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Subject: Re: [FlyRotary] Re: Vinyl Ester tanks
From: Steve Thomas <glasair2@me.com>
In-Reply-To: <list-3857495@logan.com>
Date: Thu, 17 Sep 2009 10:33:31 -0700
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To: Rotary motors in aircraft <flyrotary@lancaironline.net>

Alain,

What engine are you running?  I will mention you the next time I talk  
to him.

Best Regards,

Steve Thomas
_______________________________________________________


On Sep 17, 2009, at 9:39 AM, Alain Ouellet wrote:

> Steve,
>
> If your fellow is interested to have someone test his fuel in  
> operation.
>
> I could probably arrange to have it done, let me know and/or he can  
> contact
> me
> thru a direct e-mail and we can go from there.
>
> Best Regards,
>
> Alain
>
> Alain Ouellet
> 905-458-5424
> mailto:aouellet@icecanada.com
>
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Rotary motors in aircraft [mailto:flyrotary@lancaironline.net]On
> Behalf Of Steve Thomas
> Sent: September 17, 2009 9:51 AM
> To: Rotary motors in aircraft
> Subject: [FlyRotary] Re: Vinyl Ester tanks
>
>
> George,
>
> According to the information I have, butanol is not corrosive due to
> its larger hydrocarbon chain.  Check out the following link:
>
> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Butanol_fuel
>
> I recently spoke with a fellow that is trying to develop a biobutanol
> factory to produce it from biomass, mostly waste product and not
> foodstuffs.  He wants me to test his fuel.  Not likely, as flying for
> the first time has enough uncertainty without adding unnecessary
> variables.  But, it does have promise.
>
> Best Regards,
>
> Steve Thomas
> _______________________________________________________
>
>
>
>
>
> On Sep 17, 2009, at 12:42 AM, George Lendich wrote:
>
>> Steve doesn't it go Methanol, Ethanol, Butanol in the BTU rating -
>> isn't it still a alcohol and isn't alcohol the thing that kills  
>> epoxy?
>> George ( down under)
>>
>>> (sorry, but the chart mentioned below is too big.  If you want a
>>> copy, let me know and I'll email direct.)
>>>
>>> Yes, but there are many formulations of vinyl ester.  My entire
>>> airplane is made from vinyl ester, including the wet-wing gas
>>> tanks.   The formula used from the factory was Derakane 411-45.  I
>>> switched to  Derakane 411-350 some time later as it was a little
>>> more viscous and  wetted out better.  It was also easier to get.
>>> However, if you look  at the attached Derakane Chemical Resistance
>>> Guide, the 411 series is  not recommended for gasohol
>>> concentrations greater than 10% ethanol.   Since I cannot do
>>> anything about my tanks at this point, I am forced  to live with
>>> the limitations of Derakane 411.
>>>
>>> I don't know what the specifications are on the fiberglast resins,
>>> but those who use it ought to know.  For me, E85 is clearly not in
>>> the  cards. Another possible option is butanol.  There are some who
>>> are  experimenting with butanol as a 100% replacement for 100LL.
>>> It has  nearly the same octane rating as 100LL, and about 90% of
>>> the total  energy, per gallon, of gasoline.  Ethanol only has about
>>> 60% of the  energy, per gallon, of gasoline.  And butanol does
>>> require a different  air-fuel ratio.  It is also not corrosive in
>>> the same way as ethanol.
>>>
>>> So, my concern remains.  It looks like using gasohol with a 10%
>>> lace  of ethanol will be OK.  More than that, I'll be switching to
>>> 100LL.
>>>
>>> Best Regards,
>>>
>>> Steve Thomas
>>> _______________________________________________________
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> On Sep 4, 2009, at 11:32 AM, Lynn Hanover wrote:
>>>
>>>> Or, what are the tanks holding E-85 made out of? About 75% alcohol
>>>> .All of the underground fuel tanks are now Vinyl Ester.
>>>>
>>>> Lynn E. Hanover
>>>
>>>
>>> --
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>>
>>
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