X-Virus-Scanned: clean according to Sophos on Logan.com Return-Path: Received: from nz-out-0102.google.com ([64.233.162.196] verified) by logan.com (CommuniGate Pro SMTP 5.0.9) with ESMTP id 1123870 for flyrotary@lancaironline.net; Mon, 22 May 2006 18:12:08 -0400 Received-SPF: pass receiver=logan.com; client-ip=64.233.162.196; envelope-from=russell.duffy@gmail.com Received: by nz-out-0102.google.com with SMTP id x3so1305224nzd for ; Mon, 22 May 2006 15:11:23 -0700 (PDT) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:from:to:subject:date:message-id:mime-version:content-type:x-priority:x-msmail-priority:x-mailer:x-mimeole:importance:in-reply-to; b=rlbNm8gdHLcipmip8CPBEZKqFoulHWVRm4LFuLOr5cMX1WmEU7yIwSSMe5XrWZwKUgt+kL0stMbrccJHDKQJ+ZxhkrF1gSNh47N1hLmRVM6trLC1Iij6i4L18PetN9bV5pLOkwojYl+gJiZ21NfL0JD6BfN7SVqlbOYf/QL7Hzk= Received: by 10.36.79.11 with SMTP id c11mr6790832nzb; Mon, 22 May 2006 15:11:23 -0700 (PDT) Return-Path: Received: from raddell ( [209.114.234.11]) by mx.gmail.com with ESMTP id 12sm7558245nzn.2006.05.22.15.11.22; Mon, 22 May 2006 15:11:23 -0700 (PDT) From: "Russell Duffy" To: "'Rotary motors in aircraft'" Subject: RE: [FlyRotary] Rationalization was [FlyRotary] Re: Questions from a potential rotaryphile Date: Mon, 22 May 2006 18:11:08 -0400 Message-ID: <001f01c67dec$a199c180$c49412c6@raddell> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0020_01C67DCB.1A882180" X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook, Build 10.0.6626 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2869 Importance: Normal In-Reply-To: This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0020_01C67DCB.1A882180 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable However, I believe, there is plenty of objective evidence that says the rotary is comparable or better than the Lycoming in just about any = aspect you want to consider. =20 =20 Hi Ed, =20 I would agree with the above statement, but unfortunately, the one key = area where the rotary clearly hasn't demonstrated superiority is "FWF reliability". The rotary group has had way too many failures in the = past couple years, and this needs to be the area we work on. Most of it has = been silly things, and I'm certainly ashamed for my contribution to the = problems. Even the Aviation Sport article supports that conclusion=20 =20 Does anyone have an electronic copy of this article they could send me? = I guess I'm the only one who hasn't read it. =20 =20 certainly cost less (even if you have to buy engine parts new), etc., = etc. So no doubt there is some rationalization- but I'm not certain over = what? =20 =20 I would argue cost, and have in the past. I would (actually have) bet = real money that the $21k Lyclone I just installed on the RV-8 will work out = to be cheaper than a rotary engine installation over the few years (at least) = that I hope to fly this plane. This factors in resale of course. =20 =20 IF somebody would take the rotary and produce a reasonably price FWF = kit, I believe you would find the rotary installations would expand = exponentially. Most folks are understandably a bit daunted by the challenge of = designing and putting that all together on their on.=20 =20 Amen brother!!! This is certainly what would need to happen. = Powersport made a great engine installation, but at such a high price that not too = many people bought it. If someone like Eggenfellner would make a rotary = package, it would be expensive, but from a name that people know (whether they = can spell it or not), and trust. I would certainly hope that people would = see the value of a rotary over the Subaru given the same price, and FWF producer.=20 =20 Better get started on that article now :-) Actually, I was wondering if = the rotary group could put together it's own fly-off between similar planes. = It would have to be well documented, but we have enough engineers here to = make sure of that. Heck, in the not too distant future, we should ( <--- key word ) have a 2 and 3 rotor RV-8 to test against my Lycoming. =20 =20 Cheers, Rusty (T-minus about 53 hours until I'm back home) =20 =20 PS, can't wait to hear how the 500HP Lancair flies! =20 =20 ------=_NextPart_000_0020_01C67DCB.1A882180 Content-Type: text/html; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Message
However, I = believe,  there=20 is plenty of objective evidence that says the rotary is comparable or = better=20 than the Lycoming in just about any aspect you want to = consider.  
 
Hi Ed,
 
I would agree with the above statement, = but=20 unfortunately, the one key area where the rotary clearly hasn't=20 demonstrated superiority is "FWF reliability".  The = rotary group=20 has had way too many failures in the past couple years,=20 and this needs to be the area we work on.  Most of it has = been=20 silly things, and I'm certainly ashamed for my contribution to = the=20 problems.          
Even the Aviation Sport article = supports=20 that conclusion 
 
Does anyone=20 have an electronic copy of this article they could send me?  I = guess I'm=20 the only one who hasn't read it. 
 
certainly cost less (even = if you have=20 to buy engine parts new), etc., etc.   So no doubt there is = some=20 rationalization- but I'm not certain over what?   
 
I would argue cost, and have in the past.  I = would=20 (actually have) bet real money that the $21k Lyclone I = just=20 installed on the RV-8 will work out to be cheaper than = a rotary engine=20 installation over the few years (at least) that I hope to fly this = plane. =20 This factors in resale of course.  =20    
 
IF somebody would take the = rotary and=20 produce a reasonably price FWF kit, I believe you would find the rotary=20 installations would expand exponentially.  Most folks are = understandably a=20 bit daunted by the challenge of designing and  putting that all = together on=20 their on. 
 
Amen brother!!!  This is certainly what would need = to=20 happen.   Powersport made a great engine installation, but at = such a=20 high price that not too many people bought it.  If someone like=20 Eggenfellner would make a rotary package, it would be expensive, but = from a name=20 that people know (whether they can spell it or not), and trust.  I = would=20 certainly hope that people would see the value of a rotary over the = Subaru given=20 the same price, and FWF = producer. 
 
Better get started on that article now :-)  = Actually, I was=20 wondering if the rotary group could put together it's own fly-off = between=20 similar planes.  It would have to be well documented, but we = have=20 enough engineers here to make sure of that.  Heck, in the not = too=20 distant future, we should ( <--- key word <g>) have a 2 and 3 = rotor=20 RV-8 to test against my Lycoming. =20  
 
Cheers,
Rusty (T-minus about 53 hours until I'm back=20 home)    
 
PS, can't wait to hear how the 500HP Lancair=20 flies!   
 
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