X-Junk-Score: 0 [] X-Cloudmark-Score: 0 [] X-Cloudmark-Analysis: v=2.3 cv=RZTu9Glv c=1 sm=1 tr=0 a=xivke4fp8nJ/KrVwOQ8OBQ==:117 a=MdSQJeINDwMNEIE/9bxyGw==:17 a=x7bEGLp0ZPQA:10 a=A-0mRrAPPO4A:10 a=nTHF0DUjJn0A:10 a=r77TgQKjGQsHNAKrUKIA:9 a=8uaU8uBYAAAA:8 a=pGLkceISAAAA:8 a=Ia-xEzejAAAA:8 a=UKPAHat8AAAA:8 a=GBZKE_NBAAAA:8 a=jThZ7_-JAAAA:8 a=_6GpL_ENAAAA:8 a=6_XaZ4d_hSafnDybcGQA:9 a=LDwy4neAAaTqM-jZ:21 a=xLiH_51DcWzfaYjp:21 a=rseMoRTQad48Bui8:21 a=QEXdDO2ut3YA:10 a=-FEs8UIgK8oA:10 a=NWVoK91CQyQA:10 a=4PR2P7QzAAAA:8 a=4IIPVbXNm5Mz_vkVBY4A:9 a=EBOVdtW7886Rxb40:21 a=A8n-tSUwoLisNXgx:21 a=hZJx6dOdGFZPihSK:21 a=_W_S_7VecoQA:10 a=ig8txPJwn2AfLL9XIXE4:22 a=Urk15JJjZg1Xo0ryW_k8:22 a=Fc6xXSS-RxGHxrvp76Qp:22 a=kZBJ7nflOVY83HLdyZAa:22 a=NVbvhy2gKIdozzgvQOKv:22 a=4dqwQCo7Po2mVW515mGf:22 a=pHzHmUro8NiASowvMSCR:22 a=nt3jZW36AmriUCFCBwmW:22 From: "Charlie England ceengland7@gmail.com" Received: from mail-qt1-f176.google.com ([209.85.160.176] verified) by logan.com (CommuniGate Pro SMTP 6.2.14) with ESMTPS id 426070 for flyrotary@lancaironline.net; Sat, 27 Jun 2020 17:10:35 -0400 Received-SPF: pass receiver=logan.com; client-ip=209.85.160.176; envelope-from=ceengland7@gmail.com Received: by mail-qt1-f176.google.com with SMTP id e12so10136816qtr.9 for ; Sat, 27 Jun 2020 14:10:36 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20161025; h=subject:to:references:from:message-id:date:user-agent:mime-version :in-reply-to:content-language; bh=bgXg4mja6p2+8eBHGViCZpuTa/dsxMHQp5ulFOTfxB8=; b=XD4gjnPbTitmdDCQYkw9v7ZU1wEhSGYzmZNlyig3hVCgX+wqYETfUNI9q6Jmf5K+Ps 7OFgAn2mOfTcgr8xxQ4JMzqLiBCVRkDPS8yGMynHhKugg+EHLTHY55+dftoslMXIy/UK hw355BXzpPjq0hGBSZGikJvYdxK8InfpgE/08THxympM7vFj+38AKJ6X4Bp1TsNolPw5 /59fsaP518cEWqCxrNxz43GhCkAPCTuLGX6KCyZ5eVmL5cuQz/+SFspkhdnbYE4qn01n QBfrq9lUmMv7OZvjNVKDFAnF2UuFU7ellvOVNO17BQ4JH0ddvbbGPegxCdwYj7z8TQCw syFg== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:subject:to:references:from:message-id:date :user-agent:mime-version:in-reply-to:content-language; bh=bgXg4mja6p2+8eBHGViCZpuTa/dsxMHQp5ulFOTfxB8=; b=NvRmClBg5/BrwCXTJcTUhG+guMsoA5sixsUNl634dPNvgLtyWMDC1dB70O9G+f6bNo D9YkCtIPH6A4VjhIQf0KyaO7Uz7qPbhTHR5zhD6pzedq1BtA/ktoPWBpQAa3xwo4T+DC fYsVUK0Xq2LSlIH2wm+GArZKO00g3W73LGobK9xOO8wmDY56VqFXNGnTRFiGtekbzNdW OWj/srNOEt/OrZzM5Nt4XdhREHlMrUo67YxBUKEfJxyfEEB1LVvC8HcR6THKc9odO5VK sxaJBW84MkOEuNZXw4/p7w6hcDZaVi90l/P2Ly70cIlzctpLqQ1XJBJSz4xc5QoUvOte WLVQ== X-Gm-Message-State: AOAM533d4UcVePiELfmKWNv4yvRbMKs2AIOVT99xDk2oy81zLlt4AItf srzAFrhrGPfIEoQFPwuZriZL2TMj X-Google-Smtp-Source: ABdhPJz4RtXX+3ODDBKV5GN0/jmag3VXuWEdCbWy1eGBElaIXYVXmP5sKEnwaUdHGtCcn3GNlUKkYw== X-Received: by 2002:aed:2142:: with SMTP id 60mr9224351qtc.176.1593292219384; Sat, 27 Jun 2020 14:10:19 -0700 (PDT) Return-Path: Received: from [192.168.10.245] (mobile-166-170-59-101.mycingular.net. [166.170.59.101]) by smtp.googlemail.com with ESMTPSA id q189sm9489783qkd.57.2020.06.27.14.10.17 for (version=TLS1_2 cipher=ECDHE-ECDSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 bits=128/128); Sat, 27 Jun 2020 14:10:18 -0700 (PDT) Subject: Re: [FlyRotary] Re: SpeedUino To: Rotary motors in aircraft References: Message-ID: <573aca45-1fed-c621-084e-ab7af00b7305@gmail.com> Date: Sat, 27 Jun 2020 16:10:29 -0500 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 6.1; WOW64; rv:68.