Posted for "John Barrett" <2thman@cablespeed.com>:

 Chris' video clip is very interesting.  I had not seen it before.  He does
 not include Carbinge in his test.  The fact is there is no play discernable
 in Carbinge when pulled back and forth as it appears he did in the video.
 In my observations, I have found the aluminum MS hinge material to also have
 a lot of play in the lateral plane as well - you can slide one side of the
 hinge back and forth on the pin while holding the other side.  This is not
 the case with Carbinge because we make them to tighter tolerance.  From the
 video it would be instructive to know how long the segment of hinge was in
 each sample and how much pressure was applied.
 
 Chris, can you supply that information?  I'd like to be able to duplicate
 the conditions you used for your test.
 
  You also stated that ".....Teflon and Nylon are very soft and will flow
 and deform if
 subjected to high loads."  Can you supply data you used to verify this
 comment as it applies to Nylon?  My data shows that when nylon is enclosed
 in a Carbinge hinge, it does not deform, even when subjected to over a
 million cycles.  I tend to agree with you that Teflon does flow
 significantly when point loads are applied, but I have not tested that
 theory myself.
 
 Regards,
 
 John Barrett

"""
  I seem to recall that Chris Zavatson posted a very detailed process for
 eliminating hinge looseness (and thus excess wear) a year or so ago.
  
  JHK
 
 [Rather than pointing everyone at a link I'm sure Chris wouldn't mind if I
 simply copied his post here...  good info is always worth multiple passes.
 Thanks to Chris for his frequent contributions here.  <M>   ]
 
 
 """This topic has had a fairly short cycle time on the LML, re-emerging
 relatively often. I follow these threads with interest since I tinkered with
 
 the hinge issue a couple of years ago. The result is an all metal solution
 that eliminates play far better than anything I have seen thus far. Wear has
 
 not been measurable yet, but I only have a few years and couple hundred
 hours
 on the parts. The details are online at:
 http://www.n91cz.com/HingePlay/hinges.htm
 In short, a standard MS hinge is reamed (hand reamer from McMaster) and then
 a
 larger diameter pin is used (SS welding rod).
 
 General conclusions:
 
 1.The standard MS hinge extrusion has a huge allowable tolerance for the
 hole
 diameter (.005"). Without modification, there is no single pin or insert
 that
 will both fit all hinges and not have play.
 http://www.n91cz.com/HingePlay/hinge_spec_1.jpg
 http://www.n91cz.com/HingePlay/hinge_spec_2.jpg
 
 2.The MS pin is undersized which adds to the tolerance in 1.
 http://www.n91cz.com/HingePlay/pin_spec.jpg
 
 2.Wear can be controlled by contolling the pin/hinge tolerance and
 clearance.
 
 3.Plastics such as Teflon and Nylon are very soft and will flow and deform
 if
 subjected to high loads.
 http://www.n91cz.com/HingePlay/sleeve-web.JPG
 
 
 How much play is acceptable is very difficult to quantitfy. Certainly less
 is
 better, in particular for non-mass balanced surfaces such as large trim
 tabs.
 The following video clip compares the play of various hinge options.
 http://www.n91cz.com/HingePlay/Hinge_Play_Test-low_res.WMV
 
 Chris Zavatson
 N91CZ
 360std
 www.N91CZ.com
 """