X-Virus-Scanned: clean according to Sophos on Logan.com Return-Path: Sender: To: lml@lancaironline.net Date: Fri, 26 Mar 2010 16:58:13 -0400 Message-ID: X-Original-Return-Path: Received: from imr-db01.mx.aol.com ([205.188.91.95] verified) by logan.com (CommuniGate Pro SMTP 5.3.4) with ESMTP id 4180079 for lml@lancaironline.net; Fri, 26 Mar 2010 16:28:40 -0400 Received-SPF: pass receiver=logan.com; client-ip=205.188.91.95; envelope-from=Sky2high@aol.com Received: from imo-da04.mx.aol.com (imo-da04.mx.aol.com [205.188.169.202]) by imr-db01.mx.aol.com (8.14.1/8.14.1) with ESMTP id o2QKRtQh027595 for ; Fri, 26 Mar 2010 16:27:55 -0400 Received: from Sky2high@aol.com by imo-da04.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v42.9.) id q.cd0.5d380ec0 (45300) for ; Fri, 26 Mar 2010 16:27:50 -0400 (EDT) Received: from magic-d24.mail.aol.com (magic-d24.mail.aol.com [172.19.146.158]) by cia-mc04.mx.aol.com (v127_r1.2) with ESMTP id MAILCIAMC044-b0f44bad18c5288; Fri, 26 Mar 2010 16:27:49 -0400 From: Sky2high@aol.com X-Original-Message-ID: <717e9.28980528.38de72c5@aol.com> X-Original-Date: Fri, 26 Mar 2010 16:27:49 EDT Subject: Re: [LML] Re: 320 Airfoil Reflex X-Original-To: lml@lancaironline.net MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="part1_717e9.28980528.38de72c5_boundary" X-Mailer: AOL 9.5 sub 155 X-AOL-ORIG-IP: 67.175.242.202 X-AOL-IP: 172.19.146.158 X-Spam-Flag:NO X-AOL-SENDER: Sky2high@aol.com --part1_717e9.28980528.38de72c5_boundary Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Lorn, Uh, perhaps you meant the 2002 Sun 100: ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ From: Sky2high@aol.com Subject: Sun 100 Lancair finishes Date: Thu, 11 Apr 2002 18:44:35 EDT To: lancair.list@olsusa.com (http://mail.lancaironline.net:81/lists/lml/Message/12909-H.txt) (http://mail.lancaironline.net:81/lists/lml/Message/12909-P.txt) <<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<--->>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> << Lancair Builders' Mail List >> <<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<--->>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> Lancair Finishes in the 2002 Sun 100: Start#/ Speed/ Name/ Lancair-Type/ Finish/ Class/ (Alias), if known #4 (249.1 Kts) Darryl Greenamyer - Legacy - 4th 300+HP Open #6 (236.4 Kts) Rick Schrameck - Legacy - 5th 300+HP Open #8 (210.0 Kts) Larry Henney - 360 - 1st 180 HP Lancair #13 (205.6 Kts) Arnold Christen - 360 - 2nd 180 HP Lancair (Visconsin Arnie) #27 (202.2 Kts) Scott Krueger - 320 - 1st 160 HP Lancair (Grayhawk) #18 (197.3 Kts) Tom Giddings - 360 - 3rd 180 HP Lancair (U-Turn) #25 (196.0 Kts) Bill Harrelson - 320 - 2nd 160 HP Lancair (Stuka) #19 ( ) Lorn Olsen - 320 - 3rd 160 HP Lancair (Feathers) Sorted by course speed (race timed from standing start, 82 NM triangular course to Finish line). Grayhawk +++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ I believe your Chin tire had gone flat whilst taxiing to the start line. It was very hot and humid that day................. As far as Redmond, consider this posting I made in Sept 2006: ============================= From: Sky2high@aol.com Sender: Subject: Re: [LML] LNC2 320 vs 360 performance? Date: Sun, 10 Sep 2006 12:38:13 -0400 To: lml (http://mail.lancaironline.net:81/lists/lml/Message/37602-H.txt) (http://mail.lancaironline.net:81/lists/lml/Message/37602-P.txt) In a message dated 9/10/2006 8:57:22 A.M. Central Standard Time, marv@lancaironline.net writes: I would like to know if a 320 lancair with a Pen yan engine that has pistons, fuel injection, electronic ignition and all would perform much different than a 180hp 360. Ron, Yes, it would perform differently. In some cases, the 320 in cruise and at the lower altitudes can do quite well against a 360. But in climb and higher altitude performance, there is no replacement for displacement. However, each specific set up can yield vastly different results. What does Penn Yan do that's so special? What compression ratio do the pistons provide? Whose electronic ignition? How heavy is the airplane? How much fuel does it carry? I believe I am flying with about a 170 HP 320 (some think I have more), 9:1 CR, std fuel injection with an atomization assist, dual Light Speed EI, a Hartzell CS prop and a variety of minor airspeed enhancements. At low altitude I am only 4-5 MPH slower (Air Venture 500 mile cross country race) than my friend's "blueprinted" IO 360, 10:1 CR, MT CS prop, P-Mags, etc. I use less fuel. BUT, he really wipes me out in climb rate and speed at higher altitudes. At this year's Lancair 100, I beat all 4 of the other 320 equipped aircraft and 6 of the 7 360s that ran the race. On the flight leg from Casper WY to Redmond OR, I did not want to land for fuel so I flew at 12,500 MSL (13600 d-alt) running 20-30F LOP. Over Boise ID: 152 KIAS, 186 KTAS, 189 Kts ground speed at 6.3 gph and 29 degrees BTDC timing. That was at 19.8" MAP and 2500 RPM. Maybe someone else can provide comparative data for a 320 or 360 as I might not be the best to compare against. Scott Krueger AKA Grayhawk ================================ The tower time keepers claimed I did 210.7 Knots. I don't know what they were smoking. Scott Krueger In a message dated 3/26/2010 9:17:11 A.M. Central Daylight Time, lorn@dynacomm.us writes: Craig, My airplane cruised at 215 kts until I discovered that the static line was disconnected in the cockpit. Now that it is reconnected, my 7,500 ft max speed is 195 kts. Oh and by the way, in the last Sun & Fun 100, in 1992, I Believe, Bill Harrelson came in first and I came in second. I navigated incorrectly and flew an extra 5 miles. Bill beat me by about 20 seconds. I like to say that I have the fastest 160 hp Lancair. In the 1993 Redmond race I came in first. Scott Krueger's IO-320 is 5 to 10 kts faster than mine because he has more that 160 hp. You are either running at over 200 hp or your airspeed indicator needs to be corrected. No 160 hp Lancair can fly faster than 200 kts at altitude. Lorn > From: "Craig" > Date: March 25, 2010 3:58:01 PM EDT > > Hi Bill, > > I know a lot of others are claiming that reflex is at the faired in position. That may not be the best position. My little 320 does 215 kts at sea level. 210 is about the average cruise at 7500. I am dialing in an extra 1/2 inch (measured at the trailing edge of the flap) of reflex. While flying in formation I have determined that for my airplane this is the sweet spot. Too much will slow it down and any less will too. The difference between the faired in position and my reflex position is 7-10 kts. I also have the gaps on the flaps taped and gap seals on the ailerons. > > Craig > N73S -- Lorn H. 'Feathers' Olsen, MAA, ASMEL, ASES, Comm, Inst DynaComm, Corp., 248-345-0500, mailto:lorn@dynacomm.us LNC2, FB90/92, O-320-D1F, 1,700 hrs, N31161, Y47, SE Michigan -- For archives and unsub http://mail.lancaironline.net:81/lists/lml/List.html --part1_717e9.28980528.38de72c5_boundary Content-Type: text/html; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Lorn,
 
