X-Virus-Scanned: clean according to Sophos on Logan.com Return-Path: Received: from web46402.mail.sp1.yahoo.com ([68.180.199.191] verified) by logan.com (CommuniGate Pro SMTP 5.3.8) with SMTP id 4417433 for flyrotary@lancaironline.net; Tue, 03 Aug 2010 16:19:39 -0400 Received-SPF: none receiver=logan.com; client-ip=68.180.199.191; envelope-from=dwayneparkinson@yahoo.com Received: (qmail 33189 invoked by uid 60001); 3 Aug 2010 20:19:04 -0000 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=yahoo.com; s=s1024; t=1280866744; bh=RIbzgElBzHgZFf34fAz5N6dqfZyxe32Ml9eSieXjyuI=; h=Message-ID:X-YMail-OSG:Received:X-Mailer:References:Date:From:Subject:To:In-Reply-To:MIME-Version:Content-Type; b=PVZX5S5R17LMsL1+wYjsWPbs1c/OvePuoIs62DWMeg89QoPGWPW8afR2hhJFDcXO03oQqujCPdtLJJoaWE0E3MeCUP1NIeSGZCFmf4FAJ6FbU/mk2MII4VNh/OGpnHsPKVUtT91bOgDTEzEKGSkYyibADzYaD2BQTDIThYdXqmY= DomainKey-Signature:a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=s1024; d=yahoo.com; h=Message-ID:X-YMail-OSG:Received:X-Mailer:References:Date:From:Subject:To:In-Reply-To:MIME-Version:Content-Type; b=nGCRm4Y8kbcj90T00WmI8zt1vDsqEfLGQ6Xo0LO5Y1Dec8gEqomDXpli9PQ0ftAk12SiyoSycspqRI6IIF545FK2gII9k9p+7LW2fLYAbHFMTkihPYH7M1tOGY3TFGkdHxfLdO3FAaMe05sQg1AF0XE9D1ka58q0ZEBQxrbIMjA=; Message-ID: <437281.33072.qm@web46402.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> X-YMail-OSG: xx8ceD8VM1mVONouSfxtuo2OOIIYte5xOiKk1BtxY3zn8BO eANKBiLwrPwfMwuZe1FnWgHjZMz1Hlu17Tk1AOB.OTtnrsuDfh1gZ6X3gSd5 lxVpiyR9zV7W6e.d9_XkwnWgEI0M5c89Iuth92_DaF9sJ2KOkBu9ORJ5el4Z 3Y4fYgzDpU4PhzypK7SV4IGfQDM8toYoKjUHD60ZqziRAkRgIZnHDl5maBqP x3QXsqrE8PwOBfI3jYdXwhc4cv0EiA1uMwKjpToDOggPCCqUQNeARSofXEX7 4wqF5bNLBGPVwDfxoz2kd9MltvBjNP_dA5d_pN9.IehoQpugj Received: from [24.177.130.10] by web46402.mail.sp1.yahoo.com via HTTP; Tue, 03 Aug 2010 13:19:04 PDT X-Mailer: YahooMailRC/420.4 YahooMailWebService/0.8.105.279950 References: Date: Tue, 3 Aug 2010 13:19:04 -0700 (PDT) From: Dwayne Parkinson Subject: Re: [FlyRotary] Re: Bad rotary week To: Rotary motors in aircraft In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="0-693449254-1280866744=:33072" --0-693449254-1280866744=:33072 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Lightweight carbon steel housings? Where exactly do I find those? ________________________________ From: George Lendich To: Rotary motors in aircraft Sent: Mon, August 2, 2010 7:14:41 PM Subject: [FlyRotary] Re: Bad rotary week Dwayne, Just some thoughts, please don't consider me an expert. I believe you have a couple of options, a 20B should give you approx 270hp ( or 90 hp x 3 rotors) in basic configuration, some of the 20B builders can confirm this or otherwise. Parts should be not that hard to get once the housings development is complete. You can get the 3 rotor crank in a number of outlets. You should be able to build a 20B with the light carbon steel housings replacing the heavy cast steel housings, for about the same weight as a 13B. That would be nice. The light carbon steel housings are designed for PP, that could give you as much as 360hp in a 20B, if you design for optimum HP or less using lower compression rotors. A 2 rotor 13B -PP might get you 250hp then again might not however I feel it would give you the 230 hp. A 2 rotor PP with NOS would get you the take-off power required. I believe that currently being done by someone. Then there's the Turbo, which you know about. Just remember to consider all options. George ( down under) Bobby / Tracy - Do either of you know what HP your Renesis is generating? I'm very curious about the supercharged Renesis. If you know the installed weight that would be great info too? > > >George - I'm building a Bearhawk on floats and would like 250+ HP. > > >Anyone who cares - I currently fly a Stinson 108-1 behind a Franklin 150 so >I'm painfully aware of how hard it is to come by parts for unique engines. > That makes the 20B much less appealing as an option for me. That being >said, I watched from the Sea Plane Base at Oshkosh as an Aeronca Sedan with >145 HP lumbered across Lake Winnebago trying to get off the water. People >actually cheered when he finally broke a float free. I think he was in >Appleton's airspace by the time he got into air (no, I'm not kidding either). > That type of performance just won't cut it so anything less than 230 HP is >not an option for me either. > > >Thanks very much. > > >Dwayne > > > > > > > ________________________________ From: Bobby J. Hughes >To: Rotary motors in aircraft >Sent: Mon, August 2, 2010 6:33:36 PM >Subject: [FlyRotary] Re: Bad rotary week > > >Dwayne, > >My super charged renesis uses 1 oz per gallon of 2 stroke oil. So it's very >likely David is using 1 quart every 5 hours. Question is 2-stroke or sump? No >indication I am using any sump oil. But I only have about 35 flight hours. I >do have a small internal coolant leak and need to replace an o-ring when my >fiberglass work is finished. I would choose the renesis side port exhaust >over a peripheral port exhaust any day for our application. > > >Bobby Hughes > > ________________________________ From: Rotary motors in aircraft [mailto:flyrotary@lancaironline.net] On Behalf Of Dwayne Parkinson >Sent: Monday, August 02, 2010 4:43 PM >To: Rotary motors in aircraft >Subject: [FlyRotary] Bad rotary week > > >For anyone hoping that a 16X would show up any time soon: not ... gonna ... >happen. No RX7 and the RX8 is still powered by the Renesis for 2011. > > >http://www.mazdausamedia.com/content/2011-mazda-vehicles-glance > > >As if that's not bad enough, when I was at Oshkosh I took in David Atkins >rotary seminar. I came away pretty depressed thinking that I probably won't >put a rotary engine in my airplane. Is everyone else really using 1 quart of >oil every 5 hours? He also didn't have much good to say about the Renesis >in an aviation application which leads me to conclude that the 16X will fare >even worse in aviation applications as it is tweaked to meet higher EPA >requirements and produce more low end torque. > > >Is anyone but Tracy using a Renesis? I'd really like to know what HP you're >getting, what the fuel burn is and how it's holding up. > > >Thanks, > > >Dwayne > > >P.S. I couldn't find any rotary planes on the field at Oshkosh. Perhaps >they sank into the mud. > > > > > > > > > > --0-693449254-1280866744=:33072 Content-Type: text/html; charset=us-ascii
Lightweight carbon steel housings?  Where exactly do I find those?

