X-Virus-Scanned: clean according to Sophos on Logan.com Return-Path: Received: from QMTA02.westchester.pa.mail.comcast.net ([76.96.62.24] verified) by logan.com (CommuniGate Pro SMTP 5.2.0) with ESMTP id 2780856 for flyrotary@lancaironline.net; Thu, 06 Mar 2008 20:37:47 -0500 Received-SPF: none receiver=logan.com; client-ip=76.96.62.24; envelope-from=gregw@onestopdesign.biz Received: from OMTA11.westchester.pa.mail.comcast.net ([76.96.62.36]) by QMTA02.westchester.pa.mail.comcast.net with comcast id xyYb1Y00r0mv7h05207b00; Fri, 07 Mar 2008 01:36:28 +0000 Received: from gregoryii ([24.6.40.29]) by OMTA11.westchester.pa.mail.comcast.net with comcast id y1d41Y00D0dkeQQ3X00000; Fri, 07 Mar 2008 01:37:05 +0000 X-Authority-Analysis: v=1.0 c=1 a=k3YdkyO2q9EA:10 a=7g1VtSJxAAAA:8 a=Ia-xEzejAAAA:8 a=DnghRzQnhwcIV1hZ6KIA:9 a=UIZ-yYJ-FtyPESMtzjIA:7 a=GjYbZ4GbfIlkmaxK1DnWD9sr6XoA:4 a=4vB-4DCPJfMA:10 a=U8Ie8EnqySEA:10 a=3I_whO4B8K8A:10 a=3oc9M9_CAAAA:8 a=emARcoSS8c9gv6buXvkA:9 a=Y-W25wJTJ-u9u0kwcfUA:7 a=fvFaRdccknQXYSgE6NYcE4jyt2UA:4 a=iVkDmfvjeKcA:10 a=EzXvWhQp4_cA:10 a=AfD3MYMu9mQA:10 Message-ID: <006b01c87ff4$19de0e70$8801a8c0@yosemite.onestopdesign.biz> From: "Greg Ward" To: "Rotary motors in aircraft" References: Subject: Re: [FlyRotary] Re: Exhaust Wrap was [FlyRotary] Re: Exhaust? Date: Thu, 6 Mar 2008 17:39:33 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0068_01C87FB1.0B0A6A30" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.3138 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.3198 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0068_01C87FB1.0B0A6A30 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Just as a side bar, my 20B came with all of the factory shields, = installed around the twin turbos, and wrapped around the cast exhaust, = and even though the car had only 68K miles, those shields were pretty = much gone. The bolts holding them on were rusted looking, I would = imagine, from the heat, and the sheet metal seemed flimsy. There must = have been a hell of a lot of heat in the lower section of that car. Greg Ward ----- Original Message -----=20 From: Tracy Crook=20 To: Rotary motors in aircraft=20 Sent: Thursday, March 06, 2008 11:48 AM Subject: [FlyRotary] Re: Exhaust Wrap was [FlyRotary] Re: Exhaust? In a case like this, shield the cowl, not the pipes. This has worked = well on my -4. =20 The JetHot2000 coating may be enough for you. My coated pipes are = pretty close (<1" in places) to some painted surfaces (engine mount) and = I was amazed that the paint does not seem to be affected at all so far = (12 hr gnd test). I do plan to install shields some places but the = shield will be on the protected part, not the exhaust pipes. Tracy On Wed, Mar 5, 2008 at 11:01 PM, Mike Wills wrote: What's not to like? This is easy on straight sections but not so = where the pipe curves. Would be really tough to shield my exhaust like = this. I havent tested anything like this but suspect that it is not as = effective an insulator as the wrap or some other sort of barrier (like = the Zetex or Fiberfrax). My exhaust is made of .060 mandrel bent 321 stainless and coated in = and out with a 2000 degree ceramic coating. So not sure how relavent the = comparisons to wrapped mild steel are. I agree with the inspection = related comments. But would like to hear from anyone who has used the = tape in an aircraft install where the high heat is constant, on a = comparable exhaust (i.e. 321 stainless). The real issue here is my cowl is close. And after all the work to = make it the prospect of burning it up isnt an option. Lesson learned is = to make sure ALL engine work including fabrication of exhaust is = complete before making a cowl. But that ship has sailed so now I'm = looking at ways to recover. The simple shields that Lynn proposed will = leave too many gaps and too much potential for cooking the cowl. The Zetex looks like a possible answer if I can find a source other = than the manufacturer that has small quantities available. Anybody have any experience with Fiberfrax (Aircraft Spruce sells = it; claims its good to 2200 degrees)? Mike ----- Original Message -----=20 From: Ed Anderson=20 To: Rotary motors in aircraft=20 Sent: Wednesday, March 05, 2008 1:45 PM Subject: [FlyRotary] Re: Exhaust Wrap was [FlyRotary] Re: Exhaust? = I think that's what the Doctor ordered, Lynn Simple, effective, light weight, permits inspection, relatively = inexpensive, can be easily removed, does not cause deterioration of the = tubing, can be done in home work shop. =20 What's not to like {:>) Ed ----- Original Message -----=20 From: Lehanover@aol.com=20 To: Rotary motors in aircraft=20 Sent: Wednesday, March 05, 2008 3:20 PM Subject: [FlyRotary] Re: Exhaust Wrap was [FlyRotary] Re: = Exhaust?=20 OK, How about this.=20 A shield in .015" stainless. The tabs can be bent inboard to = take up less space. The air gap can be as little as 1/2". Only needed on = the side where some protection is required. Very light. Can be wired on = instead of hose clamps. Removable for tubing inspection.=20 Lynn E. Hanover In a message dated 3/5/2008 11:06:41 A.M. Eastern Standard Time, = eanderson@carolina.rr.com writes: I just do not think any sort of exhaust wrap belongs in an = aircraft. It might work just fine - but, if it does not........., = ..but, just my opinion. Ed ------------------------------------------------------------------------ It's Tax Time! Get tips, forms and advice on AOL Money & = Finance. ------------------------------------------------------------------------ ------------------------------------------------------------------------ -- Homepage: http://www.flyrotary.com/ Archive and UnSub: = http://mail.lancaironline.net:81/lists/flyrotary/List.html ------=_NextPart_000_0068_01C87FB1.0B0A6A30 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Just as a side bar, my 20B came with all of the = factory=20 shields, installed around the twin turbos, and wrapped around the cast = exhaust,=20 and even though the car had only 68K miles, those shields were pretty = much=20 gone.  The bolts holding them on were rusted looking, I would = imagine, from=20 the heat, and the sheet metal seemed flimsy.  There must have been = a hell=20 of a lot of heat in the lower section of that car.
Greg Ward
----- Original Message -----
From:=20 Tracy=20 Crook
Sent: Thursday, March 06, 2008 = 11:48=20 AM
Subject: [FlyRotary] Re: = Exhaust Wrap was=20 [FlyRotary] Re: Exhaust?