Uh, perhaps you meant the 2002 Sun 100:
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++=20
 
From:
 Sky2high@aol.com
Subject: Sun 100 Lancair finishes
Date: Thu, 11 Apr 2002 18:44:35 EDT
To: lancair.list@olsusa= .com
 3D"Message

= 3D"Undecode==20
       =20  <<<<<<<<<<<<<<<&l= t;--->>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
&= nbsp;         <<=20  Lancair Builders' Mail List=20  >>
        &n= bsp; <<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<= --->>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>=20
>>
Lancair Finishes in the 2002 Sun 100:

Start#/= =20 Speed/ Name/            Lancair-Type/= =20 Finish/ Class/     (Alias), if
known
#4  (249.= 1 Kts)=20 Darryl Greenamyer - Legacy - 4th 300+HP Open
#6  (236.4 Kts)= Rick=20 Schrameck - Legacy - 5th 300+HP Open
#8  (210.0 Kts) Larry= Henney=20 - 360 - 1st 180 HP Lancair
#13 (205.6 Kts) Arnold Christen - 360= - 2nd=20 180 HP Lancair (Visconsin Arnie)
#27 (202.2 Kts) Scott Krueger -= 320 -=20 1st 160 HP Lancair (Grayhawk)
#18 (197.3 Kts) Tom Giddings - 360= - 3rd=20 180 HP Lancair (U-Turn)
#25 (196.0 Kts) Bill Harrelson - 320 - 2n= d 160=20 HP Lancair (Stuka)
#19 (            = ;=20  ) Lorn Olsen - 320 - 3rd 160 HP Lancair (Feathers)

Sort= ed by=20 course speed (race timed from standing start, 82 NM triangular
c= ourse=20 to Finish line).

