X-Virus-Scanned: clean according to Sophos on Logan.com Return-Path: Sender: To: lml@lancaironline.net Date: Mon, 24 Jun 2013 12:26:53 -0400 Message-ID: X-Original-Return-Path: Received: from nm5-vm4.bullet.mail.ne1.yahoo.com ([98.138.91.165] verified) by logan.com (CommuniGate Pro SMTP 6.0.5) with ESMTPS id 6346548 for lml@lancaironline.net; Mon, 24 Jun 2013 12:20:13 -0400 Received-SPF: none receiver=logan.com; client-ip=98.138.91.165; envelope-from=chris_zavatson@yahoo.com Received: from [98.138.101.132] by nm5.bullet.mail.ne1.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 24 Jun 2013 16:19:37 -0000 Received: from [98.138.87.12] by tm20.bullet.mail.ne1.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 24 Jun 2013 16:19:28 -0000 Received: from [127.0.0.1] by omp1012.mail.ne1.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 24 Jun 2013 16:19:28 -0000 X-Yahoo-Newman-Property: ymail-3 X-Yahoo-Newman-Id: 348612.75089.bm@omp1012.mail.ne1.yahoo.com Received: (qmail 69712 invoked by uid 60001); 24 Jun 2013 16:19:28 -0000 DomainKey-Signature:a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=s1024; d=yahoo.com; h=X-YMail-OSG:Received:X-Rocket-MIMEInfo:X-Mailer:References:Message-ID:Date:From:Reply-To:Subject:To:In-Reply-To:MIME-Version:Content-Type; b=BTBuHAdxNRuqjp0r5Xe5MQSILaDCuljyTKw3j0F93ty4KZKBMAvfgx20Bc3pQ3wubQY9A1x41p3Dko+Ek+FDCMZ7jvLuPZlQCEbqIHnzeD0M9qgZa6usHGkIabgNYIKJ4JdsIjAjReDIGHsePaTTDI4eDYlOg3ukcsZL2P+PkMY=; X-YMail-OSG: KPQhpIkVM1m9S2OSkg6ecxBFxGdKwbmPRXwHqhlvhVSB1hp gfVJJRIeYqBbmaxRwiLooKxSydYXx1RfbVMxeXfQMmPewo7cRuAaj96MD6Bk ANY_CXeLxHaCcwpDIks987kUaihJ4b79rj_rzmzq9AhmTRUAGehxz8LviIaY ZQmsLpCePNU.9sbupy9DW5PsFwR_E9hpcsRPR2FQpsHWCo4.tj.RZ_M5iMlz EjXyAnS.edBCwSLsHUSsPMUhIyRCyeklKcz4AkWJtUOcMFtflBSTETtyNuRg YEMLvFqXjpRBlaaXXhXyVPF89T2XK.hh98WvBoA4PQfi2ix21ei9gkwDb2AI _9spVXE25GCW1PxEPVerxNHS4ntp5fSM_hgmp84maA7all1KAQTBuPFqlyxa lFqk15G.igsF1Hh57hetHf6BLzLAGHRCOtgM0ZZ8mh7fUx2SN1Gj6R_sSugX puq.rdM3fRUfCxdEgf36dtm1Q3wl19EWNUpEeY11OJMOwRBw3nZxB.uf7TyJ 5OwqEx2FWD__2E0YA2paJv7kZgXS1AByTrZr4b9DQKCMIOdkHNe0KF.QeF77 2HrUxy2PMaL0vF5153wWgQJW8upJQ7CqDFefwP6tWg2Ts6RzI Received: from [172.14.16.72] by web121606.mail.ne1.yahoo.com via HTTP; Mon, 24 Jun 2013 09:19:27 PDT X-Rocket-MIMEInfo: 002.001,IkknbSBhbGwgZWxlY3RyaWMgc28gSSBzaG91bGQgZGV2ZWxvcCBhIHJlcGxhY2VtZW50IHByb2dyYW0sIGJ1dCB0aGUgZGFybiB0aGluZ3MgYXJlIHNvIGJ1bGxldHByb29mIEkgZG9uJ3Qga25vdyB3aGF0IHRoZSBjeWNsZSBzaG91bGQgYmUuwqAgTWF5YmUgb25lIGV2ZXJ5IHR3byB5ZWFycz_CoCBBbnlvbmUgaGF2ZSBhZHZpY2UgYWJvdXQgdGhhdD8iCgpKb2huLApJIHdvdWxkIHN1Z2dlc3QgdXNpbmcgdGhlIGFubnVhbCBjYXBhY2l0eSBjaGVjayBhcyBhIGd1aWRlIChBQyA0My4xM0IpLsKgIE92ZXIgbXkBMAEBAQE- X-Mailer: YahooMailWebService/0.8.148.554 References: X-Original-Message-ID: <1372090767.63401.YahooMailNeo@web121606.mail.ne1.yahoo.com> X-Original-Date: Mon, 24 Jun 2013 09:19:27 -0700 (PDT) From: Chris Zavatson Reply-To: Chris Zavatson Subject: Re: [LML] Re: Odyssey Batteries X-Original-To: Lancair Mailing List In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="1458340343-630217812-1372090767=:63401" --1458340343-630217812-1372090767=:63401 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable "I'm all electric so I should develop a replacement program, but the darn t= hings are so bulletproof I don't know what the cycle should be.=A0 Maybe on= e every two years?=A0 Anyone have advice about that?"=0A=0AJohn,=0AI would = suggest using the annual capacity check as a guide (AC 43.13B).=A0 Over my = last 15 annual conditions inspections, the capacity test has=A0proven to be= =A0a good indicator of=A0a fading=A0battery long before showing any outward= signs of trouble- such as during engine cranking.