X-Virus-Scanned: clean according to Sophos on Logan.com Return-Path: Sender: To: lml@lancaironline.net Date: Thu, 25 Nov 2010 17:38:16 -0500 Message-ID: X-Original-Return-Path: Received: from hrndva-omtalb.mail.rr.com ([71.74.56.124] verified) by logan.com (CommuniGate Pro SMTP 5.3.10) with ESMTP id 4592165 for lml@lancaironline.net; Thu, 25 Nov 2010 12:37:40 -0500 Received-SPF: none receiver=logan.com; client-ip=71.74.56.124; envelope-from=Wolfgang@MiCom.net X-Original-Return-Path: X-Authority-Analysis: v=1.1 cv=6ptpMFIBtxRk0xdOb6IhJTbTLVRlKjWFes7R4SsWCrA= c=1 sm=0 a=yW_sdQHftb8A:10 a=MHZY6FYWMEQOp7S43i2QIw==:17 a=Ia-xEzejAAAA:8 a=oCcaPWc0AAAA:8 a=aKOx-6gHLrG2E6rg2K4A:9 a=2Xsg_sarhufr4Dt5A7MA:7 a=K_7us3puw74_HF2lF1r_9HPgHm8A:4 a=QEXdDO2ut3YA:10 a=EzXvWhQp4_cA:10 a=PJGjKSZG51h5Y0XM:21 a=jtXmXZc_4rQEorfP:21 a=SSmOFEACAAAA:8 a=Y2VNeNrzAAAA:8 a=yMhMjlubAAAA:8 a=TW66zc2HAAAA:8 a=HQ31llbKAAAA:8 a=-QidQ3XyAAAA:8 a=r49eqBVVvjv3kUFUYXwA:9 a=oWVxVZdl0QnT8YwQ4CgA:7 a=ryk2fpIhDoy4RiFj3QWiN0VLu_IA:4 a=A0LnVcZjDxIA:10 a=MHZY6FYWMEQOp7S43i2QIw==:117 X-Cloudmark-Score: 0 X-Originating-IP: 74.218.201.50 Received: from [74.218.201.50] ([74.218.201.50:1249] helo=Lobo) by hrndva-oedge01.mail.rr.com (envelope-from ) (ecelerity 2.2.3.46 r()) with ESMTP id 7E/2C-26142-FBE9EEC4; Thu, 25 Nov 2010 17:37:03 +0000 X-Original-Message-ID: <005101cb8cc7$5e637cf0$6401a8c0@Lobo> From: "Wolfgang" X-Original-To: References: Subject: Re: [LML] Re: iPad in the cockpit - real pictures! X-Original-Date: Thu, 25 Nov 2010 12:37:01 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_004E_01CB8C9D.756E7B40" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.2180 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2180 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_004E_01CB8C9D.756E7B40 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable "It does not have the ability to wake up hundreds of miles away and ring = in, but 50 miles worked last night. This is probably due to the lack of = Ephemeris and Almanac data on the IPad, which tells the receiver where = to look when its calculating position upon startup. The cell tower data = fills in for this (my guess)." That's what the "assisted" part of AssistedGPS is all about Wolfgang ----- Original Message -----=20 From: Bob Rickard=20 To: lml@lancaironline.net=20 Sent: Thursday, November 25, 2010 10:27 AM Subject: RE: [LML] Re: iPad in the cockpit - real pictures! All =20 Trying to end this once and for all with some actual screen shots. I = did a test last night of real world GPS functionality (photo). I turned = off the cell data and did not put the IPad into airplane mode (settings = pic). Therefore it will not be able to get cell data to assist the GPS = chip to ring in. I took off from Holloman AFB to the east, then I flew = for 50 miles or so, leveled off at FL190, and made sure there was no = assistance from cell towers to be of any assistance. I then called up = ForeFlight and the GPS rang in no problem, and matches the GPS on the = Chelton system (IPad GPS pic). You can put whatever map behind this = (except weather or sat data) to navigate or use as a backup) and as long = as you have battery, you have a good setup. The pics are a little = blurry (bumpy night) but you get the idea. =20 If you are going to save battery though, and turn the IPad off for a = while until you need it, you might not get the same result. After a = couple