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/68.9.0 MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="------------E7E1928CFC3FA0B4552CE277" Content-Language: en-US X-Antivirus: Avast (VPS 200627-8, 06/27/2020), Outbound message X-Antivirus-Status: Clean This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --------------E7E1928CFC3FA0B4552CE277 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Would you consider his controller flight-worthy? I've had his website bookmarked for years, but couldn't convince myself on the wisdom of flying a product that, when I 1st discovered it, had only been installed on his bike. I still love the idea; we'd never have vapor related fuel issues again. Bummer that the Speeduino doesn't have the software & hardware to control the pump. You'd think they would do it, since just about every car includes pump control in the engine controller these days. Charlie On 6/27/2020 10:47 AM, Steven W. Boese SBoese@uwyo.edu wrote: > Charlie, > > The pump/filter unit is in a small header tank similar to the > Vikingaircraftengines system.  The controller is not part of the > Speeduino system, but a separate unit from madhu.com . > > Steve Boese > > On Jun 27, 2020, at 7:18 AM, Charlie England ceengland7@gmail.com > > wrote: > >> Oooh...did I miss (or forget) a memo about the turbine pump/controller? >> In-tank pump, or did you rig something external with positive >> delivery to its input? >> Is the pump controller part of the Speeduino hardware/software, or a >> separate controller? >> >> Thanks, >> >> Charlie >> >> On Sat, Jun 27, 2020 at 8:08 AM Steven W. Boese SBoese@uwyo.edu >> > > wrote: >> >> Bobby, >> >> I'm using only the MAP sensor on the Speeduino board. The fuel >> pressure sensor that is used with the turbine type pump and pump >> controller is MAP compensated. >> >> Steve Boese >> >> On Jun 27, 2020, at 6:56 AM, Bobby J. Hughes bhughes@qnsi.net >> > > wrote: >> >>> Thanks Steve. That clears up a few things. I came across posts >>> on the SpeedUino forum  discussing Table Blending had been added >>> as a feature so I assumed two or more individual tables would be >>> necessary. TPS, MAP, Flex Fuel sensor etc. Are you using two MAP >>> sensors for altitude fuel compensation? >>> >>> Bobby >>> >>> Sent from my iPad >>> >>>> On Jun 26, 2020, at 11:43 PM, Steven W. Boese SBoese@uwyo.edu >>>> >>> > wrote: >>>> >>>>  >>>> Bobby, >>>> >>>> With my Renesis dual wheel trigger setup, tooth #1 is the first >>>> tooth on the 12 tooth (crank) wheel after the signal from >>>> single tooth (cam) wheel.  The crank and cam signals are >>>> actually generated by a single wheel on the E-shaft.  The angle >>>> of this tooth #1 relative to TDC can be specified in the setup. >>>> >>>> The TPS input code has been changed to add or subtract from the >>>> pulse width after all other calculations are made in order have >>>> it act as a manual mixture control. >>>> >>>> I also changed the VE table so the cells all are 100 initially >>>> rather than reflecting the MAP percent of the sea level >>>> pressure.  The MAP percentage is now applied before the VE >>>> table values are applied.  For example, the original table >>>> value would have been 50 if MAP was half of sea level.  This >>>> makes the VE table act like the EC2 mixture correction table.  >>>> Changing the values in the VE table to values less or more than >>>> 100 delivers less or more fuel compared to what would be >>>> delivered as calculated from the displacement, MAP, intake air >>>> temp, and desired AFR. >>>> >>>> I'm not sure what table 1 and table 2 would refer to in the >>>> Speeduino - MSDruid cell phone app system I'm using. >>>> >>>> Steve Boese >>>> >>>> On Jun 26, 2020, at 2:01 PM, Bobby J. Hughes bhughes@qnsi.net >>>> >>> > wrote: >>>> >>>>> ◆ This message was sent from a non-UWYO address. Please >>>>> exercise caution when clicking links or opening attachments >>>>> from external sources. >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> Another question Steve. When you switched the code for TPS are >>>>> you