X-Virus-Scanned: clean according to Sophos on Logan.com Return-Path: Received: from cdptpa-omtalb.mail.rr.com ([75.180.132.121] verified) by logan.com (CommuniGate Pro SMTP 5.2.14) with ESMTP id 3745190 for flyrotary@lancaironline.net; Sat, 04 Jul 2009 19:18:58 -0400 Received-SPF: pass receiver=logan.com; client-ip=75.180.132.121; envelope-from=eanderson@carolina.rr.com Received: from computername ([75.191.186.236]) by cdptpa-omta01.mail.rr.com with ESMTP id <20090704231820079.ZCXG24657@cdptpa-omta01.mail.rr.com> for ; Sat, 4 Jul 2009 23:18:20 +0000 From: "Ed Anderson" To: "'Rotary motors in aircraft'" Subject: RE: [FlyRotary] Modify Alternator for External Regulator Date: Sat, 4 Jul 2009 19:18:23 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_000C_01C9FCDC.33290220" X-Mailer: Microsoft Office Outlook, Build 11.0.5510 Thread-Index: Acn8+i1fSOry+pJvSYmDsnT9i1KnGQAAvAlA In-Reply-To: X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.5579 Message-Id: <20090704231820079.ZCXG24657@cdptpa-omta01.mail.rr.com> This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_000C_01C9FCDC.33290220 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Oh, No! Kelly. I can always shut down the engine {:>) - but seriously , no - if alternator ran wild, its throw the infamous Essential bus switch from alternator to battery and head for the nearest landing. Could it happen, undoubtedly, however, in 60 + years of driving automobiles, I have never, never had an alternator run wild - the ones that failed, just died. So if I can get by another 60 years {:>), then I'll probably hang up my wings (or who knows perhaps get another pair {:>) Ed Ed Anderson Rv-6A N494BW Rotary Powered Matthews, NC eanderson@carolina.rr.com http://www.andersonee.com http://www.dmack.net/mazda/index.html http://www.flyrotary.com/ http://members.cox.net/rogersda/rotary/configs.htm#N494BW http://www.rotaryaviation.com/Rotorhead%20Truth.htm _____ From: Rotary motors in aircraft [mailto:flyrotary@lancaironline.net] On Behalf Of Kelly Troyer Sent: Saturday, July 04, 2009 6:52 PM To: Rotary motors in aircraft Subject: [FlyRotary] Modify Alternator for External Regulator Ed, Does this mean you have no means to shut down your alternator if you have regulator failure and voltage were to go wild (admittedly does not happen often) ??..................... Kelly Troyer "Dyke Delta"_13B ROTARY Engine "RWS"_RD1C/EC2/EM2 "Mistral"_Backplate/Oil Manifold -------------- Original message from "Ed Anderson" : -------------- George, Most aircraft alternators had the ability to kill output from the alternator by removing voltage to the field coils of the alternator. However, most all automobile alternators need only the initial battery voltage to the field coils to start producing voltage. Once started, removing voltage from the field coils WILL NOT shut down the alternator. I discovered this myself. If I start the engine with the alternator field coil Circuit breaker in - then the alternator produces voltage as expected. However, I found when I pulled the alternator field coil CB AFTER the alternator started producing voltage - I could not shut it down. If I started the engine with the CB pulled then the alternator never started to produce voltage. However, I am told that in some alternators there is sufficient magnetism retain in the metal that they can start producing voltage as soon as they are spinning. So a number of folks modify auto alternators ( I think they are just as good and a whole lot cheaper) to remove the ability of the alternator to get voltage for its field coils internally. Then the put a CB in the field coil voltage line and can shut down the alternator at any time. I do not have this mod as I've never had an alternator do anything but fail to produce sufficient voltage, but it appears there have been cases where the alternator ran wild and produced high voltage sufficient to damage equipment. Naturally you don't want this in an aircraft , so the best of both worlds is to buy a good quality automobile alternator and modify it. A number of folks have successfully done this. My personal experience has led me to leave the alternator as it is and so far that has worked fine for me. Ed Ed Anderson Rv-6A N494BW Rotary Powered Matthews, NC eanderson@carolina.rr.com http://www.andersonee.com http://www.dmack.net/mazda/index.html http://www.flyrotary.com/ http://members.cox.net/rogersda/rotary/configs.htm#N494BW http://www.rotaryaviation.com/Rotorhead%20Truth.htm _____ From: Rotary motors in aircraft [mailto:flyrotary@lancaironline.net] On Behalf Of George Lendich Sent: Saturday, July 04, 2009 5:57 PM To: Rotary motors in aircraft Subject: [FlyRotary] Re: Modify Alternator for External Regulator Kelly, Say again, why some opt for an external regulator? George (down under) Chris, Al , Group, Here is link for modifying the stock Mazda alternator for an external regulator.......... http://home.earthlink.net/~timrv6a/alternator.htm Kelly Troyer "Dyke Delta"_13B ROTARY Engine "RWS"_RD1C/EC2/EM2 "Mistral"_Backplate/Oil Manifold -------------- Original message from "Al Gietzen" : -------------- > Chris wrote: > I am running the expensive B&C regulators on both systems with > the stock alternators with the internal regulators disabled. > ----------- > > The question that flashes into my mind is "how did you disable the internal > regulator?" > Opening the internal connection from the output that normally powers the > regulator does not keep the regulator from operating. I'm just wondering if > there is some issue with your external regulator maybe providing the field > current to the internal regulator. Perhaps worth re-evaluating that setup. > > Al > > > -- > Homepage: http://www.flyrotary.com/ > Archive and UnSub: http://mail.lancaironline.net:81/lists/flyrotary/List.html __________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus signature database 3267 (20080714) __________ The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. http://www.eset.com __________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus signature database 3267 (20080714) __________ The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. http://www.eset.com ------=_NextPart_000_000C_01C9FCDC.33290220 Content-Type: text/html; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