of hours of leaving it off, I was unable to get the GPS signal = back. So I think both camps are correct in a way =E2=80=93=20 =20 The IPad does have some sort of GPS ability, but does not have the = ability to locate itself way off from where it was last used (without = cell data to bring it close, which allows the GPS to know where it is = enough to find the correct satellites). It does not have the ability to = wake up hundreds of miles away and ring in, but 50 miles worked last = night. This is probably due to the lack of Ephemeris and Almanac data = on the IPad, which tells the receiver where to look when its calculating = position upon startup. The cell tower data fills in for this (my = guess). =20 So for those of you who want to have complete GPS ability go the = Bluetooth way. If you don=E2=80=99t want another toy in the cockpit in = addition to the IPad, you can still have GPS if you want to keep the = IPad up and running after takeoff then let it ring in with cell tower = assist (or soon after you lose cell coverage, and make sure you turn the = cell data off) and make sure you have enough battery. =20 Hope this helps some folks =20 Bob Rickard IV-P =20 From: Lancair Mailing List [mailto:lml@lancaironline.net] On Behalf Of = John Barrett Sent: Tuesday, November 23, 2010 10:42 AM To: lml@lancaironline.net Subject: [LML] Re: iPad in the cockpit =20 Thanks to the several responses to my request for info on tethering. = Isaac=E2=80=99s solution sounds good since I already own a Bluetooth = GPS device. Will check it out. =20 John Barrett =20 From: Lancair Mailing List [mailto:lml@lancaironline.net] On Behalf Of = Isaac Heizer Sent: Monday, November 22, 2010 3:05 PM To: lml@lancaironline.net Subject: [LML] Re: iPad in the cockpit =20 I've been using a wi-fi only ipad plus external bluetooth gps receiver = plus foreflight since July and it works great. I had to jailbreak my ipad to get the GPS to work. I used Cydia to = jailbreak the ipad, loaded BTStack to enable ipad bluetooth GPS devices, = and purchased a MobileMate 886 Mini Bluetooth GPS receiver ($56 on = amazon) that i set on the glareshield at the start of a flight. I'm able to turn the ipad on and off in flight, and Foreflight = immediately resumes as though i never turned the ipad off because the = bluetooth GPS receiver stays locked on the satellites while I have the = ipad turned off. Does it work the same way on an ipad with its internal = GPS? In other words, can you turn the ipad off in flight, leave it off = for 30 minutes, turn the ipad on and have an immediate GPS location? Does the internal ipad GPS work just fine through a carbon fiber = fuselage top, or do you have to position the ipad in some special way? -------------------------------------------------------------------------= ----- No virus found in this message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 10.0.1153 / Virus Database: 424/3272 - Release Date: 11/22/10 ------=_NextPart_000_004E_01CB8C9D.756E7B40 Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable =EF=BB=BF
"It does = not have the=20 ability to wake up hundreds of miles away and ring in, but 50 miles = worked last=20 night.  This is probably due to the lack of Ephemeris and Almanac = data on=20 the IPad, which tells the receiver where to look when its calculating = position=20 upon startup.  The cell tower data fills in for this (my=20 guess)."
 