From: George Lendich <lendich@aanet.com.au>
To: Rotary motors in aircraft <flyrotary@lancaironline.net>
Sent: Mon, August 2, 2010 7:14:41 PM
Subject: [FlyRotary] Re: Bad rotary week

 Dwayne,
Just some thoughts, please don't consider me an expert.
 
I believe you have a couple of options, a 20B should give you approx 270hp ( or 90 hp x 3 rotors) in basic configuration, some of the 20B builders can confirm this or otherwise. Parts should be not that hard to get once the housings development is complete. You can get the 3 rotor crank in a number of outlets. 
 
You should be able to build a 20B with the light carbon steel housings replacing the heavy cast steel housings, for about the same weight as a 13B. That would be nice.
 
The light carbon steel housings are designed for PP, that could give you as much as 360hp in a 20B, if you design for optimum HP or less using lower compression rotors.
 
A 2 rotor 13B -PP might get you 250hp then again might not however  I feel it would give you the 230 hp. A 2 rotor PP with NOS would get you the take-off power required. I believe that currently being done by someone.
 
Then there's the Turbo, which you know about.
Just remember to consider all options.
George ( down under)
Bobby / Tracy -  Do either of you know what HP your Renesis is generating?  I'm very curious about the supercharged Renesis.  If you know the installed weight that would be great info too?  

George - I'm building a Bearhawk on floats and would like 250+ HP.  

Anyone who cares - I currently fly a Stinson 108-1 behind a Franklin 150 so I'm painfully aware of how hard it is to come by parts for unique engines.  That makes the 20B much less appealing as an option for me.  That being said, I watched from the Sea Plane Base at Oshkosh as an Aeronca Sedan with 145 HP lumbered across Lake Winnebago trying to get off the water.  People actually cheered when he finally broke a float free.  I think he was in Appleton's airspace by the time he got into air (no, I'm not kidding either).  That type of performance just won't cut it so anything less than 230 HP is not an option for me either.

Thanks very much.

Dwayne



From: Bobby J. Hughes <bhughes@qnsi.net>
To: Rotary motors in aircraft <flyrotary@lancaironline.net>
Sent: Mon, August 2, 2010 6:33:36 PM
Subject: [FlyRotary] Re: Bad rotary week

Dwayne,
 
My super charged renesis uses 1 oz per gallon of 2 stroke oil. So it's very likely David is using 1 quart every 5 hours. Question is 2-stroke or sump? No indication I am using any sump oil. But I only have about 35 flight hours. I do have a small internal coolant leak and need to replace an o-ring when my fiberglass work is finished. I would choose the renesis side port exhaust over a peripheral port exhaust any day for our application.
 
Bobby Hughes

From: Rotary motors in aircraft [mailto:flyrotary@lancaironline.net] On Behalf Of Dwayne Parkinson
Sent: Monday, August 02, 2010 4:43 PM
To: Rotary motors in aircraft
Subject: [FlyRotary] Bad rotary week

For anyone hoping that a 16X would show up any time soon:  not ... gonna ... happen.  No RX7 and the RX8 is still powered by the Renesis for 2011.


As if that's not bad enough, when I was at Oshkosh I took in David Atkins rotary seminar.  I came away pretty depressed thinking that I probably won't put a rotary engine in my airplane.  Is everyone else really using 1 quart of oil every 5 hours?  He also didn't have much good to say about the Renesis in an aviation application which leads me to conclude that the 16X will fare even worse in aviation applications as it is tweaked to meet higher EPA requirements and produce more low end torque.

Is anyone but Tracy using a Renesis?  I'd really like to know what HP you're getting, what the fuel burn is and how it's holding up.

Thanks,

Dwayne

P.S.  I couldn't find any rotary planes on the field at Oshkosh.  Perhaps they sank into the mud.







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