X-Virus-Scanned: clean according to Sophos on Logan.com Return-Path: Received: from bay0-omc2-s14.bay0.hotmail.com ([65.54.190.89] verified) by logan.com (CommuniGate Pro SMTP 5.3.8) with ESMTP id 4417648 for flyrotary@lancaironline.net; Tue, 03 Aug 2010 18:17:30 -0400 Received-SPF: pass receiver=logan.com; client-ip=65.54.190.89; envelope-from=stol83001@live.com Received: from BAY143-W8 ([65.54.190.125]) by bay0-omc2-s14.bay0.hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.4675); Tue, 3 Aug 2010 15:16:55 -0700 Message-ID: Return-Path: stol83001@live.com Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="_fa8b448b-729a-45fd-ac13-31cb9c990c2e_" X-Originating-IP: [75.174.174.132] From: ben haas To: Subject: RE: [FlyRotary] Re: Bad rotary week Date: Tue, 3 Aug 2010 16:16:55 -0600 Importance: Normal In-Reply-To: References: MIME-Version: 1.0 X-OriginalArrivalTime: 03 Aug 2010 22:16:55.0492 (UTC) FILETIME=[94FD3840:01CB3359] --_fa8b448b-729a-45fd-ac13-31cb9c990c2e_ Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable I agree with Tracy on this. You need to add apples to apples to get any ki= nd of logical comparison. =20 On my V-8 conversion I often get the " it's too heavy" comment from the Lyc= /Cont crowd. I politely point out the Lyc stated weight=2C 307 lbs=2C is fo= r a bare 0-360. A lot of people assume that's the installed weight. They ar= e so wrong. =20 =20 Fact...... I personally removed a 0-360 Lycoming with a two blade constant = speed prop right out of a Piper. I simply removed the mount from the firew= all with an engine hoist and a certified scale hooked to the engine/prop c= ombo=2C and left EVERY thing it took to fly the plane. ie=2C Motor=2C star= ter=2C alt=2C baffles=2C exhaust system=2C fuel system=2C brackets=2C prop= =2C governer=2C you name it. It was weighed just as it came off the airfra= me.......... =20 457 lbs. !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! =20 That's a LONG way from 307 lbs. Ben Haas www.haaspowerair.com =20 To: flyrotary@lancaironline.net Date: Tue=2C 3 Aug 2010 11:54:16 -0400 From: tracy@rotaryaviation.com Subject: [FlyRotary] Re: Bad rotary week Nope=2C that's weight of engine and required systems (cooling=2C redrive=2C= alternator & starter). . Trying to define it in the same way that Lycoming defines their engine w= eight for comparison purposes. eng mount=2C brackets=2C ducts=2C prop=2C m= ounting hardware=2C exhaust system=2C etc must be added for FWF weight. Tracy On Tue=2C Aug 3=2C 2010 at 10:44 AM=2C Kelly Troyer wrote: Tracy=2C =20 Is 260 lbs your firewall forward weight ??................... =20 Kelly Troyer "Dyke Delta"_13B ROTARY Engine "RWS"_RD1C/EC2/EM2 "Mistral"_Backplate/Oil Manifold=20 From: Tracy Crook To: Rotary motors in aircraft Sent: Mon=2C August 2=2C 2010 8:29:31 PM Subject: [FlyRotary] Re: Bad rotary week Hi Dwayne=2C I estimate I'm getting about 200 HP at 7200 rpm on the Renesis. 230 is = probably the best you are likely to get when normally aspirated and then yo= u will need to turn it a bit faster. I went all out for weight reduction o= n my RV-4 so the engine & systems came out around 260 lbs. OTOH=2C I'm getting about 270 effortless HP from the 20B at 6250 rpm. Shou= ld get 300 if turned to 7000. This install weighs about 90 pounds more th= an the Renesis though. Tracy=20 = --_fa8b448b-729a-45fd-ac13-31cb9c990c2e_ Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable I =3B agree with Tracy on this. You need to add apples to apples to get= any kind of logical comparison.
 =3B
On my V-8 conversion I often get the " it's too heavy" comment from =3B= the Lyc/Cont crowd. I politely point out the Lyc stated weight=2C 307 = =3Blbs=2C =3Bis for a bare 0-360. A lot of people assume that's the ins= talled weight. They are so wrong. =3B
 =3B
Fact...... I personally removed a 0-360 Lycoming with a two blade constant = speed prop right out of a Piper. =3B I simply removed the mount from th= e firewall =3B with an engine hoist and a certified scale hooked to the= engine/prop combo=2C and left EVERY thing it took to fly the plane. ie=2C&= nbsp=3B Motor=2C starter=2C alt=2C baffles=2C exhaust system=2C fuel system= =2C brackets=2C prop=2C governer=2C you name it. =3B It =3Bwas weig= hed just as it came off the airframe..........
 =3B
457 lbs. !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
 =3B
That's a LONG way from 307 lbs.

Ben Haas
www.haaspowerair.com



 =3B
To: flyrotary@lancaironline.net
Date: Tue=2C 3 Aug 2010 11:54:16 -0400From: tracy@rotaryaviation.com
Subject: [FlyRotary] Re: Bad rotary wee= k

Nope=2C that's weight of engine and required systems (cooling=2C r= edrive=2C alternator &=3B starter).

. =3B Trying to define it= in the same way that Lycoming defines their engine weight for comparison p= urposes. =3B eng mount=2C brackets=2C ducts=2C prop=2C mounting hardwar= e=2C exhaust system=2C etc must be added for FWF weight.

Tracy
On Tue=2C Aug 3=2C 2010 at 10:44 AM=2C Kelly Tr= oyer <=3Bkeltro@att.net= >=3B wrote:
Tracy=2C
 =3B =3B =3B
 =3B =3B =3B =3B Is =3B260 lbs your=  =3Bfirewall forward weight ??...................
 =3B
Kelly Troyer
"Dyke Delta"_13B ROTARY Engine
"RWS"_RD1C= /EC2/EM2
"Mistral"_Backplate/Oil Manifold


From: Tracy Crook <=3Btracy@rotaryaviation.com>=3B=
To: Rotary motors in ai= rcraft <=3Bflyrotary@lanca= ironline.net>=3B
Sent:= Mon=2C August 2=2C 2010 8:29:31 PM
Subject: [FlyRotary] Re: Bad rotary week

Hi D= wayne=2C
 =3B =3B I estimate I'm getting about 200 HP at 7200 rp= m on the Renesis. =3B 230 is probably the best you are likely to get wh= en normally aspirated and then you will need to turn it a bit faster. = =3B I went all out for weight reduction on my RV-4 so the engine &=3B sy= stems came out around 260 lbs.

OTOH=2C I'm getting about 270 effortl= ess HP from the 20B at 6250 rpm. =3B Should get 300 if turned to 7000. =  =3B This install weighs about 90 pounds more than the Renesis though.<= BR>
Tracy


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