using it in blended tables where table 2 is Alpha–N, TPS >>>>> and table 1 is MAP based? Or are you running pure Alpha–N? It >>>>> appears a second MAP sensor can be wired in externally and >>>>> left open to the atmosphere for altitude fuel compensation. >>>>> >>>>> Thanks, >>>>> >>>>> Bobby >>>>> >>>>> *From:*Rotary motors in aircraft >>>>> [mailto:flyrotary@lancaironline.net] >>>>> *Sent:* Friday, June 26, 2020 12:33 AM >>>>> *To:* Rotary motors in aircraft >>>>> *Subject:* [FlyRotary] Re: SpeedUino >>>>> >>>>> Charlie, >>>>> >>>>> I changed the code in the Speediuno to use the TPS input to >>>>> give manual mixture control from a potentiometer and it works >>>>> fine, both with a Speedysim board and with the actual running >>>>> engine. >>>>> >>>>> Steve Boese >>>>> >>>>> ------------------------------------------------------------------------ >>>>> >>>>> *From:*Rotary motors in aircraft >>>> > on behalf of Charlie >>>>> England ceengland7@gmail.com >>>>> > >>>>> *Sent:* Thursday, June 25, 2020 10:21 PM >>>>> *To:* Rotary motors in aircraft >>>> > >>>>> *Subject:* [FlyRotary] Re: SpeedUino >>>>> >>>>> ◆ This message was sent from a non-UWYO address. Please >>>>> exercise caution when clicking links or opening attachments >>>>> from external sources. >>>>> >>>>> Yes, my idea would be an opamp confgured as a summing >>>>> amplifier, with the wideband on one input and biasing voltage >>>>> on the other. >>>>> >>>>> The TPS sounds simpler, if that will work. >>>>> >>>>> Charlie >>>>> >>>>> Sent from BlueMail >>>>> >>>>> On Jun 25, 2020, at 8:45 PM, "Steven W. Boese SBoese@uwyo.edu >>>>> " >>>> > wrote: >>>>> >>>>> Charlie, >>>>> >>>>> The O2 sensor outputs a voltage but very little current. That >>>>> would make it difficult to bias it in a predictable way.  >>>>> Biasing a buffered output such as a wideband O2 unit output >>>>> would probably work. >>>>> >>>>> Steve Boese >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> On Jun 21, 2020, at 7:10 AM, Charlie England >>>>> ceengland7@gmail.com >>>>> >>>> > wrote: >>>>> >>>>> Any reason (other than the need to run 'closed loop' all >>>>> the time) to not use a bias voltage added/subtracted from >>>>> the O2 sensor output, to control mixture? >>>>> >>>>> Charlie >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> *Disclaimer* >>>>> >>>>> The information contained in this communication from the >>>>> sender is confidential. It is intended solely for use by the >>>>> recipient and others authorized to receive it. If you are not >>>>> the recipient, you are hereby notified that any disclosure, >>>>> copying, distribution or taking action in relation of the >>>>> contents of this information is strictly prohibited and may be >>>>> unlawful. >>>>> >>>>> This email has been scanned for viruses and malware, and may >>>>> have been automatically archived by *Mimecast Ltd*, an >>>>> innovator in Software as a Service (SaaS) for business. >>>>> Providing a *safer* and *more useful* place for your human >>>>> generated data. Specializing in; Security, archiving and >>>>> compliance. To find out more Click Here >>>>> . >>>>> >> >> >> Virus-free. www.avast.com >> >> >> -- This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software. https://www.avast.com/antivirus --------------E7E1928CFC3FA0B4552CE277 Content-Type: text/html; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit
Would you consider his controller flight-worthy? I've had his website bookmarked for years, but couldn't convince myself on the wisdom of flying a product that, when I 1st discovered it, had only been installed on his bike. I still love the idea; we'd never have vapor related fuel issues again.

