X-Virus-Scanned: clean according to Sophos on Logan.com Return-Path: Received: from fed1rmmtao106.cox.net ([68.230.241.40] verified) by logan.com (CommuniGate Pro SMTP 5.3.2) with ESMTP id 4116836 for flyrotary@lancaironline.net; Mon, 08 Feb 2010 22:16:11 -0500 Received-SPF: none receiver=logan.com; client-ip=68.230.241.40; envelope-from=rv-4mike@cox.net Received: from fed1rmimpo02.cox.net ([70.169.32.72]) by fed1rmmtao106.cox.net (InterMail vM.8.00.01.00 201-2244-105-20090324) with ESMTP id <20100209031534.THGV18268.fed1rmmtao106.cox.net@fed1rmimpo02.cox.net> for ; Mon, 8 Feb 2010 22:15:34 -0500 Received: from willsPC ([68.105.86.80]) by fed1rmimpo02.cox.net with bizsmtp id ffFP1d00T1k005Q04fFQhE; Mon, 08 Feb 2010 22:15:24 -0500 X-VR-Score: 0.00 X-Authority-Analysis: v=1.1 cv=zS9SgV63hfBKgCfMNmcWTXDxxMKGbBeTgNVRdCpsi3s= c=1 sm=1 a=XruvlouZCDbGUgEaRUiNZQ==:17 a=muQwnNxAAAAA:8 a=qRCqO51SAAAA:8 a=oCcaPWc0AAAA:8 a=7g1VtSJxAAAA:8 a=Ia-xEzejAAAA:8 a=lMp0wxlpdOVTVcORdnQA:9 a=Gu2dlZWxOTAXpYyK_VcA:7 a=pHtBbXyu_kL8Nu1NpMXZqMl2UEAA:4 a=5zrLeAV0Z70A:10 a=Lk9RiukEfR146KKg:21 a=QmeXoWXTBbCGCmX2:21 a=o2QoyYduAAAA:8 a=kviXuzpPAAAA:8 a=LDm1C4fi7cqUhNK5Zo4A:9 a=CIuwkVzat7VZLyBdvb4A:7 a=wZSC7QTFwqD2QAHOBk0bGI_klksA:4 a=d-1ze5jHbJEA:10 a=TlnOPt13aEMA:10 a=EzXvWhQp4_cA:10 a=4vB-4DCPJfMA:10 a=XruvlouZCDbGUgEaRUiNZQ==:117 X-CM-Score: 0.00 Message-ID: <9200620A08E04A6BA0677F66BF04E43B@willsPC> From: "Mike Wills" To: "Rotary motors in aircraft" References: In-Reply-To: Subject: Re: [FlyRotary] Re: CAD program Date: Mon, 8 Feb 2010 19:15:22 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0052_01CAA8F3.0F67A350" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Importance: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Windows Live Mail 14.0.8089.726 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V14.0.8089.726 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0052_01CAA8F3.0F67A350 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Thanks Monty. Alibre was the tool I was thinking of. Never seen Rhino = but I will take a look. Building an airplane is sort of an excuse to = learn the tool. I suspect that I could design/build what I want without = it. But it might help me visualize the end result before I go to far = down the wrong path. Clearly I'm not going to invest huge $ in a cad = package to build a one off. Mike From: MONTY ROBERTS=20 Sent: Monday, February 08, 2010 7:07 AM To: Rotary motors in aircraft=20 Subject: [FlyRotary] Re: CAD program Mike, If you are going to design an airplane I would go with Rhino = http://www.rhino3d.com/. Not free. Not parametric. But you will have an = easier time transitioning to it with your experience. It is capable of = doing the surfaces necessary for an aircraft. Autocad experience = translates nicely into Rhino. The solid modeling is pretty crappy in = Rhino, but I never use it. If you must have a parametric solid modeler you can try Alibre for free: = http://www.alibre.com/ It is a very good and cost effective package for doing parametric solid = modeling. It also has a sheet metal module. The free version is not the = most capable thing in the world. I think you can upgrade to the hobby = version for very little money. I have the full blown professional = package. I like it. It will do 95% of what Solid Works will do for much = less money.=20 If you need to be able to do real parametric surfacing for something = like an aircraft, forget all the mid range packages and ProE, nothing = short of Catia or Unigraphics is going to work satisfactorily. For = either of these you will be spending $20K+ and about $4K/year on = maintenance.=20 Makes Rhino look REALLY GOOD. Parametrics can be more trouble than they are worth with complex models. If I really must have a complex surface with parametric detail, I create = surfaces in Rhino and import them to Alibre. I add all the parametric = detail there. =20 Try everything else first, but you won't regret spending the money on = Rhino. I've been using it since Rhino 1.0. Monty ----- Original Message -----=20 From: Mike Wills=20 To: Rotary motors in aircraft=20 Sent: Sunday, February 07, 2010 11:41 AM Subject: [FlyRotary] CAD program Some time back I think it was Monty Roberts who posted about a free = parametric modeling software package. I lost the link (and name of the = software) when my last PC died. I didn't grab the software at the time = because didn't feel I had the time to learn to use it. But I'm = interested in learning now. Monty (or anyone else for that matter) do = you still have a link? Did anyone dive in at the time and try it? If so, = I'd like a little feedback. I have lots of experience with 2D Autocad = and a little experience with both ProE and Solidworks. I'm starting to think seriously about my next project. I've given up = waiting for Van to finish his RV-11 motorglider and I've just about = convinced myself that I can design and build my own version. Would like = to do some doodling in a 3D cad program. Mike Wills RV-4 N144MW -------------------------------------------------------------------------= ----- No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com=20 Version: 8.5.435 / Virus Database: 271.1.1/2673 - Release Date: = 02/07/10 07:22:00 -------------------------------------------------------------------------= ------- -- Homepage: http://www.flyrotary.com/ Archive and UnSub: = http://mail.lancaironline.net:81/lists/flyrotary/List.html ------=_NextPart_000_0052_01CAA8F3.0F67A350 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Thanks Monty. Alibre was the tool I was = thinking of.=20 Never seen Rhino but I will take a look. Building an airplane is sort of = an=20 excuse to learn the tool. I suspect that I could design/build what I = want=20 without it. But it might help me visualize the end result before I go to = far=20 down the wrong path. Clearly I'm not going to invest huge $ in a cad = package to=20 build a one off.
 
