X-Virus-Scanned: clean according to Sophos on Logan.com From: "Tracy Crook" Received: from mail-yk0-f170.google.com ([209.85.160.170] verified) by logan.com (CommuniGate Pro SMTP 6.1.8) with ESMTPS id 8340919 for flyrotary@lancaironline.net; Wed, 20 Jan 2016 13:55:29 -0500 Received-SPF: pass receiver=logan.com; client-ip=209.85.160.170; envelope-from=rwstracy@gmail.com Received: by mail-yk0-f170.google.com with SMTP id x67so20912326ykd.2 for ; Wed, 20 Jan 2016 10:55:29 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20120113; h=message-id:mime-version:to:from:subject:date:importance:in-reply-to :references:content-type; bh=5UQIWRbBa+NgyF8uaFZdN3/IIsGasBEjYp4ya6veVY8=; b=0ewaQSVIVbQkm8LOClMQ9E7hG5dWp+fdCvXOvdDIm/Gqf70cPKIamQIALqaWH6X9w/ Puq0tavWWp7fjBRFpyQn96bZ00IEPxNFil5cV/cju107j/fATOtEy4saBQzS6Hf+ZCeT Sq+nVCOSQUQC6TJ0BAdX97WrPMDiflx9OQX8Qt6MmIKxE0NPidxIjz4EUnLjHaPJbjTe ZN0KDYhDqO+2093H2ErJGJBceldyeRVb8+f9ABGeRn3SX3fUQrIknw3Irjhh1MelHGlH 5lOBZYyg6p9VGhyQc+J0/oPvxRVEp1TNhsQ3SrJx8FaIjs6rdpHTcQPZ7qSo6OBS9A1D pUHA== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20130820; h=x-gm-message-state:message-id:mime-version:to:from:subject:date :importance:in-reply-to:references:content-type; bh=5UQIWRbBa+NgyF8uaFZdN3/IIsGasBEjYp4ya6veVY8=; b=a+PyecKe2Q7drl7GH8UBwHbSnZZ2L6VmaUpEVwDMQ51osN5gDAgGW2TTXLNICajZ4s etxWLS0KOoC2SUzIqGy2Mw/ErTIDCfFYpYJ8lYGwrIUxTfyI7nMx5mOVMv1e7vcXAuMc leRjCEZoZAWaEK6+VS9g6CpfdCv4269nnaNUzlKOoxdkfjBCZ+X7gDGOVwDZ+KmGhgZI LvNtM+r0emyZN3Ba6Oa0GQbQAiuMgbV6W4jXj2UHG4bWZJED+3NW660BGYZvdLnzvLvK mKFCI8XYOwYMqMWZ00Y+48RmxGA+WdPYvsgqW4gAup6nKnEHcKz9aY8+L0x/vGmyfAxP 8svg== X-Gm-Message-State: ALoCoQnH0gZH89HEjb8XgiK1JzWajT9vLAsjK5v+GivilxHV5nbKlj8V//EOl9YwDmhAXIjtHB0IY3hP2OA1NsF/GE4ffeyxug== X-Received: by 10.37.91.68 with SMTP id p65mr11825199ybb.117.1453316111151; Wed, 20 Jan 2016 10:55:11 -0800 (PST) Return-Path: Received: from ?IPv6:::ffff:192.168.254.2? (h96.33.187.173.dynamic.ip.windstream.net. [173.187.33.96]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id p63sm26153761ywf.8.2016.01.20.10.55.09 for (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=OTHER); Wed, 20 Jan 2016 10:55:09 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: <569fd80d.42ff0d0a.6a81c.17aa@mx.google.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Bill Bradburry Subject: RE: [FlyRotary] Re: What do you think may be happening? Date: Wed, 20 Jan 2016 13:55:06 -0500 Importance: normal X-Priority: 3 In-Reply-To: References: Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="_9C8FA8CC-FAE0-4A8A-87DF-68E3F7344DA3_" --_9C8FA8CC-FAE0-4A8A-87DF-68E3F7344DA3_ Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="_B08AE7F9-7D48-4DA6-B8F0-7B33662A0471_" --_B08AE7F9-7D48-4DA6-B8F0-7B33662A0471_ Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Steve=E2=80=99s description of how the EC2/3 works was correct. Many get this bit confused but The intention with the disable switch was t= o use a DPDT switch for the disables. When in the disable position, the o= ther pole of the switch is used to activate (switch to ground) the Cold Sta= rt input to the EC2/3 at the same time. This eliminates having to turn off= the CS switch when disabling a set of injectors and enables the EC2 to ope= rate on either set over the full range of manifold pressures. The EC2/3 is= able to see when you have disabled the primaries and operate the secondary= =E2=80=99s even though engine is operating below stage point. I=E2=80=99ve been out of touch lately and will be for awhile. Need to have= my hip replaced (again). Tracy Sent from Mail for Windows 10 From: Bill Bradburry Sent: Wednesday, January 20, 2016 1:44 PM To: Rotary motors in aircraft Subject: [FlyRotary] Re: What do you think may be happening? Steve, I think my engine dies and has little effect when I turn off the primary an= d secondary respectively.=C2=A0 I will have to investigate this when I get = the switches replaced (I plan to replace both)=C2=A0 I may have something m= iswired?? It is cold, maybe Tracy is back in Florida and will chime in. Bill=20 From: Rotary motors in aircraft [mailto:flyrotary@lancaironline.net]=20 Sent: Wednesday, January 20, 2016 12:32 PM To: Rotary motors in aircraft Subject: [FlyRotary] Re: What do you think may be happening? Bill, I have tested the injector disable function with my EC2's.=C2=A0 With the p= ower interrupted to the primary injectors and the cold switch on, the engin= e runs on the secondary injectors at MAP below the staging threshold.=C2=A0= I don't know the details of how the controller treats the cold switch, but= it is possible that with the cold switch on, the controller increases the = fuel flow by using both the primary and secondary injectors at MAP below th= e staging threshold, and doubles the injector pulse width at MAP above the = staging threshold.=C2=A0 I remember investigating this when first using the= controllers but don't remember the exact details.=C2=A0=C2=A0My backup sys= tem does work at low MAP. Steve From: Rotary motors in aircraft on behalf of = Bill Bradburry Sent: Wednesday, January 20, 2016 11:15 AM To: Rotary motors in aircraft Subject: [FlyRotary] Re: What do you think may be happening?=20 =C2=A0 Bobby, I am sorry I was not clear and the reason was that I was not clear myself. =C2=A0 The injector disable switches are for in case you lose an injector in fligh= t and the engine starts to run on only one rotor.=C2=A0 You can disable eit= her of the primary or secondary injectors which will take the failed inject= or out of the circuit. Tracy says you should test this to make sure that it works.=C2=A0 That is w= here my question came from.=C2=A0 You can only test the disable switches wh= en the engine is not staged.=C2=A0 If the engine is staged, and you turn of= f the primary injectors, the engine will die because the secondary injector= s are not running, and if you turn off the secondary injectors, the engine = will run rich because you turned on the cold start but the secondaries were= not running anyway. =C2=A0 I am not sure what would happen if you lost a primary injector in flight, d= isabled the primary injectors, then reduced power to the staging point in o= rder to land???=C2=A0 I suspect all would get quiet!=C2=A0 :>( =C2=A0 Bill=20 =C2=A0 From: Rotary motors in aircraft [mailto:flyrotary@lancaironline.net]=20 Sent: Wednesday, January 20, 2016 11:35 AM To: Rotary motors in aircraft Subject: [FlyRotary] Re: What do you think may be happening? =C2=A0 Bill, =C2=A0 I=E2=80=99m not sure I understand the question.=C2=A0 If your referring to = my =E2=80=9Ccenter off switch position=E2=80=9D it=E2=80=99s not used in fl= ight. Intentionally anyway =E2=98=BA It=E2=80=99s used to shut down the eng= ine. Primary injector switch of course. Same switch used for both primary a= nd secondary injectors.=20 =C2=A0 Bobby =C2=A0 From: Rotary motors in aircraft [mailto:flyrotary@lancaironline.net]=20 Sent: Wednesday, January 20, 2016 10:55 AM To: Rotary motors in aircraft Subject: [FlyRotary] Re: What do you think may be happening? =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 Changing the subject a minute=E2=80=A6How do you disable the secondary=E2= =80=99s when the engine is staged??=C2=A0 They are not running anyway??? =C2=A0 Bill=20 =C2=A0 --_B08AE7F9-7D48-4DA6-B8F0-7B33662A0471_ Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Type: text/html; charset="utf-8"