Bummer that the Speeduino doesn't have the software & hardware to control the pump. You'd think they would do it, since just about every car includes pump control in the engine controller these days.

Charlie

On 6/27/2020 10:47 AM, Steven W. Boese SBoese@uwyo.edu wrote:
Charlie,

The pump/filter unit is in a small header tank similar to the Vikingaircraftengines system.  The controller is not part of the Speeduino system, but a separate unit from madhu.com.

Steve Boese

On Jun 27, 2020, at 7:18 AM, Charlie England ceengland7@gmail.com <flyrotary@lancaironline.net> wrote:

Oooh...did I miss (or forget) a memo about the turbine pump/controller?
In-tank pump, or did you rig something external with positive delivery to its input?
Is the pump controller part of the Speeduino hardware/software, or a separate controller?

Thanks,

Charlie

On Sat, Jun 27, 2020 at 8:08 AM Steven W. Boese SBoese@uwyo.edu <flyrotary@lancaironline.net> wrote:
Bobby,

I'm using only the MAP sensor on the Speeduino board.  The fuel pressure sensor that is used with the turbine type pump and pump controller is MAP compensated.

Steve Boese

On Jun 27, 2020, at 6:56 AM, Bobby J. Hughes bhughes@qnsi.net <flyrotary@lancaironline.net> wrote:

Thanks Steve. That clears up a few things. I came across posts on the SpeedUino forum  discussing Table Blending had been added as a feature so I assumed two or more individual tables would be necessary. TPS, MAP, Flex Fuel sensor etc. Are you using two MAP sensors for altitude fuel compensation? 