Mike

Sent: Monday, February 08, 2010 7:07 AM
Subject: [FlyRotary] Re: CAD program

Mike,
 
If you are going to design an airplane = I would go=20 with Rhino http://www.rhino3d.com/. Not=20 free. Not parametric. But you will have an easier time transitioning to = it with=20 your experience. It is capable of doing the surfaces necessary for an = aircraft.=20 Autocad experience translates nicely into Rhino. The solid modeling is = pretty=20 crappy in Rhino, but I never use it.
 
If you must have a parametric solid = modeler you can=20 try Alibre for free: http://www.alibre.com/
 
It is a very good and cost effective = package for=20 doing parametric solid modeling. It also has a sheet metal module. The = free=20 version is not the most capable thing in the world. I think you can = upgrade to=20 the hobby version for very little money. I have the full blown = professional=20 package. I like it. It will do 95% of what Solid Works will do for much = less=20 money.
 
If you need to be able to do real = parametric=20 surfacing for something like an aircraft, forget all the mid range = packages=20 and ProE, nothing short of Catia or Unigraphics is going to work=20 satisfactorily. For either of these you will be spending $20K+ and = about=20 $4K/year on maintenance.
 
Makes Rhino look REALLY = GOOD.
 
Parametrics can be more trouble than = they are worth=20 with complex models.
 
If I really must have a complex surface = with=20 parametric detail, I create surfaces in Rhino and import them to Alibre. = I add=20 all the parametric detail there.  
 
Try everything else first, but you = won't regret=20 spending the money on Rhino. I've been using it since Rhino = 1.0.
 
Monty
----- Original Message -----
From:=20 Mike = Wills
Sent: Sunday, February 07, 2010 = 11:41=20 AM
Subject: [FlyRotary] CAD = program

Some time back I think it was Monty Roberts = who posted=20 about a free parametric modeling software package. I lost the link = (and name=20 of the software) when my last PC died. I didn=92t grab the software at = the time=20 because didn=92t feel I had the time to learn to use it. But I'm = interested in=20 learning now. Monty (or anyone else for that matter) do you still have = a link?=20 Did anyone dive in at the time and try it? If so, I'd like a little = feedback.=20 I have lots of experience with 2D Autocad and a little experience with = both=20 ProE and Solidworks.
 
I'm starting to think seriously about my = next project.=20 I've given up waiting for Van to finish his RV-11 motorglider and I've = just=20 about convinced myself that I can design and build my own version. = Would like=20 to do some doodling in a 3D cad program.
 
Mike Wills
RV-4 N144MW


No virus found in this incoming message.
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Version: 8.5.435 / Virus Database: 271.1.1/2673 - = Release=20 Date: 02/07/10 07:22:00

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