X-Virus-Scanned: clean according to Sophos on Logan.com Return-Path: Received: from fmailhost06.isp.att.net ([204.127.217.106] verified) by logan.com (CommuniGate Pro SMTP 5.3.7) with ESMTP id 4323095 for flyrotary@lancaironline.net; Sat, 22 May 2010 22:51:11 -0400 Received-SPF: none receiver=logan.com; client-ip=204.127.217.106; envelope-from=bbradburry@bellsouth.net Received: from desktop (adsl-85-113-131.mco.bellsouth.net[98.85.113.131]) by isp.att.net (frfwmhc06) with SMTP id <20100523025033H0600pnv9je>; Sun, 23 May 2010 02:50:34 +0000 X-Originating-IP: [98.85.113.131] From: "Bill Bradburry" To: "'Rotary motors in aircraft'" References: In-Reply-To: Subject: RE: [FlyRotary] injectors Date: Sat, 22 May 2010 22:50:33 -0400 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_000F_01CAFA01.302B3610" X-Mailer: Microsoft Office Outlook 11 Thread-Index: Acr59ipGkIoLov4rQgyVrZQIu6jTWwAKR5OQ X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.0.6001.18049 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_000F_01CAFA01.302B3610 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit John, earlier you said, "It is on warm restart when ever thing changes and the injectors are getting the + from some place other than the fuse." Power to the injectors doesn't hurt anything. They cant fire unless they are grounded with power on them. Do you know if with the injectors disabled and the fuse pulled so that no fuel can possibly get into the engine from the injectors, so that the engine is running totally on the Webber, it starts and run fine when cold and starts and runs fine when hot? How about when the Webber is shut down and drained like Ed and others have described and the engine is running totally on the injectors and there is no possibility of fuel getting to the engine from the Webber, it starts and runs fine when cold and starts and runs fine when hot? The problem may turn out to be that you have incomplete separation between the two systems, but you will not be able to determine that unless you can operate the engine on each system independently with the other system absolutely and totally disabled. If it wont run on one of the systems independently at least you will know where to start looking for the problem. If it turns out to be the injectors it is probably that they are getting ground somewhere other than the EC-2. They should have power (12V) to them all time but current can not flow unless there is a ground. This is supposedly supplied by the EC-2. if they are clicking during test, it is probably working like it should and you are getting ground somewhere else. Someone, Al?, suggested earlier that you power the injectors and remove the connectors one at a time listening for a click to see if you could find a ground on one or more of them. Did you do that? Can you post a schematic of your wiring and plumbing systems? Bill B _____ From: Rotary motors in aircraft [mailto:flyrotary@lancaironline.net] On Behalf Of John Sent: Saturday, May 22, 2010 5:31 PM To: Rotary motors in aircraft Subject: [FlyRotary] injectors Well I spent the afternoon testing the computer system and after checking the grounds and the power to the injectors, I ran the engine up to 180 degrees, stopped for a glass of tea and went back out to the shed and started the engine, flooding, pulled the fuse quick so as to not flood the engine. I have the upgrade's so I clipped the stethoscope to each injector and ran the test mode for the injectors and each on was clicking, so I tried a restart with the fuse pulled and the engine started. I unplugged all the injectors and the engine started, so I guess the new set isn't working any better than the rebuilds I bought from Bruce T. Is there a way to test those injectors to tell which may be hanging open. I have two cycle oil and MM oil in the fuel, so every thing should be well lubed, I did this when I was having a condition with the rotor lube pump. I think I'll go out this evening after it cools down and see if will still run with the injectors unplugged. I'll have to wait till Tracy gets home to find out if it's Okay to run with the Weber with the fuel side of the computer turned off. JohnD....Thank you for your help! ------=_NextPart_000_000F_01CAFA01.302B3610 Content-Type: text/html; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

John, earlier you said, = “It is on warm restart when ever thing changes and the injectors are getting the + from = some place other than the fuse.”

Power to the injectors doesn’t hurt = anything.  They cant fire unless they are grounded with power on them.  =

Do you know if with the injectors disabled and the = fuse pulled so that no fuel can possibly get into the engine from the = injectors, so that the engine is running totally on the Webber, it starts and run fine = when cold and starts and runs fine when hot?

How about when the Webber is shut down and drained = like Ed and others have described and the engine is running totally on the = injectors and there is no possibility of fuel getting to the engine from the = Webber, it starts and runs fine when cold and starts and runs fine when = hot?

The problem may turn out to be that you have = incomplete separation between the two systems, but you will not be able to = determine that unless you can operate the engine on each system independently with the = other system absolutely and totally disabled.

If it wont run on one of the systems independently at = least you will know where to start looking for the problem.  If it turns = out to be the injectors it is probably that they are getting ground somewhere = other than the EC-2.  They should have power (12V) to them all time but = current can not flow unless there is a ground.  This is supposedly supplied = by the EC-2.  if they are clicking during test, it is probably working = like it should and you are getting ground somewhere = else.

Someone, Al?, suggested earlier that you power the = injectors and remove the connectors one at a time listening for a click to see if = you could find a ground on one or more of them.  Did you do = that?

 

Can you post a schematic of your wiring and plumbing = systems?

 

Bill B

 

 

 

From: = Rotary motors in aircraft [mailto:flyrotary@lancaironline.net] On Behalf Of John
Sent: Saturday, May 22, = 2010 5:31 PM
To: Rotary motors in aircraft
Subject: [FlyRotary] = injectors

 

Well I spent the afternoon testing the computer = system and after checking the grounds and the power to the injectors, I ran the = engine up to 180 degrees, stopped for a glass of tea and went back out to the shed = and started the engine, flooding, pulled the fuse quick so as to not = flood the engine.  I have the upgrade's so I clipped the stethoscope to each injector and ran the test mode for the injectors and each on was = clicking, so I tried a restart with the fuse pulled and the engine started.  I = unplugged all the injectors and the engine started, so I guess the new set isn't = working any better than the rebuilds I bought from Bruce T.  Is there a way = to test those injectors to tell which may be hanging open.  I have two = cycle oil and MM oil in the fuel, so every thing should be well lubed, I did = this when I was having a condition with the rotor lube pump.  I think = I'll go out this evening after it cools down and see if will still run with the injectors unplugged.  I'll have to wait till Tracy gets home to find out if it's = Okay to run with the Weber with the fuel side of the computer turned off.  JohnD....Thank you for your help!

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