X-Virus-Scanned: clean according to Sophos on Logan.com Return-Path: Sender: To: lml@lancaironline.net Date: Mon, 29 Apr 2013 01:13:42 -0400 Message-ID: X-Original-Return-Path: Received: from carbinge.com ([69.5.27.218] verified) by logan.com (CommuniGate Pro SMTP 6.0.4) with SMTP id 6230414 for lml@lancaironline.net; Sun, 28 Apr 2013 10:23:13 -0400 Received-SPF: none receiver=logan.com; client-ip=69.5.27.218; envelope-from=jbarrett@carbinge.com Received: (qmail 12402 invoked from network); 28 Apr 2013 14:22:38 -0000 DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; h=X-Originating-IP:Reply-To:From:To:References:In-Reply-To:Subject:Date:Message-ID:MIME-Version:Content-Type:X-Mailer:Content-Language:Thread-Index; s=default; d=carbinge.com; b=AOZDVpoxJ+66SkaX5HcspU1TY5MJic6d+7aQvLQ8bOyKrCgBC25QXLMe6TkKsgv8y+jT+puxLLpokYl+3s7JshLLThpPiMyC/+FkAmCkvd7bDVcmLbvbfA5eGPc87IHkKPLPVNs7zzSBAHGGtobciOHEcjpE5MC5zlsAIYPyrdQ=; X-Originating-IP: [66.235.58.245] Reply-To: From: "John Barrett" X-Original-To: "'Lancair Mailing List'" References: In-Reply-To: Subject: RE: [LML] Circuit Breakers vs. fuses X-Original-Date: Sun, 28 Apr 2013 07:22:36 -0700 X-Original-Message-ID: <01e701ce441b$d56784a0$80368de0$@com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_01E8_01CE43E1.2908ACA0" X-Mailer: Microsoft Office Outlook 12.0 Content-Language: en-us Thread-Index: Ac5EEvm3il9RxsS9R86+bxDedNdepgABk1IQ This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_01E8_01CE43E1.2908ACA0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Some have already mentioned Vertical Power solution to this issue and I feel the need to report on the VP 200 that I have in my LIVP. It's really a fantastic system that is a huge leap forward from our standard circuit breakers in my opinion. Not only does it give you direct control of all the circuits in your airplane, but additionally it provides tremendous amount of information about each individual circuit if you want to go look, (including where it is wired and how much current it is drawing) it tells you every circuit that is not operating correctly (you'll get an immediate fault message), and detailed graphic/numerical details on the performance of the overall system. There are many other advantages and a few complications added probably because I don't quite know how to use all the features to their ultimate design extent. Drawbacks: The control buttons on my VP 200 are very touchy and they make it difficult to select a particular circuit or function. The Chelton and Garmin units in my airplane have buttons that make a noticeable tactile click when you rotate or push that signals the change to the next selection. The VP does not. Finally, there is at least one function that is not integrating with the rest of my system - that being fuel level indication. The gauges on the VP read about twice the actual fuel. Fortunately the Chelton system gives me the correct data. I have been unable to get a resolution to this problem although have been asking for a fix for over a year. Promises made and then delays. I know they have new products they are very interested in supporting and I hope they do not treat their earlier ones as orphans. They are responsive with other problems that need immediate attention so I am not inferring total neglect, just that this one probably requires a programming fix and I'm not sure when they'll get to it. John Barrett N31VP From: Lancair Mailing List [mailto:lml@lancaironline.net] On Behalf Of Tom & Beth Sullivan Sent: Sunday, April 28, 2013 6:19 AM To: lml@lancaironline.net Subject: [LML] Circuit Breakers vs. fuses Returning from Sun & Fun a few weeks ago, I had stopped in Asheville NC to pick up my wife and see my dad. It had rained really hard while I was in Lakeland and I suspect some water penetrated the TKS panels on the wings (Mooney Rocket). Flew back to the U.P. of MI non-stop at FL 180 until about Lake Michigan where I needed FL 220 to stay out of clouds and significant icing. (N1017L for those Flight Aware addicts). About 10 minutes before penetrating the precip I turned the TKS on to high mode and after a couple minutes, no fluid? Looked at the control panel and no lights; looked at the circuit breaker and it had popped. I tried it again and it popped after about 30 seconds. Oh crap! Reset breaker and tried de-ice on low mode, and it ran fine. Luckily it ran enough fluid to keep the ice off through the 30 minute decent. When I was a couple minutes from breaking out (based on my home bas KIMT AWOS report), I tried high mode again and it worked fine. As noted above, I suspect a bit of water in the panels had froze up in the flight levels, and the "low" TKS power setting must have done the trick. Now, what if I had "fuses" located out of reach?? Will be wiring up the IVPT soon and using breakers. It is still up to the operator to use enough common sense to keep a breaker system safe. Tom ------=_NextPart_000_01E8_01CE43E1.2908ACA0 Content-Type: text/html; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

