X-Virus-Scanned: clean according to Sophos on Logan.com Return-Path: Received: from [64.129.170.194] (HELO VIRCOM1.fcdata.private) by logan.com (CommuniGate Pro SMTP 5.3.11) with ESMTP id 4651577 for flyrotary@lancaironline.net; Wed, 22 Dec 2010 18:19:14 -0500 Received-SPF: none receiver=logan.com; client-ip=64.129.170.194; envelope-from=cbarber@texasattorney.net Received: from FCD-MAIL06.FCDATA.PRIVATE ([fe80::697f:d6aa:b87:78d8]) by FCD-MAIL05.FCDATA.PRIVATE ([fe80::809d:a06e:5913:452e%15]) with mapi id 14.01.0218.012; Wed, 22 Dec 2010 17:15:39 -0600 From: Chris Barber To: Rotary motors in aircraft CC: Rotary motors in aircraft Subject: Re: [FlyRotary] Re: 13B Turbo Manifold Thread-Topic: [FlyRotary] Re: 13B Turbo Manifold Thread-Index: AQHLoh1G4lF/hCjeOk6x6T/0iaHsCJOtGOjd Date: Wed, 22 Dec 2010 23:18:29 +0000 Message-ID: References: In-Reply-To: Accept-Language: en-US Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="_000_DFF05C396BEF4F1997668885E74D6325texasattorneynet_" MIME-Version: 1.0 --_000_DFF05C396BEF4F1997668885E74D6325texasattorneynet_ Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable I started with a similar header but have had it heavily modified to fit bel= ow the Mistal intake on my pusher. Sent from my iPhone 4 On Dec 22, 2010, at 3:14 PM, "Bill Bradburry" > wrote: Those SS headers are actually pretty cheap. I wonder what they would charg= e to build a header that goes in the wrong direction like is required for t= ractor planes. Bill B ________________________________ From: Rotary motors in aircraft [mailto:flyrotary@lancaironline.net] On Beh= alf Of Kelly Troyer Sent: Wednesday, December 22, 2010 4:10 PM To: Rotary motors in aircraft Subject: [FlyRotary] Re: 13B Turbo Manifold Ernest you make my head hurt !!...............Now I have to be a "Metallurg= ist"...............<:) Kelly Troyer "DYKE DELTA JD2" (Eventually) "13B ROTARY"_ Engine "RWS"_RD1C/EC2/EM2 "MISTRAL"_Backplate/Oil Manifold "TURBONETICS"_TO4E50 Turbo ________________________________ From: Ernest Christley > To: Rotary motors in aircraft > Sent: Wed, December 22, 2010 2:35:58 PM Subject: [FlyRotary] Re: 13B Turbo Manifold Kelly Troyer wrote: > Ernest, > Not sure what you mean by "Welds not cleaned up"...........All I see= on these "TIG" welds is > a slight discoloration at the edge of the weld bead caused by the arc hea= t.. The first link of a Google search on "stainless steel welding corrosion" wa= s http://www.mcnallyinst= itute.com/04-html/4-1.html From that site: INTERGRANULAR CORROSION All austenitic stainless steels (the 300 series, the types that "work harde= n") contain a small amount of carbon in solution in the austenite. Carbon i= s precipitated out at the grain boundaries, of the steel, in the temperatur= e range of 1050=B0 F. (565=B0 C) to 1600=B0 F. (870=B0 C.). This is a typic= al temperature range during the welding of stainless steel. This carbon combines with the chrome in the stainless steel to form chromiu= m carbide, starving the adjacent areas of the chrome they need for corrosio= n protection. In the presence of some strong corrosives an electrochemical = action is initiated between the chrome rich and chrome poor areas with the = areas low in chrome becoming attacked. The grain boundaries are then dissol= ved and become non existent. There are three ways to combat this: * Anneal the stainless after it has been heated in this sensitive range= . This means bringing it up to the proper annealing temperature and then qu= ickly cooling it down through the sensitive temperature range to prevent th= e carbides from forming. * When possible use low carbon content stainless if you intend to do an= y welding on it. A carbon content of less than 0.3% will not precipitate in= to a continuous film of chrome carbide at the grain boundaries. 316L is as = good example of a low carbon stainless steel. * Alloy the metal with a strong carbide former. The best is columbium, = but sometimes titanium is used. The carbon will now form columbium carbide = rather than going after the chrome to form chrome carbide. The material is = now said to be "stabilized" They could have used a filler that made post treatment unnecessary, or they= could have annealed it. The link you gave says it is made of T304. Depen= ding on which T304, the carbon ranges from .03 to .08%, so it may not be an= issue at all. -- Homepage: http://www.flyrotary.com/ Archive and UnSub: http://mail.lancaironline.net:81/lists/flyrotary/List.html --_000_DFF05C396BEF4F1997668885E74D6325texasattorneynet_ Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
I started with a similar header but have had it heavily modified to fi= t below the Mistal intake on my pusher. 

