X-CGP-ClamAV-Result: CLEAN X-VirusScanner: Niversoft's CGPClamav Helper v1.23.0 (ClamAV engine v0.103.0) X-Junk-Score: 0 [] X-KAS-Score: 0 [] From: "Stephen Izett stephen.izett@gmail.com" Received: from mail-pf1-f178.google.com ([209.85.210.178] verified) by logan.com (CommuniGate Pro SMTP 6.3.5) with ESMTPS id 113412 for flyrotary@lancaironline.net; Sat, 26 Jun 2021 22:19:25 -0400 Received-SPF: pass receiver=logan.com; client-ip=209.85.210.178; envelope-from=stephen.izett@gmail.com Received: by mail-pf1-f178.google.com with SMTP id k6so10886976pfk.12 for ; Sat, 26 Jun 2021 19:19:26 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20161025; h=from:mime-version:subject:date:references:to:in-reply-to:message-id; bh=/luCkIGIGwIMwuc0nF95cAAtxwJYOWWXTn/347Qxwok=; b=rLNyhv6DfAUbjK1iYY2XcbkQ36jBwGmWc5cyFOaj3yD0GzDCbrsipQ9W19yGt3v4OQ EgOM6CyWv04humLD2N43BUByWq6a8Pu5V0Wqbo6aLV9acjMRjIKXpYT0J7/UinHNb22n Ug1Kr99Yb8YJoROzuQzqVcWwgx8xOAqUK9pllBT2nLeWEVqqQmx4s4NikBuzEp9oFLfP A4/xOb0hd0Xso9Tz+n2S0e/NvHpgrs4nGa3CmpZtmDeBlygbqc/vkwhu6r8llO+msrTB MRfL+LR0cFYPp11i8LUSLfMZrwTInhLh+BQ1C1uqp7JsAfrw45OPijPOVQczV4QLcqYS WbGA== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:from:mime-version:subject:date:references:to :in-reply-to:message-id; bh=/luCkIGIGwIMwuc0nF95cAAtxwJYOWWXTn/347Qxwok=; b=bqwWf7HOVK9EiCETDStKL8SXLf+FLP6knAavY5E5JrWFBqdX+PkCExj4YtrmuWIhGi GdcqIF1xDgcfdTPnnzm0ffVUoNfkos2gETYUJxszV2TN1f0OZ4z6O3JB2sNPwTTAF7dG yl+97O1rfKf0zraGb2kSHpVI58RcVY3fjHxc/mhSbYy2QX+BAKPXAPiWwb+sQTEpCIVY R1D0IcxToXBLhZOFnGhZ0ZVeHIvPFBdDY4tc0RffJzWcKso9fnW6ZcVdV/TrSy1Ntoma arkqqBFfmE95EZtNzhmzlbOyf188vtfgWJ7oPr8bnZshFB36A7rc1rjHiYc3Hjvxay+E 66YA== X-Gm-Message-State: AOAM530ohJOPXSN74rbr9/CuVkaTZQYqD4e9mBsy7Y7UOsVghoSwWYQK 1aLuIZClF1VoM3XxXraL2c7xjmyGH84= X-Google-Smtp-Source: ABdhPJxsHb2BmnNJmWHZWObimSbZhqIECPUZQM9SJDHmqhf626a0SfRYaiA97Bcnhvuf0cRkv7157g== X-Received: by 2002:a63:f346:: with SMTP id t6mr16865271pgj.277.1624760348210; Sat, 26 Jun 2021 19:19:08 -0700 (PDT) Return-Path: Received: from smtpclient.apple (220-235-117-31.dyn.iinet.net.au. [220.235.117.31]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id d19sm1794156pgk.15.2021.06.26.19.19.06 for (version=TLS1_2 cipher=ECDHE-ECDSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 bits=128/128); Sat, 26 Jun 2021 19:19:07 -0700 (PDT) Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="Apple-Mail=_34276868-2852-4067-BEED-3423B10F9F7A" Mime-Version: 1.0 (Mac OS X Mail 14.0 \(3654.100.0.2.22\)) Subject: Re: [FlyRotary] Timing / AFR landing Date: Sun, 27 Jun 2021 10:19:02 +0800 References: To: Rotary motors in aircraft In-Reply-To: Message-Id: <1EC3D373-1387-422D-88C0-60559EFE7BE5@gmail.