Grayhawk
+++++= ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
I believe yo= ur Chin tire=20 had gone flat whilst taxiing to the start line.  It was very ho= t and=20 humid that day.................
 
As far as Re= dmond,=20 consider this posting I made in Sept 2006:
=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D
=  
From: Sky2high@aol.com
Sender: <m= arv@lancaironline.net>
Subject: Re: [LML] LNC2 320 vs 360= =20 performance?
Date: Sun, 10 Sep 2006 12:38:13= =20 -0400
To: lml
3D"Message

3D"Undecoded=20
In a message dated 9/10/2006 8:57:22 A.M. Central Standar= d=20 Time, marv@lancaironline.net writes:
I woul= d like to=20 know if a 320 lancair with  a
  Pen yan engine= that=20 has pistons, fuel injection, electronic ignition and=20 all
   would perform much different than a 180h= p=20 360.
Ron,
 
Yes, it would perform differently.  In some cases,= the 320=20 in cruise and at the lower altitudes can do quite well against= a=20 360.  But in climb and higher altitude performance, there= is no=20 replacement for displacement.  However, each specific set= up=20 can yield vastly different results.
 
What does Penn Yan do that's so special?  What compr= ession=20 ratio do the pistons provide? Whose electronic ignition? = How=20 heavy is the airplane?  How much fuel does it carry?
 
I believe I am flying with about a 170 HP 320 (some think= I=20 have more), 9:1 CR, std fuel injection with an atomization ass= ist,=20 dual Light Speed EI, a Hartzell CS prop and a variety of= minor=20 airspeed enhancements. At low altitude I am only 4-5 MPH slowe= r (Air=20 Venture 500 mile cross country race) than my friend's "bluepri= nted"=20 IO 360, 10:1 CR, MT CS prop, P-Mags, etc. I use less fuel. BUT= , he=20 really wipes me out in climb rate and speed at higher=20 altitudes.
 
At this year's Lancair 100, I beat all 4 of the other 320= =20 equipped aircraft and 6 of the 7 360s that ran the race.
 
On the flight leg from Casper WY to Redmond OR, I di= d not=20 want to land for fuel so I flew at 12,500 MSL (13600 d-alt) ru= nning=20 20-30F LOP.  Over Boise ID: 152 KIAS, 186 KTAS, 189 Kts= ground=20 speed at 6.3 gph and 29 degrees BTDC timing.  That was=20 at 19.8" MAP and 2500 RPM.
 
Maybe someone else can provide comparative data for a 320= or=20 360 as I might not be the best to compare against.=20
 
Scott Krueger AKA=20 Grayhawk
=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D
The tower time keepers claimed I did 210.7 Knots. = I don't=20 know what they were smoking.
 
Scott Krueger
 
In a message dated 3/26/2010 9:17:11 A.M. Central Daylight Time,=20 lorn@dynacomm.us writes:
Craig,

My=20 airplane cruised at 215 kts until I discovered that the static line was= =20 disconnected in the cockpit. Now that it is reconnected, my 7,500 ft max= speed=20 is 195 kts.

Oh and by the way, in the last Sun & Fun 100, in= 1992,=20 I Believe, Bill Harrelson came in first and I came in second. I navigate= d=20 incorrectly and flew an extra 5 miles. Bill beat me by about 20 seconds.= I=20 like to say that I have the fastest 160 hp Lancair. In the 1993 Redmond= race I=20 came in first. Scott Krueger's IO-320 is 5 to 10 kts faster than mine be= cause=20 he has more that 160 hp.

You are either running at over 200 hp or= your=20 airspeed indicator needs to be corrected. No 160 hp Lancair can fly fast= er=20 than 200 kts at altitude.

Lorn

> From: "Craig"=20 <craig@skybolt.net>
> Date: March 25, 2010 3:58:01 PM=20 EDT
> 
> Hi Bill,
> 
> I know a lot= of=20 others are claiming that reflex is at the faired in position.  That= may=20 not be the best position.  My little 320 does 215 kts at sea level.=  =20 210 is about the average cruise at 7500.  I am dialing in an extra= 1/2=20 inch (measured at the trailing edge of the flap) of reflex.  While= flying=20 in formation I have determined that for my airplane this is the sweet=20 spot.  Too much will slow it down and any less will too.  The= =20 difference between the faired in position and my reflex position is 7-10= =20 kts.  I also have the gaps on the flaps taped  and gap seals= on the=20 ailerons.
> 
> Craig
> N73S

--
Lorn= H.=20 'Feathers' Olsen, MAA, ASMEL, ASES, Comm, Inst
DynaComm, Corp.,=20 248-345-0500, mailto:lorn@dynacomm.us
LNC2, FB90/92, O-320-D1F, 1,700= hrs,=20 N31161, Y47, SE Michigan


--
For archives and unsub=20 http://mail.lancaironline.net:81/lists/lml/List.html
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