Sent from my iPhone 4

On Dec 22, 2010, at 3:14 PM, "Bill Bradburry" <bbradburry@bellsouth.net> wrote:

Those SS headers are actually pretty c= heap.  I wonder what they would charge to build a header that goes in = the wrong direction like is required for tractor planes. 

 

Bill B

 

From: Rota= ry motors in aircraft [mailto:flyrotary@lancaironline.net] On Behalf Of Kelly Troyer Sent: Wednesday, December 22= , 2010 4:10 PM
To: Rotary motors in aircraf= t
Subject: [FlyRotary] Re: 13B= Turbo Manifold

 

Ernest you make my head hurt !!...............Now I have= to be a "Metallurgist"...............<:)
 

Kelly Troyer
"DYKE DELTA JD2" (Eventually)= =

"13B ROTARY"_ Engine
"RWS"_RD1C/EC2/EM2
"MISTRAL"_Backplate/Oil Manifold

"TURBONETICS"_TO4E50 Turbo

 

 

From: Erne= st Christley <echristley@att.net>
To: Rotary motors in aircraf= t <flyrotary@lancaironlin= e.net>
Sent: Wed, December 22, 2010= 2:35:58 PM
Subject: [FlyRotary] Re: 13B= Turbo Manifold

Kelly Troyer wrote:
> Ernest,
>      Not sure what you mean by "Welds not cleaned = up"...........All I see on these "TIG" welds is
> a slight discoloration at the edge of the weld bead caused by the arc = heat..

The first link of a Google search on "stainless steel welding corrosio= n" was http://www= .mcnallyinstitute.com/04-html/4-1.html

From that site:

INTERGRANULAR CORROSION

All austenitic stainless steels (the 300 series, the types that "work = harden") contain a small amount of carbon in solution in the austenite= . Carbon is precipitated out at the grain boundaries, of the steel, in the = temperature range of 1050=B0 F. (565=B0 C) to 1600=B0 F. (870=B0 C.). This is a typical temperature range during the wel= ding of stainless steel.

This carbon combines with the chrome in the stainless steel to form chromiu= m carbide, starving the adjacent areas of the chrome they need for corrosio= n protection. In the presence of some strong corrosives an electrochemical = action is initiated between the chrome rich and chrome poor areas with the areas low in chrome becoming at= tacked. The grain boundaries are then dissolved and become non existent. Th= ere are three ways to combat this:

    * Anneal the stainless after it has been heated in this sensi= tive range. This means bringing it up to the proper annealing temperature a= nd then quickly cooling it down through the sensitive temperature range to = prevent the carbides from forming.
    * When possible use low carbon content stainless if you inten= d to do any welding on it. A carbon content of less than 0.3% will not prec= ipitate into a continuous film of chrome carbide at the grain boundaries. 3= 16L is as good example of a low carbon stainless steel.
    * Alloy the metal with a strong carbide former. The best is c= olumbium, but sometimes titanium is used. The carbon will now form columbiu= m carbide rather than going after the chrome to form chrome carbide. The ma= terial is now said to be "stabilized"

They could have used a filler that made post treatment unnecessary, or they= could have annealed it.  The link you gave says it is made of T304.&n= bsp; Depending on which T304, the carbon ranges from .03 to .08%, so it may= not be an issue at all.


--
Homepage:  http://www.flyrotary.com/
Archive and UnSub:  = http://mail.lancaironline.net:81/lists/flyrotary/List.html

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