X-Junk-Score: 0 [] X-Cloudmark-Score: 0 [] X-Cloudmark-Analysis: v=2.3 cv=PbaBeRpd c=1 sm=1 tr=0 a=pD3Rormsref9cAhgJAGCSw==:117 a=x7bEGLp0ZPQA:10 a=JZygid9Izu4A:10 a=_RQrkK6FrEwA:10 a=hOpmn2quAAAA:8 a=Ia-xEzejAAAA:8 a=pGLkceISAAAA:8 a=OJsyIlJ8yb3l7tb1QXgA:9 a=wQk8Acf6np0QFrjH:21 a=sLSNfXMWtt-RwVhA:21 a=QEXdDO2ut3YA:10 a=Roqw-ESwZgQTmFI5UwYA:9 a=wSzbSE5TasgAfNDE:21 a=ijWt8tFc3zZ0aZAe:21 a=ChIWCsO1MKYkVdgv:21 a=GyA-uvUxXSCciAkwuKQO:22 a=Urk15JJjZg1Xo0ryW_k8:22 From: "Kelly Troyer keltro@gmail.com" Received: from mail-lj1-f175.google.com ([209.85.208.175] verified) by logan.com (CommuniGate Pro SMTP 6.2.14) with ESMTPS id 507576 for flyrotary@lancaironline.net; Wed, 08 Jul 2020 23:48:20 -0400 Received-SPF: pass receiver=logan.com; client-ip=209.85.208.175; envelope-from=keltro@gmail.com Received: by mail-lj1-f175.google.com with SMTP id h22so711123lji.9 for ; Wed, 08 Jul 2020 20:48:21 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20161025; h=mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date:message-id:subject:to; bh=GdJw6s1RIGmiGEtyH/dyeUW09s6hd9yHAQiRD23nU+A=; b=mLn4FJ/LIcSNEQxsOAnIQi2Lx6LcpxoSw/rHaOf+J1DijQ3rysuvhoEa2IVMNpMCzm iVFpL848KY4ZdLHEeN5xDZxJZbwkIaJ/bW+5HuD4YUTdryy2c9ZhAihqhoikNrcFWJbA n2TkxSMBF1tjIDB0HNwD6du4ZKm+AR/VxgH8b+t9S4HNjlTQ1csGErvlRPOTgV8NA320 +yVnfXr/vHKwIF7Pe21x5KXMiT2IsYMOHzS/zRo3wmGbTzBv27EvcoL1b1VDWUBTd0g0 DXfkzE7x4YMZjxIQcNVPs8bpAnJfiNvf+Gmd20oy3ymLcTjHp5yAtnlkgX5gx77l01AF U22A== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date :message-id:subject:to; bh=GdJw6s1RIGmiGEtyH/dyeUW09s6hd9yHAQiRD23nU+A=; b=Akz6b0lZn+Fcv/wB0VrRYd/ytnnjJHgQcv1Wf9NVHlB+4IXhoERI0DB6AGHDArhLTD r0p1ToPRbzPPGMQuvGbDmBNl8knkuzEd9HOL/h6kAGZ24C8HqGlsJNxVwer7OG+X74BS UgsjW+GK9E+7WgXKle1chYWjLQT5+TvQ0enrUf/Zrd7t2FBNDOC4TD0itgoO3/3wvAhh OGKrjuDFEZnabSBiQZifPQ53wriF0fMW1CatfZiNClUul4mDItrEfzNuRKGj4BK71gaX glWncUqtbTjwpoK2COgZHyrFGlroJzJFUMbNQNYnw3Q8mZDlw61y4n1pHuS+2n6UhNs/ XCkw== X-Gm-Message-State: AOAM533KkoQizHpLWaKUU77Nj27cbq0KpKLEibm4SUj5C4TEhKySLs5h e9X+9Xuq2MB4fOAebHF5SP+2Ft6OuYYBJ0plUB8K8g== X-Google-Smtp-Source: ABdhPJxCfRVoSAlScS9nUEiDJKfzvLzONnZy30x1bFty2eQpFHQg8GwtO8q3NTHHLtf+KQtT846d+d9cruVHxDQmOa0= X-Received: by 2002:a2e:8043:: with SMTP id p3mr29806731ljg.469.1594266482858; Wed, 08 Jul 2020 20:48:02 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 References: In-Reply-To: Date: Wed, 8 Jul 2020 22:45:35 -0500 Message-ID: Subject: Re: [FlyRotary] Re: Aviation Specific 13B/20B Mazda Front Side Housing To: Rotary motors in aircraft Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="000000000000635faa05a9fa1769" --000000000000635faa05a9fa1769 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Charlie and Mark, Yes Charlie the accessory "iron" side housing is what would be replaced with an aluminum housing with built in mount points that replicate the Lycoming O/IO 540 mount ears and locate the Mazda eccentric shaft centerline in the same place as the Lycoming crankshaft centerline and make the Mazda a bolt in to any aircraft using the O/IO 540 30 degree "Dyna1" mount system............. Mark I am well aware of the different opinions on using the rear dyna focal mount on the Mazda.........Bill is correct about the need for .500 in/12.5mm studs and a stiffening plate and/or rigid oil sump to further resistance to torsional twisting..........But remember that the O/IO 540 family of engines with firewall forward weights of 400+ to over 500 lbs for some turbo models are all using this mount system and that an all alloy 13B or 20B (even with reduction drive) will be much lighter..........I do not believe that the "Mistral" 13B or 20B used alloy housings for other than the front accessory housing and I have never heard if they used the oversize .550 inch/12.5 mm studs in any of their engines..........This is probably a question that will have to be proven one way or another in actual use..........IMHO Best Kelly Troyer On Wed, Jul 8, 2020 at 5:49 PM Marcus Wiese cardmarc@charter.net < flyrotary@lancaironline.net> wrote: > Wonder why Mistral used dynafocal type mounting on their 13b and 20b > designs? > M > > Sent from my iPad > > On Jul 8, 2020, at 12:11 PM, William Jepson wrjjrs@gmail.com < > flyrotary@lancaironline.net> wrote: > > =EF=BB=BF > Kelly, > The "dynafocal" type mount has been tried on the rotary but has not > worked out well..One of the obvious rotary traits is that it has a hot an= d > cold side. Various methods have been used to limit this but there is no w= ay > to eliminate it completely. Because of this the engine tends to "work" an= d > move around on the studs. Using the engine as a stressed member is not > recommended with the rotary. If you were to do this anyway I wouldn't do > it without a stud kit. You will have better results using a bed mount. YM= MV > Bill Jepson > > On Wed, Jul 8, 2020 at 1:18 AM Kelly Troyer keltro@gmail.com < > flyrotary@lancaironline.net> wrote: > >> *I am in contact with a person with the design and manufacturing **capab= ility >> to produce an **Aviation Specific 13B/20B Mazda Front Side** Housing >> machined from 7075-T6* *with mount points that **would allow these >> engines* >> >> >> >> *to be a bolt in to the engine mount ring (30 degree number 1 Dyna) as >> used by the "Vans" RV-10 and other aircraft that use the Lycoming O/IO 5= 40 >> engine..........This side plate is in the preliminary design stage and a= t >> thispoint I am a go between to see if there would be any interest in thi= s >> product if and when it is * >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> *produced...........I personally am interested this side plate........As >> we on this forum know both the 13B / 20B are capable of trulyamazing pow= er >> levels both naturally aspirated and turbo boosted.........The 20B would >> make the Van's RV-10 , Glasair 3 or Lancair's that use the Lycoming O/IO >> 540 an easy 300+ hp almost bolt in engine...........The "Reno" Sport Cla= ss >> "Glasairs" and Lancairs" are producing almost 400 mph speeds using dual >> turbo Lycoming IO-550 engines that are virtual hand grenades pulling ove= r >> 700 hp...........There are turbo 20B's pulling1200 hp out in the auto >> racing world with good reliability..........A 20B boosted to 700+ hp is = not >> even breathing hard.........IMHOWould like to hear what interest there m= ay >> be in this product if and when it may be produced............Or any >> comments pro or con..............* >> >> -- >> Kelly Troyer >> >> --000000000000635faa05a9fa1769 Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Charlie and Mark,
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0Yes C= harlie the accessory=C2=A0"iron"=C2=A0side housing is what would = be replaced with an aluminum housing with built in mount points that replic= ate the Lycoming O/IO 540 mount ears and locate the Mazda eccentric=C2=A0
shaft centerline in the same place as the Lycoming crankshaft cent= erline and make the Mazda a bolt in to any aircraft using=C2=A0the O/IO 540= 30 degree "Dyna1" mount system.............

