F9BF3B5F9842B164AF93214F3D307DC68431FCDMAIL06FCDATA_ Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable William, et al, Trust me, I would love to think it is a sender but I bought a mechanical ga= ge the other day with the same results as the EM2. I will likely pull the engine this weekend (I work late tomorrow). I alrea= dy pulled the prop. I will check the pick up. I do have a half inch exten= sion but because I knew it could be a problem I was focused on getting a go= od seal and it is safety wired on, as is the front pressure port. Since the engine will be off and easier to work with, I will check the fron= t cover stuff again. Is there a test on testing the oil pump while it is o= ff the engine? As Lynn mentioned I will be looking for sparkles in the pan and will open u= p the oil filter too. Again, I am speculating that it may be the front bea= rings as it was the one part that was not well in spec. I could be complet= ely wrong. I do not relish the idea of just replacing parts without cause.= ...the gear with bushing installed I think is $102 from Mazdatrix....it is = always something. Not wanting to aimlessly replacing parts is the reason that I am once again= asking for thoughts. It seems as if I have eliminated most issues; oil pr= essure ports, front one safety wired, chain, bent washer, o-ring/silicon ri= ng at front cover, safety wired pick up and sealed 1/2 inch extension, key.= ....and now the bearings. So, please, share what I may be missing that may= cause this type of low pressure since I will be looking over the next seve= ral days. Also, I did just check the rotor oil seals and rotar parts when = I replaced the apex seals and springs a couple of months ago following a de= tonation event. I could be discouraged but that may go against my Taurus stubborn nature. = Ok, not stubborn , or so I hope, but persistent and becoming educated. = And, as always, the ground is the place to discover this stuff and why we g= round test and test and test. Test it until it doesn't fail, test it a lit= tle more, then fly. And on a positive not, except for the pesky low oil pressure (yeah, a reall= y big pesky little problem) the engine has been starting a running strong a= nd smooth as hell. Chris ________________________________ From: Rotary motors in aircraft [flyrotary@lancaironline.net] on behalf of = William Wilson [fluffysheap@gmail.com] Sent: Friday, July 15, 2011 2:57 AM To: Rotary motors in aircraft Subject: [FlyRotary] Re: Oil Pressure Again I had a sending unit go bad once and do this. It didn't just read zero lik= e you expect, it just kept showing less and less pressure. It was about a = decade old at the time. On Thu, Jul 14, 2011 at 5:46 PM, Chris Barber > wrote: I hesitate asking about this again, but I am too close to possibly flying t= o drop the ball too much now. I have a drop in oil pressure again. It has= dropped from the high 60's or so to between 20 psi to 40 psi (20 to 30 at = lower RPM and only up to around 40+ as I increase power). My first thought was that it was the front o-ring and silicone ring in the = front cover. So, I pulled the front pan and replaced it. I also was able t= o check the front pressure port and the oil pump chain/key/washer etc and a= ll was good. I am about to have to pull the engine to check the bottom of the engine for= the oil pick up and rear port (after checking the hoses, but I would think= ing a blockage, depending on where it is, would increase pressure). One of= the disadvantages of the Conversion Concepts mount is that I pretty much h= ave to pull the engine to check the bottom end. My question is, other than the mentioned items, what else could cause this = sort of drop. I have hooked up a mechanical pressure gage (instead of the = RWS EM2). My concern is that it may be the front bearing as it was the onl= y part I recall being closer to being out of spec. I hate the idea of havi= ng to tear down the engine again to replace this part especially since the = engine is running all but perfectly and I was doing squawks preparing for m= y DAR inspection before this issue crept up. Also, even though I can't think of a way, is there any way to replace the f= ront stationary gear/bearing without cracking the engine...just had to ask = as I am not really liking the idea of cracking open the engine again, even = though I am getting a bit too good at it....but apparently not well enough = to make it actually work right. As opposed to mucking around with red hearings and wild goose chases, I fig= ured I would just ask again. And yes, I have been reviewing the archives a= lready. TIA Thanks Chris Barber Houston. --_000_2D41F9BF3B5F9842B164AF93214F3D307DC68431FCDMAIL06FCDATA_ Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

William, et al,

 

Trust me, I would love to think it is a sender but I bought a mechanical= gage the other day with the same results as the EM2

 

I will likely pull the engine this weekend (I work late tomorrow). = I already pulled the prop.  I will check the pick up.  I do have= a half inch extension but because I knew it could be a problem I was focus= ed on getting a good seal and it is safety wired on, as is the front pressure port. 

