X-Virus-Scanned: clean according to Sophos on Logan.com Return-Path: Sender: To: lml@lancaironline.net Date: Mon, 04 Apr 2011 02:40:35 -0400 Message-ID: X-Original-Return-Path: Received: from nm28-vm0.bullet.mail.sp2.yahoo.com ([98.139.91.234] verified) by logan.com (CommuniGate Pro SMTP 5.4c2) with SMTP id 4930372 for lml@lancaironline.net; Sat, 02 Apr 2011 09:03:10 -0400 Received-SPF: none receiver=logan.com; client-ip=98.139.91.234; envelope-from=anpfield@sbcglobal.net Received: from [98.139.91.62] by nm28.bullet.mail.sp2.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 02 Apr 2011 13:02:35 -0000 Received: from [98.139.91.37] by tm2.bullet.mail.sp2.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 02 Apr 2011 13:02:35 -0000 Received: from [127.0.0.1] by omp1037.mail.sp2.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 02 Apr 2011 13:02:35 -0000 X-Yahoo-Newman-Id: 104114.28614.bm@omp1037.mail.sp2.yahoo.com Received: (qmail 18872 invoked from network); 2 Apr 2011 13:02:34 -0000 DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=s1024; d=sbcglobal.net; h=DKIM-Signature:Received:X-Yahoo-SMTP:X-YMail-OSG:X-Yahoo-Newman-Property:From:To:References:Subject:Date:Message-ID:MIME-Version:Content-Type:X-Mailer:X-MimeOLE:Thread-Index:In-Reply-To; b=dK2qjAtwpKixh13HBjk10634N5vktLOCT8wo6NmnvK3DIeuzIjbWm7N3qBPsygV6Xc+TrCCcEfVKHjFXRT7O7xRTd4bylmSVvMk3jkv8U5XZVW7aCthLaXfQcAJZJk1zFCumAhnvrVjrucyFoyeREjb3PF14NvyHa2bDUdMjyWo= ; Received: from pbfaviation (anpfield@70.230.161.162 with login) by smtp102.sbc.mail.mud.yahoo.com with SMTP; 02 Apr 2011 06:02:34 -0700 PDT X-Yahoo-SMTP: M2dqCgKswBDQjE8MoF8jSmCdTsUI2v7j63ZxcFoNP0Q8o1U- X-YMail-OSG: 7YbNkW4VM1nToPRXqELkvdPRs01peAfz80gnM3J9IFhSyhz aIECR1n7hlR0PG7tbJeGcv92dFmLTgS531Eo9Mg7kWlCQFt6nzGGvq.lvtHx 18U0Ut7VlgnIdb7nf22lOPGmQ8coIcnVmZYUg2GBbAWKbUe6yTEV9sw04Uhx W_6GGE7zaY7wkZGvD1amydGxI.LJMSnypNVycl_2o1wk4zUrzepqOZ3qGPHB UnrESdvDFFx106Mbl_Fzuqqep.QPst8Pp1FXoJaaW34A7J8VskIBJ3z5PONj TeJ5g5Bm3Pu_t_9aGzF36YbRs6tSx9klqKTLkVD05x2X2Qbi_cwJSIByDYKl zoBlKEFumu4ST8OTzT2nukGLFGMkYOgpHHQoSRhxabJ3Jy8Y- X-Yahoo-Newman-Property: ymail-3 From: "Peter Field" X-Original-To: =?iso-8859-1?Q?'Tim_J=F8rgensen'?= , References: Subject: RE: True "composite" question X-Original-Date: Sat, 2 Apr 2011 08:02:41 -0500 X-Original-Message-ID: <311D2CD237D74C828BB07B381C0A3C89@pbfaviation> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0087_01CBF10C.5788DD40" X-Mailer: Microsoft Office Outlook 11 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.5994 Thread-Index: AcvxLAxMMTHGn5RNTACMomAk63yCiAAAPyFg In-Reply-To: This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0087_01CBF10C.5788DD40 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Tim: There is absolutely nothing wrong with the Lancair 320 airfoil. I = have been flying my 320 small tail for two years and have done a pretty = thorough stall investigation on the airplane and have found nothing abnormal. = There is sufficient stall warning and my airplane stalls pretty much straight ahead if I keep the ball centered. I took a lot of care to make sure = both wings were at the same incidence. Clean stalls occur at around 60 KIAS = and the flaps down speeds are a few knots slower. The 320 is finely = balanced and the trim curve is nearly flat. If you have built the airplane to = plans and have a forward CG empty, you should not have any worries unless you = find yourself unable to control airspeed. If I understand what you have said about reading accident reports, = you seem to have missed the universal fact that stalling any airplane can = kill you if you are close to the ground. If you are fearful of your = inability to maintain flying speed in the pattern you need to get some practice. = 200 hours over 20 years (is that actually correct?) places you in the = student pilot amateur range. What you most need to do is get some intensive = flight time in a C-150 or something with a CFI before you attempt to fly the = 320. There is a world of difference between a 320 and a 150, but some recent flight time will be of great benefit. Get yourself thoroughly familiar = with the 150's stall characteristics and get good at stall recovery. There = are any number of 320 owners who will give you some introductory flights in their airplanes, me included, before you take yours up. I don't know how to put what follows more kindly, but putting RV = wings on a 320 is, in my opinion, absurd. What you will have, if it can even = be done, is a one-of-a-kind airplane no one can advise you about and for = which there is no prior flight experience. Moreover, the 320 wing carry = through structure is not designed to support a fat wing outboard of the stub = wings - no one can tell you to what G level the airplane will be limited. What = are you going to tell the FAA or DAR, I built a kit airplane and then = modified it to ... a what? Unless your A&P friend is also an aerodynamics = expert he should stick to being a repairman. =20 Best regards,=20 Pete Field LNC2, St. Louis=20 _____ =20 From: Tim J=F8rgensen [mailto:tj@yacht-pool.dk]=20 Sent: Friday, April 01, 2011 9:35 AM To: lml@lancaironline.net Subject: True "composite" question Hi all. =20 My LNC2 is near completion and I have started preparing all the = paperwork necessary for the flight permit. During my research I have stumbeled across the NTSB website and made a search on "Lancair 360". For those of you who have not done that = (probably most!), this is HORRIFIC reading !!! There seems to be quite a large number of stall related accidents, which leads me to believe that the airfoil is basically unsafe. Anyway, I am = not going to fly this thing as is, although I have had my license for more = than 20 years and have accumulated more than 200 hrs. I have now come across a set of RV-7 wings that survived a hangar = collapse last winter. This airfoil seems much more forgiving, anyway, that is = what my A&P says, and I am trying to come up with a way to install them on my otherwise finished airframe. I will, of course, have to keep the stub = wings and make them fit the slightly larger RV wing but, apart from that, = would I be in for at lot work? Has anyone done this before? Any advice taken! =20 Regards Tim Jorgensen Lancair 360, was 95% done, now back to maybe 60%.....=20 =20 ------=_NextPart_000_0087_01CBF10C.5788DD40 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Tim:
     There=20 is absolutely nothing wrong with the Lancair 320 airfoil.  I have = been=20 flying my 320 small tail for two years and have done a pretty thorough = stall=20 investigation on the airplane and have found nothing abnormal.  = There is=20 sufficient stall warning and my airplane stalls pretty much straight = ahead if I=20 keep the ball centered.  I took a lot of care to make sure both = wings were=20 at the same incidence.  Clean stalls occur at around 60 KIAS and = the flaps=20 down speeds are a few knots slower.  The 320 is finely balanced and = the=20 trim curve is nearly flat.  If you have built the airplane to plans = and=20 have a forward CG empty, you should not have any worries unless you find = yourself unable to control airspeed.
     If I=20 understand what you have said about reading accident reports, you seem = to have=20 missed the universal fact that stalling any airplane can kill = you if=20 you are close to the ground.   If you are fearful of your = inability to=20 maintain flying speed in the pattern you need to get some = practice.  200=20 hours over 20 years (is that actually correct?) places you in the = student pilot=20 amateur range.  What you most need to do is get some intensive = flight time=20 in a C-150 or something with a CFI before you attempt to fly the = 320. =20 There is a world of difference between a 320 and a 150, but some recent = flight=20 time will be of great benefit.  Get yourself thoroughly familiar = with the=20 150's stall characteristics and get good at stall=20 recovery.   There are any number of 320 owners who will = give you=20 some introductory flights in their airplanes, me included, before you = take yours=20 up.
     =20 I don't know how to put what follows more kindly, but putting RV wings = on a 320=20 is, in my opinion, absurd.  What you will have, if it can even be = done, is=20 a one-of-a-kind airplane no one can advise you about and for which = there is=20 no prior flight experience.  Moreover, the 320 wing carry through = structure=20 is not designed to support a fat wing outboard of the stub wings - no = one can=20 tell you to what G level the airplane will be limited.  What are = you going=20 to tell the FAA or DAR, I built a kit airplane and then modified it to = ... =20 a what?  Unless your A&P friend is also an aerodynamics = expert he=20 should stick to being a repairman.
 