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.3654.100.0.2.22) --Apple-Mail=_34276868-2852-4067-BEED-3423B10F9F7A Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Thanks Finn I was just reading again a note from Tracy in the EC3 manual and this = may well work in tandem, with the 8 table code/setup which I am using on = my EC2. See below: =E2=80=94=E2=80=94=E2=80=94=20 Program Mode 7 (Cold Start on) Set Manifold Pressure threshold for = using RPM mixture correction table When mode 7 is selected and the Cold Start switch is placed in the up = position (On), Mode 7 will have an alternate function. =20 Most users will not need to adjust this Mode but it is included for = unusual engine configurations. Pressing the store button will set the manifold pressure below which the = EC3 will use the RPM mixture correction table. This function was added = to enable use with widely varying propeller loads at low throttle. =20 This would include the use of variable pitch or constant speed = propellers. =20 As with the other programming modes, this only functions while the = engine is running. =20 The suggested method of setting this mode is to run the engine on the = ground (with prop installed) at low throttle and advance the throttle = until the engine is running at around 2500 rpm and press the store = button with Mode 7 selected and cold start switch on. You may have to = experiment with different prop settings when making this adjustment. =20 =E2=80=94=E2=80=94=E2=80=94 I=E2=80=99m trying to get my head around how to implement this!!! Steve Izett > On 27 Jun 2021, at 9:11 am, Finn Lassen finn.lassen@verizon.net = wrote: >=20 > The latest EC2 and EC3 software (CL8 -- Closed Loop 8) sort of = addresses this problem with 8 RPM/MAP tables, I think: >=20 > Table for 8-TABLE ROTARY ENGINE CONTROLLERS > EC3 __ SN ____ MAP TABLE DATE _____________ > =20 > 0 ______ _____ <=3D 600 RPM PG 0 _______ > 1 ______ _____ =20 > 2 ______ _____ 0 =E2=80=93 F USED WHEN MP > 3 ______ _____ BELOW 13" Hg > 4 ______ _____ > 5 ______ _____ 0 =E2=80=93 1600 RPM > 6 ______ _____ RPM DETERMINES > 7 ______ _____ TABLE ADDRESS > 8 ______ _____ > 9 ______ _____ > A ______ _____ > B ______ _____ > C ______ _____ > D ______ _____ =20 > E ______ _____ =20 > F ______ _____ 1600 RPM_________________ > 10 ______ _____ 8" PG1 =20 > 11 ______ _____ USED ABOVE=20 > 12 ______ _____ 13" Hg MP AND RPM =20 > 13 ______ _____ IS LESS THAN 1600 > 14 ______ _____ > 15 ______ _____ MANIFOLD PRESS > 16 ______ _____ DETERMINES > 17 ______ _____ TABLE ADDRESS > 18 ______ _____ > 19 ______ _____ > 1A ______ _____ > 1B ______ _____ PRIMARY INJECTORS ONLY > 1C ______ _____ BELOW 20" Hg. > 1D ______ _____ > 1E ______ _____ =20 > 1F ______ _____ 19.6" ____________ > 20 ______ _____ 8" PG 2 > 21 ______ _____ > 22 ______ _____ > 23 ______ _____ =20 > 24 ______ _____ =20 > 25 ______ _____ USED WHEN RPM=20 > 26 ______ _____ 1600 =E2=80=93 2300 > 27 ______ _____ =20 > 28 ______ _____ MANIFOLD PRESS. > 29 ______ _____ DETERMINES=20 > 2A ______ _____ MAP TABLE ADDRESS > 2B ______ _____ IF MP < 20" Hg > 2C ______ _____ > 2D ______ _____ > 2E ______ _____ > 2F ______ _____ 19.6"_________________________ > 30 ______ _____ 8" PG3 > 31 ______ _____ USED WITH=20 > 32 ______ _____ RPM 2300 - 4000 AND > 33 ______ _____ MP < 20" Hg > 34 ______ _____ > 35 ______ _____ > 36 ______ _____ > 37 ______ _____ > 38 ______ _____ MP DETERMINES > 39 ______ _____ MAP TABLE ADDRESS > 3A ______ _____ > 3B ______ _____ > 3C ______ _____ > 3D ______ _____ > 3E ______ _____ > 3F ______ _____ 19.6" ____________________ =20= >=20 > 40 ______ _____ 8" PG 4_____________________ > 41 ______ _____ > 42 ______ _____=20 > 43 ______ _____=20 > 44 ______ _____ > 45 ______ _____ > 46 ______ _____ > 47 ______ _____ USED WHEN RPM > 48 ______ _____ BETWEEN 4000 - 5000 > 49 ______ _____ AND MP < 20" Hg > 4A ______ _____ > 4B ______ _____ > 4C ______ _____ > 4D ______ _____ > 4E ______ _____ =20 > 4F ______ _____ 19.6"________________________ > 50 ______ _____ 8" PG 5 > 51 ______ _____ > 52 ______ _____=20 > 53 ______ _____ =20 > 54 ______ _____=20 > 55 ______ _____ 5000 - 7500 RPM > 56 ______ _____ AND MP < 20" Hg > 57 ______ _____ > 58 ______ _____ MANIFOLD PRESSURE > 59 ______ _____ DETERMINES > 5A ______ _____ MAP TABLE ADDRESS > 5B ______ _____=20 > 5C ______ _____ > 5D ______ _____ > 5E ______ _____ =20 > 5F ______ _____ 19.6" _________________________ =20 > 60 ______ _____ 20" PG 6 > 61 ______ _____ > 62 ______ _____ NO STAGING ABOVE 20"Hg > 63 ______ _____ (SECONDARY INJECTORS ON) > 64 ______ _____ > 65 ______ _____ USED BELOW 5000 RPM > 66 ______ _____ AND MP > 20" Hg > 67 ______ _____ =20 > 68 ______ _____ > 69 ______ _____=20 > 6A ______ _____ > 6B ______ _____ MP DETERMINES > 6C ______ _____ MAP TABLE ADDRESS > 6D ______ _____ > 6E ______ _____ =20 > 6F ______ _____ 37" __________________________ > 70 ______ _____ 20" PG 7 > 71 ______ _____ > 72 ______ _____ =20 > 73 ______ _____ (SECONDARY INJECTORS ON) > 74 ______ _____ > 75 ______ _____ > 76 ______ _____ =20 > 77 ______ _____ USED ABOVE 5000 RPM > 78 ______ _____ AND MP > 20" Hg > 79 ______ _____ > 7A ______ _____ > 7B ______ _____ MP DETERMINES > 7C ______ _____ MAP TABLE ADDRESS > 7D ______ _____ > 7E ______ _____ =20 > 7F ______ _____ >=3D 37=E2=80=9D Hg MAP >=20 > Staging point ______ (4-3) (ROW =E2=80=93 COLLUMN) ON=20 > SECDIF ______ (3-5) ENGINE INFO SCREEN. > R1DIF ______ (3-3) Hold 4 & press 1 to > IPW RNG ______ (4-6) access. > IGNADJ ______ (4-4) Values are in HEX format > INJ FLOW ______ (3-7) on ENGINE INFO screen > MPTHRESH _______ (4-7) >=20 > Don't know if that helps. >=20 > Finn >=20 > On 6/25/2021 7:54 AM, Matt Boiteau mattboiteau@gmail.com = wrote: >> With a fixed pitch prop and somewhat slippery plane. I have to bring = prop RPM back to ~1300 to slow down. MAP is