Some have already mentioned Vertical Power solution to this issue and = I feel the need to report on the VP 200 that I have in my LIVP.  = It’s really a fantastic system that is a huge leap forward from = our standard circuit breakers in my opinion.  Not only does it give = you direct control of all the circuits in your airplane, but = additionally it provides tremendous amount of information about each = individual circuit if you want to go look, (including where it is wired = and how much current it is drawing) it tells you every circuit that is = not operating correctly (you’ll get an immediate fault message), = and detailed graphic/numerical details on the performance of the overall = system.  There are many other advantages and a few complications = added probably because I don’t quite know how to use all the = features to their ultimate design extent.

 

Drawbacks:  The control buttons on my VP 200 are very touchy and = they make it difficult to select a particular circuit or function.  = The Chelton and Garmin units in my airplane have buttons that make a = noticeable tactile click when you rotate or push that signals the change = to the next selection.  The VP does not.  =

 

Finally, there is at least one function that is not integrating with = the rest of my system – that being fuel level indication.  = The gauges on the VP read about twice the actual fuel.  Fortunately = the Chelton system gives me the correct data.  I have been unable = to get a resolution to this problem although have been asking for a fix = for over a year.  Promises made and then delays.  I know they = have new products they are very interested in supporting and I hope they = do not treat their earlier ones as orphans.  They are responsive = with other problems that need immediate attention so I am not inferring = total neglect, just that this one probably requires a programming fix = and I’m not sure when they’ll get to = it.

 

John Barrett

N31VP

 

From:= = Lancair Mailing List [mailto:lml@lancaironline.net] On Behalf Of = Tom & Beth Sullivan
Sent: Sunday, April 28, 2013 6:19 = AM
To: lml@lancaironline.net
Subject: [LML] Circuit = Breakers vs. fuses

 

   = Returning from Sun & Fun a few weeks ago, I had stopped in Asheville = NC to pick up my wife and see my dad.  It had rained really hard = while I was in Lakeland and I suspect some water penetrated the TKS = panels on the wings (Mooney Rocket).  Flew back to the U.P. of MI = non-stop at FL 180 until about Lake Michigan where I needed FL 220 to = stay out of clouds and significant icing.  (N1017L for those Flight = Aware addicts).

 

   = About 10 minutes before penetrating the precip I turned the TKS on to = high mode and after a couple minutes, no fluid?  Looked at the = control panel and no lights; looked at the circuit breaker and it had = popped.  I tried it again and it popped after about 30 = seconds.  Oh crap!  Reset breaker and tried de-ice on low = mode, and it ran fine.  Luckily it ran enough fluid to keep the ice = off through the 30 minute decent.  When I was a couple minutes = from breaking out (based on my home bas KIMT AWOS report), I = tried high mode again and it worked fine.  As noted above, I = suspect a bit of water in the panels had froze up in the flight levels, = and the "low" TKS power setting must have done the = trick.

 

Now, what if = I had "fuses" located out of = reach??

 

Will be = wiring up the IVPT soon and using breakers.  It is still up to the = operator to use enough common sense to keep a breaker system = safe.

 

Tom

 

 

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