That's what the=20 "assisted" part of AssistedGPS is all about
 
Wolfgang
 
----- Original Message -----
From:=20 Bob=20 Rickard
Sent: Thursday, November 25, = 2010 10:27=20 AM
Subject: RE: [LML] Re: iPad in = the=20 cockpit - real pictures!

All

 

Trying=20 to end this once and for all with some actual screen shots.  I = did a test=20 last night of real world GPS functionality (photo).  I turned off = the=20 cell data and did not put the IPad into airplane mode (settings = pic). =20 Therefore it will not be able to get cell data to assist the GPS chip = to ring=20 in.  I took off from Holloman AFB to the east, then I flew for 50 = miles=20 or so, leveled off at FL190, and made sure there was no assistance = from cell=20 towers to be of any assistance.  I then called up ForeFlight and = the GPS=20 rang in no problem, and matches the GPS on the Chelton system (IPad = GPS=20 pic).  You can put whatever map behind this (except weather or = sat data)=20 to navigate or use as a backup) and as long as you have battery, you = have a=20 good setup.  The pics are a little blurry (bumpy night) but you = get the=20 idea.

 

If=20 you are going to save battery though, and turn the IPad off for a = while until=20 you need it, you might not get the same result.  After a couple = of hours=20 of leaving it off, I was unable to get the GPS signal back.  So I = think=20 both camps are correct in a way =E2=80=93

 

The=20 IPad does have some sort of GPS ability, but does not have the ability = to=20 locate itself way off from where it was last used (without cell data = to bring=20 it close, which allows the GPS to know where it is enough to find the = correct=20 satellites).  It does not have the ability to wake up hundreds of = miles=20 away and ring in, but 50 miles worked last night.  This is = probably due=20 to the lack of Ephemeris and Almanac data on the IPad, which tells the = receiver where to look when its calculating position upon = startup.  The=20 cell tower data fills in for this (my guess).

 

So=20 for those of you who want to have complete GPS ability go the = Bluetooth way.=20  If you don=E2=80=99t want another toy in the cockpit in addition = to the IPad,=20 you can still have GPS if you want to keep the IPad up and running = after=20 takeoff then let it ring in with cell tower assist (or soon after you = lose=20 cell coverage, and make sure you turn the cell data off) and make sure = you=20 have enough battery.

 

Hope=20 this helps some folks

 

Bob=20 Rickard

IV-P

 

From: Lancair = Mailing=20 List [mailto:lml@lancaironline.net] On Behalf Of John=20 Barrett
Sent: Tuesday, November 23, 2010 10:42 = AM
To:=20 lml@lancaironline.net
Subject: [LML] Re: iPad in the=20 cockpit

 

Thanks=20 to the several responses to my request for info on tethering.  = Isaac=E2=80=99s=20 solution sounds good since I   already own a Bluetooth GPS = device.=20  Will check it out.

 

John=20 Barrett

 

From: Lancair = Mailing=20 List [mailto:lml@lancaironline.net] On Behalf Of Isaac=20 Heizer
Sent: Monday, November 22, 2010 3:05 PM
To: = lml@lancaironline.net
Subject: [LML] Re: iPad in the=20 cockpit

 

I've been = using a=20 wi-fi only ipad plus external bluetooth gps receiver plus foreflight = since=20 July and it works great.

I had to jailbreak my ipad to get the = GPS to=20 work.  I used Cydia to jailbreak the ipad, loaded BTStack to = enable ipad=20 bluetooth GPS devices, and purchased a MobileMate 886 Mini Bluetooth = GPS=20 receiver ($56 on amazon) that i set on the glareshield at the start of = a=20 flight.

I'm able to turn the ipad on and off in flight, and = Foreflight=20 immediately resumes as though i never turned the ipad off because the=20 bluetooth GPS receiver stays locked on the satellites while I have the = ipad=20 turned off.  Does it work the same way on an ipad with its = internal=20 GPS?  In other words, can you turn the ipad off in flight, leave = it off=20 for 30 minutes, turn the ipad on and have an immediate GPS=20 location?

Does the internal ipad GPS work just fine through a = carbon=20 fiber fuselage top, or do you have to position the ipad in some = special=20 way?

No virus found in this message.
Checked by AVG - = www.avg.com
Version: 10.0.1153 / = Virus=20 Database: 424/3272 - Release Date:=20 11/22/10

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