X-Virus-Scanned: clean according to Sophos on Logan.com Return-Path: Sender: To: lml@lancaironline.net Date: Wed, 29 Aug 2012 15:49:30 -0400 Message-ID: X-Original-Return-Path: Received: from mail-yx0-f180.google.com ([209.85.213.180] verified) by logan.com (CommuniGate Pro SMTP 6.0c1) with ESMTPS id 5734735 for lml@lancaironline.net; Wed, 29 Aug 2012 13:08:31 -0400 Received-SPF: pass receiver=logan.com; client-ip=209.85.213.180; envelope-from=pjdmiller@gmail.com Received: by yenl8 with SMTP id l8so128604yen.25 for ; Wed, 29 Aug 2012 10:07:54 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.236.76.198 with SMTP id b46mr2203706yhe.117.1346260074598; Wed, 29 Aug 2012 10:07:54 -0700 (PDT) X-Original-Return-Path: Received: from [192.168.1.100] ([68.202.61.255]) by mx.google.com with ESMTPS id e5sm46260264yhk.21.2012.08.29.10.07.53 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=OTHER); Wed, 29 Aug 2012 10:07:53 -0700 (PDT) From: Paul Miller Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="Apple-Mail=_B3D031C8-265B-40F4-A46C-5892D5202446" X-Original-Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 (Mac OS X Mail 6.0 \(1486\)) Subject: Re: [LML] Re: Performance Engine TSIO 550 X-Original-Date: Wed, 29 Aug 2012 13:07:52 -0400 References: X-Original-To: "Lancair Mailing List" In-Reply-To: X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.1486) --Apple-Mail=_B3D031C8-265B-40F4-A46C-5892D5202446 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252 If all the people who had trouble with this engine producer filed SDRs = then there might be a proper investigative record. That is likely the = first step needed to create a trail for someone to take action. I tried to file an SDR for my failed starter adapter and it was so = difficult to get the proper details filed online that I gave up. =20 Paul Legacy On 2012-08-29, at 12:54 PM, "Wolfgang" wrote: > Why has the FAA not shut these guys (Performance Aero Engines Inc.) = down ? ? > =20 > Wolfgang > ----- Original Message ----- > From: Ronald STEVENS > To: lml@lancaironline.net > Sent: Wednesday, August 29, 2012 5:52 AM > Subject: Re: [LML] Performance Engine TSIO 550 >=20 > In my opinion, SOON, should be NOW, no kidding I had an Performance = Engine on my Velocity and the bolts came of from the cylinders as they = were torqued wrong. I had 2 bolts coming off the engine and going = through the propeller. >=20 > Thank god they actually damaged the prop so we had to start looking = for the why....well it was ugly. This engine had only 200 hours on it. > Oh and I did managed to talk to them 1 time, and they came with some = BS story that the bolt might broke off because of some gas trapped = inside the metal......sure.....and they believe in Santa too lol >=20 > We had a rocker failure before (at 100 hours) and for me this engine = was a nightmare. Definitely do the overhaul, get the engine back to = specs, and forget about the 400HP they claim....is BS anyway, as you = will never use this, not even on takeoff as you really do not need 400hp = to take off in a IV-p >=20 > So do yourself and your family a favor...... >=20 > Just my opinion, Ronald >=20 >=20 > On Aug 28, 2012, at 4:30 PM, John Barrett wrote: >=20 >> OK, >> Thanks to the many who responded on List and off to my question. = Still haven=92t come to a decision what to ultimately do, but it=92s = almost 100% assured there is an engine tear down in my future =96 and = SOON. >> Lots of constructive input that I appreciate immensely. >> It=92s confirmed what we all have known for few years. Almost all = (good) roads lead to Barrett Performance Engines. >> John Barrett >> From: Lancair Mailing List [mailto:lml@lancaironline.net] On Behalf = Of N66mg@aol.com >> Sent: Monday, August 27, 2012 5:03 AM >> To: lml@lancaironline.net >> Subject: [LML] Re: Performance Engine TSIO 550 >> To all that need a good engine rebuilder, I had my Glasair engine = rebuilt by LyCom in Vasilia, CA...When it was rebuilt and installed, = thats when I was glad they did the rebuild...Ran so smooth and with = increased power, same amount of gallons per hour and increase in = speed...=46rom 183kts to 191 kts...I was very happy, they delivered what = they promised...That's my 2 cents >> Michael Giardino >> n7sz L-IV 98%=20 >> In a message dated 8/26/2012 7:54:24 A.M. Pacific Daylight Time, = n5zq@verizon.net writes: >> John, >> I have a Performance Engine. With zero time on it, I sent it to = Barrett Precision Engines http://www.bpaengines.com/site.html in Tulsa = for complete teardown and overhaul due to the problems that many others = have had with Performance. Even if no metal was showing up, you=92ll = never have any confidence in your engine. I believe that everyone on the = list who has dealt with Barrett will give them a strong recommendation. = Bite the bullet and send it to Barrett (maybe you=92ll get a family = discount? :-)=20 >> Bill Harrelson >> N5ZQ 320 2,050 hrs. >> N6ZQ IV under construction >> http://www.mykitlog.com/harrelson/ >> From: John Barrett >> Sent: Saturday, August 25, 2012 8:56 AM >> To: lml@lancaironline.net >> Subject: [LML] Performance Engine TSIO 550 >> Hello all, >> I have a quandary with this engine and am hoping to get some help in = solving it. >> I have about 60 hours on the engine now and it runs quite well. Due = to the worries related to Fred Moreno=92s problem with his engine and = various others I was highly concerned about the safety of operating my = L-IVP with this power plant. To that end I=92ve been monitoring it = closely and have been doing frequent oil changes to look for developing = problems.=20 >> All parameters have been good except there was silicone early on in = the oil (first change was at 5 hours then at about 15, then at 35 hours = and another later on.) and a slight elevation in aluminum. Second oil = change still have the silicon and aluminum was much higher. Also there = was a bit of metal flakes in the filter element =96 non magnetic. Last = oil change was even higher aluminum and silicon still elevated. The oil = filter element looked like it had glitter applied to it. Blackstone has = been doing the oil analysis. I sent the last filter element to Howard = Fenton (2nd oilpinion in Oklahoma) and he expressed concern and advised = to quit flying until the problem is figured out.=20 >> He says the only metal found is aluminum and he=92s never seen or = heard of that. Always in his experience there would be some other metal = showing up in excess as well because there isn=92t a place in the engine = he=92s aware of the aluminum rubs against aluminum. >> I discovered after the second oil change that the alternate air door = was not closing completely and that probably explains the silicon. >> I did compression check a couple of days ago and got normal readings = =96 80/75 to 77. >> I don=92t have a plan about how to trouble shoot the origin of this = metal. I notice that cylinder #5 runs hottest egt=92s during warmup but = other than that I can=92t think of anything out of the ordinary. >> Does anyone have a suggestion about how to sleuth out this problem? >> Regards, >> John Barrett, CEO >> Leading Edge Composites >> PO Box 428 >> Port Hadlock, WA 98339 >> www.carbinge.com --Apple-Mail=_B3D031C8-265B-40F4-A46C-5892D5202446 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Type: text/html; charset=windows-1252 If = all the people who had trouble with this engine producer filed SDRs then = there might be a proper investigative record.   That is likely the = first step needed to create a trail for someone to take = action.