Best regards,=20
Pete = Field
LNC2, St. = Louis
From: Tim J=F8rgensen = [mailto:tj@yacht-pool.dk]=20
Sent: Friday, April 01, 2011 9:35 AM
To:=20 lml@lancaironline.net
Subject: True "composite"=20 question

Hi all.
 
My LNC2 is near completion and I have = started=20 preparing all the paperwork necessary for the flight = permit.
During my research I have stumbeled = across the NTSB=20 website and made a search on "Lancair 360". For those of you who = have not=20 done that (probably most!), this is HORRIFIC reading !!!
There seems to be quite a large number = of stall=20 related accidents, which leads me to believe that the airfoil is = basically=20 unsafe. Anyway, I am not going to fly this thing as is, although I have = had my=20 license for more than 20 years and have accumulated more than 200=20 hrs.
I have now come across a set of RV-7 = wings that=20 survived a hangar collapse last winter. This airfoil seems much more = forgiving,=20 anyway, that is what my A&P says, and I am trying to come up with a = way to=20 install them on my otherwise finished airframe. I will, of course, have = to keep=20 the stub wings and make them fit the slightly larger RV wing but, apart = from=20 that, would I be in for at lot work? Has anyone done this before? Any = advice=20 taken!
 
Regards
Tim Jorgensen
Lancair 360, was 95% done, now back to = maybe=20 60%..... 
  
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