Oh, No!  Kelly.  I can always shut down the engine {:>) – but seriously , no - =  if alternator ran wild, its throw the infamous Essential bus switch from alternator to battery and head for the nearest = landing.

 

Could it happen, undoubtedly, = however, in 60 + years of driving automobiles, I have never, never had an alternator = run wild – the ones that failed,  just died.  So if I can = get by another 60 years {:>), then I’ll probably hang up my wings (or = who knows perhaps get another pair {:>)

 

Ed

 

From: = Rotary motors in aircraft [mailto:flyrotary@lancaironline.net] On Behalf Of Kelly = Troyer
Sent: Saturday, July 04, = 2009 6:52 PM
To: Rotary motors in aircraft
Subject: [FlyRotary] = Modify Alternator for External Regulator

 

Ed,

  Does this mean you have no means to shut down your alternator if you have regulator

failure and voltage were to go wild (admittedly does not = happen often) ??.....................


Kelly Troyer
"Dyke Delta"_13B ROTARY Engine
"RWS"_RD1C/EC2/EM2
"Mistral"_Backplate/Oil Manifold


 

-------------- Original message from "Ed Anderson" <eanderson@carolina.rr.com>: --------------


George,

=

 

Most aircraft alternators had the = ability to kill output from the alternator by removing voltage to the field = coils of the alternator.  However, most all automobile alternators need only = the initial  battery voltage to the field coils to start producing = voltage.  Once started, removing voltage from the field coils WILL NOT  shut = down the alternator.

 

I discovered this myself.  If = I start the engine with the alternator field coil Circuit breaker in – = then the alternator produces voltage as expected.  However, I found when I = pulled the alternator field coil CB AFTER the alternator started producing = voltage – I could not shut it down.  If I started the engine with the = CB pulled then the alternator never started to produce voltage.  = However, I am told that in some alternators there is sufficient magnetism retain in = the metal that they can start producing voltage as soon as they are spinning. =

 

So a number of folks modify auto alternators ( I think they are just as good and a whole lot cheaper) to = remove the ability of the alternator to get voltage for its field coils internally.  Then the put a CB in the field coil voltage line and = can shut down the alternator at any time.

 

I do not have this mod as = I’ve never had an alternator do anything but fail to produce sufficient voltage, = but it appears there have been cases where the alternator ran wild and produced = high voltage sufficient  to damage equipment.  Naturally you = don’t want this in an aircraft , so the best of both worlds is to buy a good = quality automobile alternator and modify it.  A number of folks have = successfully done this.  My personal experience has led me to leave the = alternator as it is and so far that has worked fine for = me.

 

Ed

 

From: = Rotary motors in aircraft [mailto:flyrotary@lancaironline.net] On Behalf Of George Lendich
Sent: Saturday, July 04, = 2009 5:57 PM
To: Rotary motors in = aircraft
Subject: [FlyRotary] Re: = Modify Alternator for External Regulator

 

Kelly,

Say again, why some opt for an external = regulator?

George (down under)

Chris, Al , Group,

       Here is link for modifying = the stock Mazda alternator for an external = regulator..........

 

        http://home.ea= rthlink.net/~timrv6a/alternator.htm
Kelly Troyer
"Dyke Delta"_13B ROTARY Engine
"RWS"_RD1C/EC2/EM2
"Mistral"_Backplate/Oil Manifold

 

-------------- Original message from "Al Gietzen" <ALVentures@cox.net>: --------------


> Chris wrote:
> I am running the expensive B&C regulators on both systems with =
> the stock alternators with the internal regulators disabled.
> -----------
>
> The question that flashes into my mind is "how did you disable = the internal
> regulator?"
> Opening the internal connection from the output that normally = powers the
> regulator does not keep the regulator from operating. I'm just = wondering if
> there is some issue with your external regulator maybe providing = the field
> current to the internal regulator. Perhaps worth re-evaluating that = setup.
>
> Al
>
>
> --
> Homepage: http://www.flyrotary.com/
> Archive and UnSub: http://mail.lancaironline.net:81/lists/flyrotary/List.html =



__________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus signature database 3267 (20080714) = __________

The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus.

http://www.eset.com



__________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus = signature database 3267 (20080714) __________

The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus.

http://www.eset.com

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