around 45kpa (13inhg). With = my oversized and inefficient intake, it definitely makes the area hard = to tune. >>=20 >> Do we know what the default timing is for Tracy's renesis = programming? Has anyone debugged the code and created a RPM vs MAP = spreadsheet? I have the RX8 tables from the car's ECU, but I have no = clue if the plane is different. Especially at the landing configuration = (high rpm, low map). Do we treat it like we are coasting down the hill, = bump up to 35-38degree timing and lean it out. Or because we are still = turning a prop, or the wind is turning the prop now, do we keep normal = timing and best power afr? >>=20 >>=20 >> - Matt Boiteau >>=20 >>=20 >> On Thu, Jun 24, 2021 at 7:17 PM Stephen Izett stephen.izett@gmail.com = > wrote: >> Matt >>=20 >> On down wind we set: >> Prop to full fine.=20 >> AFR at best power 0.9 or 13.3 >> Same as Bobby, finding this area of the map very difficult to tune=20 >> I have to manually adjust mixture as it tends to go very lean as we = reduce airspeed. >> I havn=E2=80=99t changed timing from default for Tracy=E2=80=99s = Renesis programming. >>=20 >> Steve Izett >> Renesis 4 port RD1-C EC2 >>=20 >>=20 >>=20 >>> On 24 Jun 2021, at 9:33 pm, Bobby Hughes BHughes@qnsinc.net = > wrote: >>>=20 >>> With the CS prop at 2300 rpm and MP below 20=E2=80=9D I found F/A = between 15.8 and 14.5 worked well. I found this area very difficult to = tune. Possibly because staging was set at 20=E2=80=9D. I have no idea = what the EC3 time is in this area.=20 >>> =20 >>> Bobby >>> =20 >>> From: Rotary motors in aircraft [mailto:flyrotary@lancaironline.net = ]=20 >>> Sent: Thursday, June 24, 2021 8:25 AM >>> To: Rotary motors in aircraft >>> Subject: [FlyRotary] Timing / AFR landing >>> =20 >>> What AFR / spark timing are you guys aiming for on downwind / = landing ? >>> =20 >>>=20 >>> - Matt Boiteau >>>=20 >>>=20 >>> Disclaimer >>>=20 >>> The information contained in this communication from the sender is = confidential. It is intended solely for use by the recipient and others = authorized to receive it. If you are not the recipient, you are hereby = notified that any disclosure, copying, distribution or taking action in = relation of the contents of this information is strictly prohibited and = may be unlawful. >>>=20 >>> This email has been scanned for viruses and malware, and may have = been automatically archived by Mimecast Ltd, an innovator in Software as = a Service (SaaS) for business. Providing a safer and more useful place = for your human generated data. Specializing in; Security, archiving and = compliance. To find out more Click Here = . >>>=20 >>=20 >=20 >=20 > = = Virus-free. www.avast.com = = --Apple-Mail=_34276868-2852-4067-BEED-3423B10F9F7A Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Type: text/html; charset=utf-8 Thanks Finn

