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[220.235.117.31]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id p29sm23964371pfq.55.2021.06.30.22.58.45 for (version=TLS1_2 cipher=ECDHE-ECDSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 bits=128/128); Wed, 30 Jun 2021 22:58:46 -0700 (PDT) Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="Apple-Mail=_203F637B-B3BC-4CBB-8994-E5B07ED1691D" Mime-Version: 1.0 (Mac OS X Mail 14.0 \(3654.100.0.2.22\)) Subject: Re: [FlyRotary] Cooling Inlets Date: Thu, 1 Jul 2021 13:58:42 +0800 References: To: Rotary motors in aircraft In-Reply-To: Message-Id: X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.3654.100.0.2.22) --Apple-Mail=_203F637B-B3BC-4CBB-8994-E5B07ED1691D Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Hi Finn I read that data.=20 Way over my head I=E2=80=99m afraid. Sorry I can=E2=80=99t help. I just kept the inner radius smaller and the external radius as large as = practical. Basically the A40 for my oil inlet which sticks forward below the = spinner and the standard Glasair cowl cheeks which perhaps look a bit = more like A10 Reading Tracy=E2=80=99s comments, I marvel that he cools the 20b with: <22in2 into his water cooler <18in2 into the oil cooler We should be rejecting ~ 2/3=E2=80=99s of the heat he is, which = translates into <16in2 water and <12in2 oil. Steve Izett > On 1 Jul 2021, at 11:18 am, Finn Lassen finn.lassen@verizon.net = wrote: >=20 > Thanks. I guess I kept missing it because I don't understand what I'm = looking at. > Can anyone help me understand the following and show me the optimum = inside/outside radius ratio (which I assume is one of the A-10 to A-40 = contours): > > > Finn >=20 > On 6/30/2021 9:45 PM, Charlie England ceengland7@gmail.com = wrote: >> Seems likely; I don't recall seeing a CR3485 referenced anywhere, = either. >>=20 >> On 6/30/2021 4:42 PM, Finn Lassen finn.lassen@verizon.net = wrote: >>> I tried in vain to find NASA_CR3485 (well, I found a NASA = contractors report on animal studies). >>>=20 >>> I wonder of he meant 3405? >>> >>>=20 >>> Anyone found a better match? >>>=20 >>> Finn >>>=20 >>> On 4/28/2011 9:07 AM, Tracy wrote: >>>> Finally got around to finishing my cooling inlets. (pictures = attached)=C3=AF=C2=BF=C2=BD Up until now they were simply round pipes = sticking out of the cowl.=C3=AF=C2=BF=C2=BD=C3=AF=C2=BF=C2=BD The pipes = are still there but they have properly shaped bellmouths on = them.=C3=AF=C2=BF=C2=BD=C3=AF=C2=BF=C2=BD The shape and contours were = derived from a NASA contractor report (NASA_CR3485) that you can find = via Google.=C3=AF=C2=BF=C2=BD Lots of math & formulas in it but I just = copied the best performing inlet picture of the contour.=C3=AF=C2=BF=C2=BD= =C3=AF=C2=BF=C2=BD Apparently there is an optimum radius for the inner = and outer lip of the inlet.=C3=AF=C2=BF=C2=BD=C3=AF=C2=BF=C2=BD There = was no change to the inlet diameters of 5.25" on water cooler and 4.75" = on oil cooler. >>>>=20 >>>> The simple pipes performed adequately in level flight at moderate = cruise settings even on hot days but oil temps would quickly hit redline = at high power level flight and in climb.=C3=AF=C2=BF=C2=BD=20 >>>>=20 >>>> The significant change with the new inlet shape is that they appear = to capture off-axis air flow=C3=AF=C2=BF=C2=BD (like in climb and = swirling flow=C3=AF=C2=BF=C2=BD induced by prop at high power)=C3=AF=C2=BF= =C2=BD MUCH better than the simple pipes. =C3=AF=C2=BF=C2=BD=C3=AF=C2=BF=C2= =BD First flight test was on a 94 deg. F day and I could not get the oil = temp above 200 degrees in a max power climb. =C3=AF=C2=BF=C2=BD=C3=AF=C2=BF= =C2=BD They may have gone higher if the air temperature remained = constant but at 3500 fpm the rapidly decreasing OAT kept the temps well = under redline (210 deg F). >>>>=20 >>>> I have an air pressure instrument reading the pressure in front of = the oil cooler and was amazed at the pressure recovered from the prop = wash.=C3=AF=C2=BF=C2=BD At 130 MPH the pressure would almost double when = the throttle was advanced to WOT. =C3=AF=C2=BF=C2=BD That did not happen = nearly as much with the simple pipes.=C3=AF=C2=BF=C2=BD=C3=AF=C2=BF=C2=BD=20= >>>>=20 >>>> These inlets ROCK! >>>>=20 >>>> Tracy Crook >>>>=20 >>>=20 >>>=20 >>> = = Virus-free. www.avast.com = = >=20 --Apple-Mail=_203F637B-B3BC-4CBB-8994-E5B07ED1691D Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Type: text/html; charset=utf-8 Hi = Finn

I read that = data. 
Way over my head I=E2=80=99m = afraid.
Sorry I can=E2=80=99t help.