In a case like this, shield the cowl, not the pipes.  This = has=20 worked well on my -4.  
 
 The JetHot2000 coating may be enough for you.  My = coated pipes=20 are pretty close (<1" in places) to some painted surfaces (engine = mount)=20 and I was amazed that the paint does not seem to be affected at all so = far (12=20 hr gnd test).  I do plan to install shields some places but the = shield=20 will be on the protected part, not the exhaust pipes.
 
Tracy

On Wed, Mar 5, 2008 at 11:01 PM, Mike Wills = <rv-4mike@cox.net> wrote:
What's not to like? This is easy on straight sections but not = so where=20 the pipe curves. Would be really tough to shield my exhaust like=20 this. I havent tested anything like this but suspect that it is = not as=20 effective an insulator as the wrap or some other sort of barrier = (like the=20 Zetex or Fiberfrax).
 
My exhaust is made of .060 mandrel bent 321 stainless and = coated in and=20 out with a 2000 degree ceramic coating. So not sure how relavent the = comparisons to wrapped mild steel are. I agree with the inspection = related=20 comments. But would like to hear from anyone who has used the tape = in an=20 aircraft install where the high heat is constant, on a comparable = exhaust=20 (i.e. 321 stainless).
 
The real issue here is my cowl is close. And after all the work = to make=20 it the prospect of burning it up isnt an option. Lesson learned is = to make=20 sure ALL engine work including fabrication of exhaust is complete = before=20 making a cowl. But that ship has sailed so now I'm looking at ways = to=20 recover. The simple shields that Lynn proposed will leave too many = gaps and=20 too much potential for cooking the cowl.
 
The Zetex looks like a possible answer if I can find a source = other=20 than the manufacturer that has small quantities available.
 
Anybody have any experience with Fiberfrax (Aircraft Spruce = sells it;=20 claims its good to 2200 degrees)?
 
Mike
----- Original Message ----- =
From: = Ed Anderson
To: Rotary = motors in=20 aircraft
Sent: Wednesday, March 05, = 2008 1:45=20 PM
Subject: [FlyRotary] Re: = Exhaust Wrap=20 was [FlyRotary] Re: Exhaust?

I think that's what the Doctor ordered,=20 Lynn
 
Simple, effective, light weight, permits = inspection,=20 relatively inexpensive, can be easily removed, does not cause=20 deterioration of the tubing, can be done in home work shop. =20
 
 
What's not to like {:>)
 
Ed
 
 
----- Original Message -----
From: Lehanover@aol.com
To: Rotary motors in=20 aircraft
Sent: Wednesday, March = 05, 2008=20 3:20 PM
Subject: [FlyRotary] Re: = Exhaust=20 Wrap was [FlyRotary] Re: Exhaust?

OK, How about this.
 
A shield in .015" stainless. The tabs can be bent inboard = to take=20 up less space. The air gap can be as little as 1/2". Only needed = on the=20 side where some protection is required. Very light. Can be wired = on=20 instead of hose clamps. Removable for tubing inspection.
 
Lynn E. Hanover
 
 
 
In a message dated 3/5/2008 11:06:41 A.M. Eastern Standard = Time, eanderson@carolina.rr.com writes:
I just do not think any sort of exhaust = wrap belongs=20 in an aircraft.  It might work just fine - but, if it = does=20 not........., ..but, just my opinion.
 
Ed



It's Tax Time! Get tips, forms and advice on AOL Money &=20 Finance.

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