I was just reading again a note from Tracy in the EC3 manual = and this may well work in tandem, with the 8 table code/setup which I am = using on my EC2.

See below:

=E2=80=94=E2=80=94=E2=80=94 

Program Mode 7  (Cold Start on) Set  Manifold = Pressure threshold for using RPM mixture correction table

When mode 7 is = selected and the Cold Start switch is placed in the up position (On), Mode 7 will have an alternate function.  

Most users will not need to adjust this Mode but it is included for unusual engine configurations. =

Pressing the store button will set the manifold pressure below which the EC3 will use the RPM mixture = correction table.  This function was added to enable use with widely varying propeller loads at low = throttle.  

This would include the use of variable = pitch or constant speed  propellers.  

As with the other = programming modes, this only functions while the engine is = running.   

The suggested method of setting this mode is = to run the engine on the ground (with prop installed) at low throttle and advance the throttle = until the engine is running at around 2500 rpm and press the store button with = Mode 7 selected and cold start switch on.   You may have to experiment with different prop settings when making this adjustment.  

=E2=80=94=E2=80=94=E2=80=94
<= div class=3D"">
I=E2=80=99m trying = to get my head around how to implement this!!!

Steve Izett




On 27 Jun 2021, at 9:11 am, Finn Lassen finn.lassen@verizon.net <flyrotary@lancaironline.net> wrote:

=20 =20
The latest EC2 and EC3 software (CL8 = -- Closed Loop 8) sort of addresses this problem with 8 RPM/MAP tables, I think:

 Table for 8-TABLE ROTARY ENGINE CONTROLLERS
 EC3 __ SN ____ MAP TABLE     = DATE   _____________
       
0    ______      = _____    <=3D  600 RPM  PG = 0         _______
1    ______      = _____           
2    ______      = _____    0 =E2=80=93 F USED WHEN MP
3    ______      = _____    BELOW  13" Hg
4    ______      _____
5    ______      = _____    0 =E2=80=93 1600 RPM
6    ______      = _____    RPM DETERMINES
7    ______      = _____     TABLE ADDRESS
8    ______      _____
9    ______      _____
A    ______      _____
B    ______      _____
C    ______      _____
D    ______      = _____     
E    ______      = _____   
F    ______      = _____     1600 RPM_________________
10    ______      = _____    = 8"          PG1   
11    ______      = _____    USED ABOVE
12    ______      = _____    13" Hg MP  AND RPM   
13    ______      = _____    IS LESS THAN 1600
14    ______      _____
15    ______      = _____    MANIFOLD PRESS
16    ______      = _____    DETERMINES
17    ______      = _____    TABLE ADDRESS
18    ______      _____
19    ______      _____
1A    ______      _____
1B    ______      = _____          PRIMARY = INJECTORS ONLY
1C    ______      = _____           &nb= sp;  BELOW 20" Hg.
1D    ______      _____
1E    ______      = _____            =
1F    ______      = _____      19.6"   ____________
20    ______      = _____      = 8"           PG 2
21    ______      _____
22    ______      _____
23    ______      = _____   
24    ______      = _____       
25    ______      = _____    USED  WHEN RPM
26    ______      = _____    1600 =E2=80=93 2300
27    ______      = _____         
28    ______      = _____    MANIFOLD PRESS.
29    ______      = _____    DETERMINES
2A    ______      = _____    MAP TABLE ADDRESS
2B    ______      = _____    IF MP < 20" Hg
2C    ______      _____
2D    ______      _____
2E    ______      _____
2F    ______      = _____    19.6"_________________________
30    ______      = _____    = 8"            = PG3
31    ______      = _____       USED WITH
32    ______      = _____       RPM  2300 - 4000  AND
33    ______      = _____       MP < 20" Hg
34    ______      _____
35    ______      _____
36    ______      _____
37    ______      _____
38    ______      = _____    MP DETERMINES
39    ______      = _____    MAP TABLE ADDRESS
3A    ______      _____
3B    ______      _____
3C    ______      _____
3D    ______      _____
3E    ______      _____
3F    ______      = _____    = 19.6"            ____________________    

40    ______      _____  = 8"   PG 4_____________________
41    ______      _____
42    ______      _____
43    ______      _____
44    ______      _____
45    ______      _____
46    ______      _____
47    ______      = _____    USED WHEN RPM
48    ______      _____ =     BETWEEN 4000 - 5000
49    ______      _____ =     AND MP <  20" Hg
4A    ______      _____
4B    ______      _____
4C    ______      _____
4D    ______      _____
4E    ______      = _____   
4F    ______      _____ = 19.6"________________________
50    ______      _____  = 8"       PG 5
51    ______      _____
52    ______      _____
53    ______      = _____            =
54    ______      _____
55    ______      = _____           = 5000  - 7500 RPM
56    ______      = _____         AND MP < 20" = Hg
57    ______      _____
58    ______      = _____          MANIFOLD = PRESSURE
59    ______      = _____          DETERMINES
5A    ______      = _____         MAP TABLE = ADDRESS
5B    ______      _____
5C    ______      _____
5D    ______      _____
5E    ______      = _____    
5F    ______      _____  = 19.6" _________________________   
60    ______      _____  = 20"        PG 6
61    ______      _____
62    ______      = _____       NO STAGING ABOVE 20"Hg
63    ______      = _____   (SECONDARY INJECTORS ON)
64    ______      _____
65    ______      = _____        USED BELOW 5000 RPM
66    ______      = _____         AND MP > = 20"  Hg
67    ______      = _____           
68    ______      _____
69    ______      _____
6A    ______      _____
6B    ______      = _____        MP DETERMINES
6C    ______      = _____       MAP TABLE ADDRESS
= 6D    ______      _____
6E    ______      _____  =
6F    ______      _____  = 37" __________________________
70    ______      _____  = 20"       PG 7
71    ______      _____
72    ______      = _____   
73    ______      = _____    (SECONDARY INJECTORS ON)
74    ______      _____
75    ______      _____
76    ______      = _____   
77    ______      = _____      USED ABOVE 5000 RPM
78    ______      _____ =       AND MP > 20" Hg
79    ______      _____
7A    ______      _____
7B    ______      = _____            = MP DETERMINES
7C    ______      = _____            = MAP TABLE ADDRESS
7D    ______      _____
7E    ______      = _____   
7F    ______      = _____     >=3D  37=E2=80=9D Hg MAP