Bobby

Sent from my iPad

On Jun 26, 2020, at 11:43 PM, Steven W. Boese SBoese@uwyo.edu <flyrotary@lancaironline.net> wrote:


Bobby,

With my Renesis dual wheel trigger setup, tooth #1 is the first tooth on the 12 tooth (crank) wheel after the signal from single tooth (cam) wheel.  The crank and cam signals are actually generated by a single wheel on the E-shaft.  The angle of this tooth #1 relative to TDC can be specified in the setup.

The TPS input code has been changed to add or subtract from the pulse width after all other calculations are made in order have it act as a manual mixture control.

I also changed the VE table so the cells all are 100 initially rather than reflecting the MAP percent of the sea level pressure.  The MAP percentage is now applied before the VE table values are applied.  For example, the original table value would have been 50 if MAP was half of sea level.  This makes the VE table act like the EC2 mixture correction table.  Changing the values in the VE table to values less or more than 100 delivers less or more fuel compared to what would be delivered as calculated from the displacement, MAP, intake air temp, and desired AFR.  

I'm not sure what table 1 and table 2 would refer to in the Speeduino - MSDruid cell phone app system I'm using.

Steve Boese

On Jun 26, 2020, at 2:01 PM, Bobby J. Hughes bhughes@qnsi.net <flyrotary@lancaironline.net> wrote:

◆ This message was sent from a non-UWYO address. Please exercise caution when clicking links or opening attachments from external sources.


Another question Steve. When you switched the code for TPS are you using it in blended tables where table 2 is Alpha–N, TPS and table 1 is MAP based? Or are you running pure Alpha–N? It appears a second MAP sensor can be wired in externally and left open to the atmosphere for altitude fuel compensation.  

 

Thanks,

 

Bobby

 

From: Rotary motors in aircraft [mailto:flyrotary@lancaironline.net]
Sent: Friday, June 26, 2020 12:33 AM
To: Rotary motors in aircraft
Subject: [FlyRotary] Re: SpeedUino

 

Charlie,

 

I changed the code in the Speediuno to use the TPS input to give manual mixture control from a potentiometer and it works fine, both with a Speedysim board and with the actual running engine.

 

Steve Boese

 

From: Rotary motors in aircraft <flyrotary@lancaironline.net> on behalf of Charlie England ceengland7@gmail.com <flyrotary@lancaironline.net>
Sent: Thursday, June 25, 2020 10:21 PM
To: Rotary motors in aircraft <flyrotary@lancaironline.net>
Subject: [FlyRotary] Re: SpeedUino

 

◆ This message was sent from a non-UWYO address. Please exercise caution when clicking links or opening attachments from external sources.

 

Yes, my idea would be an opamp confgured as a summing amplifier, with the wideband on one input and biasing voltage on the other.

The TPS sounds simpler, if that will work.

Charlie

Sent from BlueMail

On Jun 25, 2020, at 8:45 PM, "Steven W. Boese SBoese@uwyo.edu" <flyrotary@lancaironline.net> wrote:

Charlie,

 

The O2 sensor outputs a voltage but very little current.  That would make it difficult to bias it in a predictable way.  Biasing a buffered output such as a wideband O2 unit output would probably work.

Steve Boese


On Jun 21, 2020, at 7:10 AM, Charlie England ceengland7@gmail.com <flyrotary@lancaironline.net> wrote:

Any reason (other than the need to run 'closed loop' all the time) to not use a bias voltage added/subtracted from the O2 sensor output, to control mixture?

 

Charlie



Disclaimer

The information contained in this communication from the sender is confidential. It is intended solely for use by the recipient and others authorized to receive it. If you are not the recipient, you are hereby notified that any disclosure, copying, distribution or taking action in relation of the contents of this information is strictly prohibited and may be unlawful.

This email has been scanned for viruses and malware, and may have been automatically archived by Mimecast Ltd, an innovator in Software as a Service (SaaS) for business. Providing a safer and more useful place for your human generated data. Specializing in; Security, archiving and compliance. To find out more Click Here.


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