Return-Path: Received: from mordor.vnet-inc.com ([216.129.224.17] verified) by logan.com (CommuniGate Pro SMTP 4.1) with ESMTP-TLS id 2512592 for flyrotary@lancaironline.net; Tue, 05 Aug 2003 20:36:07 -0400 Received: (qmail 8886 invoked by uid 89); 6 Aug 2003 00:36:14 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO Powly) (216.220.26.89) by mordor.vnet-inc.com with SMTP; 6 Aug 2003 00:36:12 -0000 Message-ID: <200308051835360700.0271E2DA@smtp.ttc-cmc.net> In-Reply-To: References: X-Mailer: Calypso Version 3.20.02.00 (3) Date: Tue, 05 Aug 2003 18:35:36 -0600 From: "Stone Tool" To: "Rotary motors in aircraft" Subject: Re: [FlyRotary] Re: Oshkosh Grumps Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Perry: I was aware of who was observing the antifreeze drops.... I just responded= to your post as it was the most recent comment. My point is essentially= that antifreeze drops such as these do not necessarily presage bearing= failure. Water pumps virtually all have a bleed hole between the seal and= the bearing to allow any seepage around the seal to escape without having= to go through the bearing. Probably the only way to determine if the= bearing is going out is to use a stethoscope. I use temperature to judge= if a bearing is going out in industrial and ag applications.... this isn't= so easy in automotive stuff. I used to rebuild a lot of engines ( automotive )... but have not for= many years, I now work only on diesel industrial stuff. At first I was= religious about replacing all associated components on any rebuilt= engine... unfortunately it seems that many of the replacement parts are of= such poor quality that replacing a good functioning part with a new or= rebuilt part does not guarantee reliability .... it often will even= increase your probability of a failure. One wants to exercise extreme= caution in aircraft applications... take no chances....... so the= inclination is to "replace first and ask questions afterward". If one= takes this approach to automotive accessories used in aircraft be damn= sure you get QUALITY stuff..... Factory original equipment is a fair bet.= Napa, Bumper to Bumper, Carquest, etc... parts are all of questionable= quality... not to mention many of the other sources we don't have around= here. It is a fair bet that if it is made in the USA for a foreign= vehicle it is junk. I have had much grief with American made stuff in= recent years. The screw the customer .... repeat business be damned= philosophy has overwhelmed American business that used to be quality= conscious. All a part of the rush to monopoly.... if you have a captive= market, they have to buy what you make even if it is junk. Borg Warner is= a classic. They have coasted on their previous reputation to the point= that I refuse to purchase anything with their name on it. We must demand= that Made In USA mean quality again.... and ultimately they will begin to= provide what we want just as happened in the automobile industry after= much pain and market loss. We must vote with our dollar.. the only vote= Americans have that counts for much anymore. Anyway if one replaces such a critical part be sure it is obtained from a= reputable manufacturer... preferably one in Japan. H.W. *********** REPLY SEPARATOR *********** On 8/5/03 at 6:32 AM Perry Mick wrote: >Hi Howard, good to hear from you. It was Tracy who noticed the drops of >coolant. Both of my failures two years ago were bearing failures. > >Stone Tool wrote: > >>Perry: >> The water pump bearings are a surface to surface seal with a spring >loaded neoprene piece that turns against a ceramic wear surface. Leakage >in these seals is not uncommon, and does not necessarily indicate any real >problem. A bit of build up of engine sludge or a bit of grit will make >them seep slightly. This does not indicate a problem with the bearing, >and often does not even indicate a real problem with the seal. I have >seen the telltale drop of coolant on virtually new pumps. It is not a >warning of impending failure..... if your pump is not old, don't worry too >much about it. >> >> H.W. >> >> >>*********** REPLY SEPARATOR *********** >> >>On 8/4/03 at 9:07 PM Perry Mick wrote: >> >> >> >>>Tracy Crook wrote: >>> >>> >>> >>>>Saw the first sign of waterpump failure on the engine. Noticed a drop >of >>>>coolant hanging from the pump pulley every morning when I took the >>>> >>>> >>>cowl off >>> >>> >>>>to begin another day of talking airplanes & engines. No noticable play >>>> >>>> >>>in >>> >>> >>>>the pump bearings and I noticed no drop in coolant pressure on the way >>>> >>>> >>>home >>> >>> >>>>but a new pump is definitely in order. This was the original pump I= got >>>>with the 1988 13B engine I bought back in 1992. >>>> >>>> >>>>Tracy Crook >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>The water pumps went out in my '86 plane and my '86 car two years ago, >>>so it is about right that your '88 water pump should be failing now. >>>They last exactly 15 years :) >>> >>>-- >>>Perry Mick >>>http://www.ductedfan.com >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> > > > >>> Homepage: http://www.flyrotary.com/ >>> Archive: http://lancaironline.net/lists/flyrotary/List.html