X-Virus-Scanned: clean according to Sophos on Logan.com Return-Path: Received: from mail-pw0-f48.google.com ([209.85.160.48] verified) by logan.com (CommuniGate Pro SMTP 5.2.16) with ESMTP id 3894284 for flyrotary@lancaironline.net; Wed, 21 Oct 2009 15:21:55 -0400 Received-SPF: pass receiver=logan.com; client-ip=209.85.160.48; envelope-from=wdleonard@gmail.com Received: by pwj12 with SMTP id 12so1436764pwj.27 for ; Wed, 21 Oct 2009 12:21:20 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=domainkey-signature:mime-version:received:in-reply-to:references :date:message-id:subject:from:to:content-type; bh=V5qcbklqHoL0War4XmyE54ucDKstIlCVtwpKkPmVIdg=; b=eI5XvRMMQWLgb1hyd9bjWiBzojOeGd5yVIJDJCevXmh6bOg2av6+FoeDJYzMqxu1Pn EZLt6vHcpwW6a9oqjheLEjB/jq7Dglh7qGHwKH6MX87WW6ox8ZpzfkQkI/E6nAMJyTGe kgo3018UJvily7qiIAnv5Hdf4z34cCWQX60JA= DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; c=nofws; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=mime-version:in-reply-to:references:date:message-id:subject:from:to :content-type; b=r+JN4vc1c34zv+hdxZ0aoaddrHHd1IaIMwO8BclpY+5LQZQC4/aIMI9CEcv4CX4B5f NnBUEBJqo1HvzieXuOHq7FZLmlCjCaTjNaKP5mzuu9KRu2ZIVj433NIiC+r8A2PArPky ykyK1HkmGxL+nUnnRHWkFBmX9dixF12WHneXw= MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.142.119.24 with SMTP id r24mr573101wfc.291.1256152879223; Wed, 21 Oct 2009 12:21:19 -0700 (PDT) In-Reply-To: References: Date: Wed, 21 Oct 2009 12:21:19 -0700 Message-ID: <1c23473f0910211221j2857f173vde7c1dbb0026336f@mail.gmail.com> Subject: Re: [FlyRotary] off subject - RV spin characteristics From: David Leonard To: Rotary motors in aircraft Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=001636e1f85d26542c047676e2f0 --001636e1f85d26542c047676e2f0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Fun Stuff. I have pretty well explored the spin characteristics of my RV-6. Every RV is different. You never really got one going in that video, not even a full rotation best I could tell. Mine are different depending on whether I spin toward the normally heavy wing, or the light wing. They are steeper toward the heavy wing and also steeper with a pax. Much better toward the lighter wing - makes for a nice flat spin. I have not tried aileron in the direction of spin - it is fast enough without it. Gradually approach the stall in level flight. Some slight rudder and aileron to partly compensate for the heavy wing. At stall buffet, throttle to idle, stick full aft and full rudder. At first it is steep pitch down and bobble like what you show. After about 2 turns it flattens out and the rate of turn increases. After about 4-6 turns it is fully developed and the centrifugal force is quite noticeable, turn rate seems about 1.5 seconds per rotation, pitch down is about 20 deg. and I am loosing about 400 feet per rotation (the first couple turns and last couple turns it is more than that). At about 6-8 turns I get oil pressure and fuel pressure low alarms from the gas and oil all being flung outboard away from the pickups. That is the farthest I take it. It takes me 3-5 turns to get out of a fully developed spin (before the spin develops, it is nearly instant). Start with opposite rudder and stick to neutral, I have to forcibly hold the stick in the neutral position. As the rotation slows and starts to reverse direction I need to smartly but not too fast apply forward stick. Too fast, and the elevator stalls and mushes. Too slow and I have missed the window of opportunity and the spin reverses direction. I can help by easing the rudder a little when the rotation is slow. The Idea is to get the rudder and elevator flying again, then get the nose down while flying strait. It is sort of a feel thing, but it is a little scary, disorienting, and the trees are getting bigger and engine alarms are going off. I did quite a few spins working up to this point. It was a lot of practice getting used to the feel of the airplane and how it responds and getting comfortable with the sights and sounds. Once that elevator catches, it pitches down and out. I hold the pitch down a couple seconds because there is not power from the engine yet and I want to keep it at idle while the oil system re-pressurises. Probably not really smart, but a whole lot of fun. Sorry I don't have any video. Anyone want to come along and hold the camera? -- David Leonard Turbo Rotary RV-6 N4VY http://N4VY.RotaryRoster.net http://RotaryRoster.net On Wed, Oct 21, 2009 at 10:13 AM, kevin lane wrote: > one day I video recorded what happens in my RV-6A when I attempt to > stall/spin. with the stick held full back and neutral, rudders neutral, > power off, you can see the ride I get. it is actually a lot more bouncy and > shaking than the video portrays. I would never do this with say, my wife, > on board. eventually the left wing drops a lot, speed picks up and the > plane dives and pulls up, ready to start this routine all over again. at > this point I give full right rudder to initiate a spin, recovering several > thousand feet below the 5000' starting altitude. I have tried the "flying > leaf" maneuvers [only rudder corrections to a stall] before, and again, > never get into a full stall. > note - RV spin recovery requires neutral or forward stick along with > opposite rudder. this is not like the T-craft I learned to fly in. pushing > the stick in the direction of the spin will really wind it up. don't do > this! Van himself told me that! [afterwards] stick to 1 or 2 revolutions[ > not 6], that's all Vans has ever tested. kevin > > http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Utz0dRyg5mE > --001636e1f85d26542c047676e2f0 Content-Type: text/html; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Fun Stuff.=A0
=A0
I have pretty well explored the spin characteristics of my RV-6.=A0 Ev= ery RV is different.=A0 You never really got one going in that video, not e= ven a full rotation best I could tell.=A0 Mine are different depending on w= hether I spin toward the normally heavy wing, or the light wing.=A0 They ar= e steeper toward the heavy wing and also steeper with a pax.=A0 Much better= toward the lighter wing - makes for a nice flat spin.=A0 I have not tried = aileron in the=A0direction of spin - it is fast enough without it.
=A0
Gradually approach the stall in level flight.=A0 Some slight rudder an= d aileron to partly compensate for the heavy wing.=A0 At stall buffet, thro= ttle to idle,=A0stick full aft and full rudder.=A0 At first it is steep pit= ch down and bobble like what you show.=A0 After about 2 turns it flattens o= ut and the rate of turn increases.=A0 After about 4-6 turns it is fully dev= eloped and the centrifugal force is quite noticeable,=A0turn rate seems abo= ut 1.5 seconds per rotation,=A0pitch down is about 20 deg. and I am loosing= about 400 feet per rotation (the first couple turns and last couple turns = it is more than that).=A0=A0 At about 6-8 turns I get oil pressure and fuel= pressure=A0low=A0alarms from the gas and oil all being flung outboard away= from the pickups.=A0 That is the farthest I take it.
=A0
It takes me=A03-5 turns to get out of a fully developed spin (before t= he spin develops, it is nearly instant).=A0 Start with opposite rudder and = stick to neutral,=A0I have to forcibly hold the stick in the neutral positi= on.=A0 As the rotation slows and starts to reverse direction=A0I need to sm= artly but not too fast apply forward stick.=A0 Too fast, and the elevator s= talls and mushes.=A0 Too slow and I have missed the window of opportunity a= nd the spin reverses direction.=A0 I can help by easing the rudder a little= when the rotation is slow.=A0 The Idea is to get the rudder and elevator f= lying again, then get the nose down while flying strait. It=A0is sort of a = feel thing, but it is a little scary, disorienting, and the trees are getti= ng bigger and engine alarms are going off.=A0 I did quite a few spins worki= ng up to this point.=A0 It was a lot of practice getting used to the feel o= f the airplane and how it responds and getting comfortable with the sights = and sounds.
=A0
Once that elevator catches, it pitches down and out.=A0 I hold the pit= ch down a couple seconds because there is not power from the engine yet and= I want to keep it at idle while the oil system re-pressurises.
=A0
Probably not really smart, but a whole lot of fun.=A0
=A0
Sorry I don't have any video.=A0 Anyone want to come along and hol= d the camera?