=
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0Mark I am well aware of the different opinions on = using the rear dyna focal mount on the Mazda.........Bill is correct about = the need for .500 in/12.5mm studs and a stiffening plate and/or rigid oil s= ump to
further resistance to torsional twisting..........But reme= mber that the O/IO 540 family of engines with firewall forward weights of 4= 00+ to over 500 lbs for some turbo models are all using this mount system a= nd
that an all alloy 13B or 20B (even with reduction drive) will = be much lighter..........I do not believe that the "Mistral" 13B = or 20B used alloy housings for other than the front accessory housing and I= have never=C2=A0
heard if they used the oversize .550 inch/12.5 = mm studs in any of their engines..........This is probably a question that = will have to be proven one way or another in actual use..........IMHO
=
Best
Kelly Troyer

On Wed, Jul 8, 2020 at 5:49 PM Marcus Wiese= cardmarc@charter.net <flyrotary@lancaironline.net&g= t; wrote:
Wonder why Mistral used dynafocal type mounting on their 13b an= d 20b designs?
M

Sent from my iPad

On Jul 8, 2020, at 12:11 PM, Willia= m Jepson wrjjrs@gmail= .com <flyrotary@lancaironline.net> wrote:

=EF=BB=BF
Kelly,The "dynafocal" type mount has been tried on the rotary but has not worked out well= ..One of the obvious rotary traits is that it has a hot and cold side. Vari= ous methods have been used to limit this but there is no way to eliminate i= t completely. Because of this the engine tends to "work" and move= around on the studs. Using the engine as a stressed member is not recommen= ded with the rotary. If=C2=A0 you were to do this anyway I wouldn't do = it without a stud kit. You will have better results=C2=A0using a bed mount.= YMMV
Bill Jepson

On Wed, Jul 8, 2020 at 1:18 AM Kelly Troye= r keltro@gmail.com <flyr= otary@lancaironline.net> wrote:
I am in contact with a person with the design and manufacturing=C2=A0= = capability to produce an=C2=A0Aviation Specific 13B/20B = Mazda Front Side=C2=A0Housing mach= ined from 7075-T6=C2=A0with mount points that=C2=A0would allow these engines

to be a bolt in to the engine mount ring (30 degree number 1 Dyna) as = used by the "Vans" RV-10 and other aircraft that use the Lycoming= O/IO 540 engine..........This side plate is in the preliminary design stag= e and at this

point I am a go between to see if there would be any i= nterest in this product if and when it is=C2=A0= produced...........I personally am interested this side pla= te........As we on this forum know both the 13B / 20B are capable of truly<= br>
amazing power levels both naturally aspirated and turbo boosted.....= ....The 20B would make the Van's RV-10 , Glasair 3 or Lancair's tha= t use the Lycoming O/IO 540 an easy 300+ hp almost bolt in engine..........= .

The "Reno" Sport Class "Glasairs" and Lancairs= " are producing almost 400 mph speeds using dual turbo Lycoming IO-550= engines that are virtual hand grenades pulling over 700 hp...........There= are turbo 20B's pulling

1200 hp out in the auto racing world wi= th good reliability..........A 20B boosted to 700+ hp is not even breathing= hard.........IMHO

Would like to hear what interest there may be in = this product if and when it may be produced............Or any comments pro = or con..............=C2=A0=C2=A0
--
Kelly Troyer



--000000000000635faa05a9fa1769--