Staging point    ______    = (4-3)    (ROW =E2=80=93 COLLUMN) ON
SECDIF        = ______    (3-5)    ENGINE INFO SCREEN.
R1DIF        = ______    (3-3)    Hold 4 & press 1 = to
IPW RNG        = ______    (4-6)    access.
IGNADJ        = ______    (4-4)    Values are in HEX = format
INJ FLOW    ______    = (3-7)    on ENGINE INFO screen
= MPTHRESH           = _______   (4-7)

Don't know if that helps.

Finn

On 6/25/2021 7:54 AM, Matt Boiteau mattboiteau@gmail.com = wrote:
With a fixed pitch prop and somewhat = slippery plane. I have to bring prop RPM back to ~1300 to slow down. MAP is around 45kpa (13inhg). With my oversized and inefficient intake, it definitely makes the area hard to tune.

Do we know what the default timing is for Tracy's renesis programming? Has anyone debugged the code and created a RPM vs MAP spreadsheet? I have the RX8 tables from the car's ECU, but I have no clue if the plane is different. Especially at the landing configuration (high rpm, low map). Do we treat it like we are coasting down the hill, bump up to 35-38degree timing and lean it out. Or because we are still turning a prop, or the wind is turning the prop now, do we keep normal timing and best power afr?


- Matt Boiteau


On Thu, Jun 24, 2021 at = 7:17 PM Stephen Izett stephen.izett@gmail.com <flyrotary@lancaironline.net> wrote:
Matt

On down wind we set:
Prop to full fine. 
AFR at best power 0.9 or 13.3
Same as = Bobby, finding this area of the map very difficult to = tune 
I have = to manually adjust mixture as it tends to go very lean as we reduce airspeed.
I havn=E2=80=99t changed = timing from default for Tracy=E2=80=99s Renesis = programming.

Steve Izett
Renesis 4 port RD1-C = EC2



On 24 Jun 2021, at 9:33 pm, Bobby = Hughes BHughes@qnsinc.net <flyrotary@lancaironline.net> wrote:

With the CS prop at 2300 rpm and MP below 20=E2=80=9D= I found F/A between 15.8 and 14.5 worked well. I found this area very difficult to tune. Possibly because staging was set at = 20=E2=80=9D.  I have no idea what the EC3 time is in this area. 
=
 
Bobby
 
From: Rotary motors in aircraft [mailto:flyrotary@lancaironline.net] 
Sent: Thursday, June 24, 2021 8:25 AM
To: Rotary motors in aircraft
Subject: [FlyRotary] Timing / AFR landing
 
What AFR / = spark timing are you guys aiming for on downwind / landing ?
 
=

- = Matt Boiteau


Disclaimer

The information contained in this communication from the sender is confidential. It is intended solely for use by the recipient and others authorized to receive it. If you are not the recipient, you are hereby notified that any disclosure, copying, distribution or taking action in relation of the contents of this information is strictly prohibited and may be unlawful.

This email has been scanned for viruses and malware, and may have been automatically archived by Mimecast Ltd, an innovator in Software as a Service (SaaS) for business. Providing a safer and more useful place = for your human generated data. Specializing in; Security, archiving and compliance. To find out more Click Here.




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