=A0 As long as capacities= remained=A0steady in the high 90's everything was good.=A0 Once capacities= start on a downward trajectory, time is running out.=0A=A0=0AChris Zavatso= n=0AN91CZ=0A360std=0Awww.N91CZ.net=0A=0AFrom: John Barrett <2thman1@gmail.c= om>=0ATo: lml@lancaironline.net =0ASent: Monday, June 24, 2013 5:32 AM=0ASu= bject: [LML] Re: Odyssey Batteries=0A=0A=0AI'll chime in too I guess.=0A=0A= Am on my second set of two PC 680s.=A0 My system sounds like a clone of Fre= d's.=A0 It has two separate busses, 70 amp alt on one side normally operati= ng at about 36 amps and 20 amp B&C on the other bus and it usually draws ab= out 7 amps during cruise flight.=A0 X-tie occurs at startup, in any bus fai= lure and can be manually selected.=A0 Main difference is mine is controlled= automatically by Vertical Power VP 200.=0A=0AThe first set of batteries gr= ew tired due to terrible abuse over several years in build shops,=A0 they w= ere recharged most of the time with older chargers and were drained and rec= harged so many times, estimating the number would be impossible.=A0 =0A=0AI= replaced both a bit over a year ago and now use a battery minder that is c= ompatible to the extent that both manuals (battery and charger) reference t= he other brand and indicate the settings to be used.=0A=0AEarly in my fligh= t testing program I had plaguing electrical issues that would frequently ki= ck the electrical to the E bus and often times would even fail that.=A0 I c= an't say that necessarily put extra stress on the batteries, but I don't im= agine it was particularly good for any part of the system.=A0 =0A=0AI was d= oing a lot of charging last year during the time we were trying to identify= and solve the problem.=A0 That was prior to acquisition of the minder but = the batteries were never drained or particularly stressed I don't think.=0A= =0ANow the electrical busses are properly balanced so the electrical perfor= ms correctly and the batteries seem to be very happy.=A0 I still put the mi= nder on after I run electrical on the ground or leave it for a period of ti= me.=A0 The batteries take up little space on the fire wall and since real e= state under the cowl is precious, that's good.=A0 They are relatively light= weight so there is very little down side to these.=A0 I'm all electric so = I should develop a replacement program, but the darn things are so bulletpr= oof I don't know what the cycle should be.=A0 Maybe one every two years?=A0= Anyone have advice about that?=0A=0AThe old Odyssey batteries I took out l= ast year are still around.=A0 I tried to charge one of them and it never re= ached the charged stage in 24 hours.=A0 I've got it on the recondition cycl= e as of last night and it will be interesting to see if it recovers.=0A=0AJ= ohn Barrett=0A=0A=0A=0ASent from my iPad=0A=0A=0AOn Jun 23, 2013, at 4:41 A= M, WAYNE F MARSHALL wrote:=0A=0A> =0A> I love my Odys= sey batteries installed in my Legacy. Going strong for 5 years now. Even if= I don't fly for a month because of weather, maintenance or travel, when I = return and crank it is like they are brand new!=0A> Wayne Marshall=0A> N54K= M=0A> =0A> =0A> --=0A> For archives and unsub http://mail.lancaironline.net= :81/lists/lml/List.html=0A=0A--=0AFor archives and unsub http://mail.lancai= ronline.net:81/lists/lml/List.html --1458340343-630217812-1372090767=:63401 Content-Type: text/html; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
"I'm all electric so I should develop a replacement = program, but the darn things are so bulletproof I don't know what the cycle= should be.  Maybe one every two years?  Anyone have advice about= that?"