 

Since the engine will be off and easier to work with, I will check the f= ront cover stuff again.  Is there a test on testing the oil pump while= it is off the engine?

 

As Lynn mentioned I will be looking for sparkles in the pan and will ope= n up the oil filter too.  Again, I am speculating that it may be the f= ront bearings as it was the one part that was not well in spec.  I cou= ld be completely wrong.  I do not relish the idea of just replacing parts without cause....the gear with bushi= ng installed I think is $102 from Mazdatrix....it is alw= ays something.

 

Not wanting to aimlessly replacing parts is the reason that I am once ag= ain asking for thoughts.  It seems as if I have eliminated= most issues; oil pressure ports, front one safety wired, chain, bent washe= r, o-ring/silicon ring at front cover, safety wired pick up and sealed 1/2 inch extension, key.....and now the bearings.=   So, please, share what I may be missing that may cause this typ= e of low pressure since I will be looking over the next several d= ays.  Also, I did just check the rotor oil seals a= nd rotar parts when I replaced the apex seals and springs a couple of months ago fo= llowing a detonation event.

 

I could be discouraged but that may go against my Tauru= s stubborn nature.  Ok, not stubborn <g>= , or so I hope, but persistent and becoming educate= d.  And, as always, the ground is the place to discover= this stuff and why we ground test and test and test.  Test it until it doesn't fail= , test it a little more, then fly.

 

And on a positive not, except for the pesky low oil pressure (yeah, a re= ally big pesky little problem) the engine has been starting a running stron= g and smooth as hell.

 

Chris 

From: Rotary motors in aircraft [flyrotary@l= ancaironline.net] on behalf of William Wilson [fluffysheap@gmail.com]
Sent: Friday, July 15, 2011 2:57 AM
To: Rotary motors in aircraft
Subject: [FlyRotary] Re: Oil Pressure Again

I had a sending unit go bad once and do this.  It didn't just rea= d zero like you expect, it just kept showing less and less pressure.  = It was about a decade old at the time.

On Thu, Jul 14, 2011 at 5:46 PM, Chris Barber <cbarber@= texasattorney.net> wrote:

I hesitate asking about this again, but I am too close to possibly flyin= g to drop the ball too much now.  I have a drop in oil pressure again.=   It has dropped from the high 60's or so to= between 20 psi to 40 psi (20 to 30 at lower RPM and only up to around 40+ as I increase power).

 

My first thought was that it was the front o-ring and silicone ring in t= he front cover. So, I pulled the front pan and replaced it.  I also wa= s able to check the front pressure port and the oil pump chain/key/washer e= tc and all was good.

 

I am about to have to pull the engine to check the bottom of the engine = for the oil pick up and rear port (after checking the hoses, but I wou= ld thinking a blockage, depending on where it is, would = increase pressure).  One of the disadvantages of the Conversion Concepts mount is that I pretty much have to pull the en= gine to check the bottom end.

 

My question is, other than the mentioned items, what else could cause th= is sort of drop.  I have hooked up a mechanical pre= ssure gage (instead of the RWS EM2<= a>).  My concern is that it may be the front bearing as it was the only part I recall being closer to being out of spec= .  I hate the idea of having to tear down the engine again to replace = this part especially since the engine is running all but= perfectly and I was doing squawks preparing for my DAR inspection before this issue crept up.

 

Also, even though I can't think of a way, is there any way to replace th= e front stationary gear/bearing without cracking the eng= ine...just had to ask as I am not really liking the idea of cracking open t= he engine again, even though I am getting a bit too good at it....but apparently not well enough = to make it actually work right.

 

As opposed to mucking around with red hearings and wi= ld goose chases, I figured I would just ask again.  And yes, I have be= en reviewing the archives already.

 

TIA

 

Thanks

 

Chris Barber

Houston.


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