I tried to file an SDR for my failed starter = adapter and it was so difficult to get the proper details filed online = that I gave up. =  

Paul
Legacy

On 2012-08-29, at 12:54 PM, "Wolfgang" <Wolfgang@MiCom.net> = wrote:

Why has the = FAA not shut these guys (Performance Aero Engines Inc.) down ? = ?
 
Wolfgang
----- Original Message -----
 Wednesday, August 29, 2012 = 5:52 AM
Subject: Re: [LML] Performance = Engine TSIO 550

In my opinion, SOON, should be NOW, = no kidding I had an Performance Engine on my Velocity and the bolts came = of from the cylinders as they were torqued wrong. I had 2 bolts coming = off the engine and going through the propeller.

Thank = god they actually damaged the prop so we had to start looking for the = why....well it was ugly. This engine had only 200 hours on = it.
Oh and I did managed to talk to them 1 time, and they came = with some BS story that the bolt might broke off because of some gas = trapped inside the metal......sure.....and they believe in Santa too = lol

We had a rocker failure before (at 100 = hours) and for me this engine was a nightmare. Definitely do the = overhaul, get the engine back to specs, and forget about the 400HP they = claim....is BS anyway, as you will never use this, not even on takeoff = as you really do not need 400hp to take off in a = IV-p

So do yourself and your family a = favor......

Just my opinion, = Ronald


On Aug 28, 2012, at 4:30 = PM, John Barrett wrote:

OK,
Thanks to the many who responded on List and off to = my question.  Still haven=92t come to a decision what to ultimately = do, but it=92s almost 100% assured there is an engine tear down in my = future =96 and SOON.
Lots of constructive input that I appreciate = immensely.
It=92s confirmed what we all have known for few = years.  Almost all (good) roads lead to Barrett Performance = Engines.
John Barrett
 Lancair Mailing List = [mailto:lml@lancaironline.net] On Behalf Of N66mg@aol.com
Sent: Monday, August 27, 2012 = 5:03 AM
To:  [LML] Re: Performance = Engine TSIO 550
To all that = need a good engine rebuilder,  I had my Glasair engine rebuilt by = LyCom in Vasilia, CA...When it was rebuilt and installed, = thats when I was glad they did the rebuild...Ran so smooth and with = increased power, same amount of gallons per hour and increase in = speed...=46rom 183kts to 191 kts...I was very happy, they delivered = what they promised...That's      my 2 centsMichael Giardino
n7sz  L-IV  = 98% 
In a message = dated 8/26/2012 7:54:24 A.M. Pacific Daylight Time, n5zq@verizon.net writes:
John,
 Saturday, August 25, 2012 = 8:56 AM
<= /blockquote>

= --Apple-Mail=_B3D031C8-265B-40F4-A46C-5892D5202446--