John,
I would suggest using the annual capacit= y check as a guide (AC 43.13B).  Over my= last 15 annual conditions inspections, the capacity test has proven t= o be a good indicator of a fading battery long before showin= g any outward signs of trouble- such as during engine cranking.  As lo= ng as capacities remained steady in the high 90's everything was good.=   Once capacities start on a downward trajectory, time is running out.=
 
Chris Zavatson
N91CZ
360std

From: John Barrett <2thman1@gmail.com&= gt;
To: lml@lancaironlin= e.net
Sent: Monday, Jun= e 24, 2013 5:32 AM
Subject:<= /B> [LML] Re: Odyssey Batteries

I'll chime in too I = guess.

Am on my second set of two PC 680s.  My system sounds li= ke a clone of Fred's.  It has two separate busses, 70 amp alt on one s= ide normally operating at about 36 amps and 20 amp B&C on the other bus= and it usually draws about 7 amps during cruise flight.  X-tie occurs= at startup, in any bus failure and can be manually selected.  Main di= fference is mine is controlled automatically by Vertical Power VP 200.
<= BR>The first set of batteries grew tired due to terrible abuse over several= years in build shops,  they were recharged most of the time with olde= r chargers and were drained and recharged so many times, estimating the num= ber would be impossible. 

I replaced both a bit over a year ag= o and now use a battery minder that is compatible to the extent that both m= anuals (battery and charger) reference the other brand and indicate the settings to be used.

Early in my flight testing program I had plagu= ing electrical issues that would frequently kick the electrical to the E bu= s and often times would even fail that.  I can't say that necessarily = put extra stress on the batteries, but I don't imagine it was particularly = good for any part of the system. 

I was doing a lot of chargin= g last year during the time we were trying to identify and solve the proble= m.  That was prior to acquisition of the minder but the batteries were= never drained or particularly stressed I don't think.

Now the elect= rical busses are properly balanced so the electrical performs correctly and= the batteries seem to be very happy.  I still put the minder on after= I run electrical on the ground or leave it for a period of time.  The= batteries take up little space on the fire wall and since real estate unde= r the cowl is precious, that's good.  They are relatively light weight so there is very little down side to these.  I'm all electric = so I should develop a replacement program, but the darn things are so bulle= tproof I don't know what the cycle should be.  Maybe one every two yea= rs?  Anyone have advice about that?

The old Odyssey batteries I= took out last year are still around.  I tried to charge one of them a= nd it never reached the charged stage in 24 hours.  I've got it on the= recondition cycle as of last night and it will be interesting to see if it= recovers.

John Barrett



Sent from my iPad


= On Jun 23, 2013, at 4:41 AM, WAYNE F MARSHALL <paradoxmaybe@me.com> wrote:

>
> I love my Odyssey batteries installed in = my Legacy. Going strong for 5 years now. Even if I don't fly for a month be= cause of weather, maintenance or travel, when I return and crank it is like they are brand new!
> Wayne Marshall
> N54KM
>
= >
> --
> For archives and unsub http://mail.lancairon= line.net:81/lists/lml/List.html

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