--
David Leonard

Turbo Rotary RV-6 N4VY
http://N4VY.RotaryRoster.net
http://RotaryRoster.net

On Wed, Oct 21, 2009 at 10:13 AM, kevin lane <n3773@comcast.net> wrote:
one day I video recorded what happens in = my RV-6A when I attempt to stall/spin.=A0 with the stick held full back and= neutral, rudders neutral, power off, you can see the ride I get.=A0 it is = actually a lot more bouncy and shaking=A0than the video portrays.=A0 I woul= d never do this with say, my wife, on board.=A0 eventually the left wing dr= ops a lot, speed picks up and the plane dives and pulls up, ready to start = this routine all over again.=A0 at this point I give full right rudder to i= nitiate a spin, recovering several thousand feet below the 5000' starti= ng altitude.=A0 I have tried the "flying leaf" maneuvers [only ru= dder corrections to a stall] before, and again, never get into a full stall= .=A0=A0=A0
=A0note - RV spin recovery requires neutr= al or forward stick along with opposite rudder.=A0 this is not like the T-c= raft I learned to fly in.=A0 pushing the stick in the direction of the spin= will really wind it up.=A0 don't do this!=A0 Van himself told me that!= [afterwards]=A0=A0=A0stick to 1 or 2 revolutions[ not 6], that's all V= ans has ever tested.=A0 =A0 =A0kevin
=A0



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