I just kept the inner = radius smaller and the external radius as large as practical.
Basically the A40 for my oil inlet which sticks forward below = the spinner and the standard Glasair cowl cheeks which perhaps look a = bit more like A10

Reading Tracy=E2=80=99s comments, I marvel that he cools the = 20b with:
 <22in2 into his water = cooler
<18in2 into the oil = cooler
We should be rejecting ~ 2/3=E2=80=99s of = the heat he is, which translates into <16in2 water and <12in2 = oil.

Steve = Izett

On 1 Jul 2021, at 11:18 am, Finn Lassen finn.lassen@verizon.net <flyrotary@lancaironline.net> wrote:

=20 =20
Thanks. I guess I kept missing it because I don't understand what I'm looking at.
Can anyone help me understand the following and show me the optimum inside/outside radius ratio (which I assume is one of the A-10 to A-40 contours):
<nadfchpfafimnegl.png>= ;
<kbdejbnihmgdehea.png>= ;
Finn

On 6/30/2021 9:45 PM, Charlie England ceengland7@gmail.com wrote:
Seems likely; I don't recall seeing = a CR3485 referenced anywhere, either.

On 6/30/2021 4:42 PM, Finn Lassen finn.lassen@verizon.net wrote:
I tried in vain to find NASA_CR3485 (well, I found a NASA contractors report on animal studies).

I wonder of he meant 3405?
<bnmfmdnlndmefidc.png>= ;

Anyone found a better match?

Finn

On 4/28/2011 9:07 AM, Tracy wrote:
Finally got around to finishing my cooling inlets. (pictures attached)=C3=AF=C2=BF=C2=BD Up until now they were = simply round pipes sticking out of the cowl.=C3=AF=C2=BF=C2=BD=C3=AF=C2=BF=C2= =BD The pipes are still there but they have properly shaped bellmouths on them.=C3=AF=C2=BF=C2=BD=C3=AF=C2=BF=C2=BD The shape and = contours were derived from a NASA contractor report (NASA_CR3485) that you can find via Google.=C3=AF=C2=BF=C2=BD Lots of math & = formulas in it but I just copied the best performing inlet picture of the contour.=C3=AF=C2=BF=C2=BD=C3=AF=C2=BF=C2=BD Apparently = there is an optimum radius for the inner and outer lip of the inlet.=C3=AF=C2=BF=C2=BD=C3= =AF=C2=BF=C2=BD There was no change to the inlet diameters of 5.25" on water cooler and 4.75" on oil cooler.

The simple pipes performed adequately in level flight at moderate cruise settings even on hot days but oil temps would quickly hit redline at high power level flight and in climb.=C3=AF=C2=BF=C2=BD

The significant change with the new inlet shape is that they appear to capture off-axis air flow=C3=AF=C2=BF=C2=BD= (like in climb and swirling flow=C3=AF=C2=BF=C2=BD induced by = prop at high power)=C3=AF=C2=BF=C2=BD MUCH better than the simple = pipes. =C3=AF=C2=BF=C2=BD=C3=AF=C2=BF=C2=BD First flight test was on a 94 deg. F day and I could not get the oil temp above 200 degrees in a max power climb. =C3=AF=C2=BF=C2=BD=C3=AF=C2=BF=C2=BD They may have gone = higher if the air temperature remained constant but at 3500 fpm the rapidly decreasing OAT kept the temps well under redline (210 deg F).

I have an air pressure instrument reading the pressure in front of the oil cooler and was amazed at the pressure recovered from the prop wash.=C3=AF=C2=BF=C2=BD = At 130 MPH the pressure would almost double when the throttle was advanced to WOT. =C3=AF=C2=BF=C2=BD That did not happen = nearly as much with the simple pipes.=C3=AF=C2=BF=C2=BD=C3=AF=C2=BF=C2=BD=

These inlets ROCK!

Tracy Crook



3D"" Virus-free. www.avast.com



= --Apple-Mail=_203F637B-B3BC-4CBB-8994-E5B07ED1691D--