Steve=E2=80=99s description of how t= he EC2/3 works was correct.

 

Many get this bit confused but The intention with =C2=A0= the disable switch was to use a DPDT switch for the disables.=C2=A0=C2=A0 W= hen in the disable position, the other pole of the switch is used to activa= te (switch to ground) the Cold Start input to the EC2/3 at the same time.= =C2=A0 This eliminates having to turn off the CS switch when disabling a se= t of injectors and enables the EC2 to operate on either set over the full r= ange of manifold pressures.=C2=A0 The EC2/3 is able to see when you have di= sabled the primaries and operate the secondary=E2=80=99s =C2=A0even though = engine is operating below stage point.

 <= /o:p>

I=E2=80=99ve been out of touch lately and wil= l be for awhile.=C2=A0 Need to have my hip replaced (again).

 

Tracy

 

Sent from Mail for Windows 10

 


From: Bill Bradburry
Sent: Wednesday, January 20,= 2016 1:44 PM
To: = Rotary motors in aircraft
Subject: [FlyRotary] Re: What do yo= u think may be happening?

 <= /p>

Steve,

I = think my engine dies and has little effect when I turn off the primary and = secondary respectively.  I will have to investigate this when I get th= e switches replaced (I plan to replace both)  I may have something mis= wired??

It is cold, maybe Tracy i= s back in Florida and will chime in.

 

Bill

 

From: Rotary motors in aircraft [mailto:flyrotary@lancaironlin= e.net]
Sent: Wednesday, January 20, 2016 12:32 PM
To: = Rotary motors in aircraft
Subject: [FlyRotary] Re: What do you th= ink may be happening?

 

Bill,

<= span style=3D'font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:black'> 

I have tested the injector disable function wi= th my EC2's.  With the power interrupted to the primary injectors and = the cold switch on, the engine runs on the secondary injectors at MAP below= the staging threshold.  I don't know the details of how the controlle= r treats the cold switch, but it is possible that with the cold switch on, = the controller increases the fuel flow by using both the primary and second= ary injectors at MAP below the staging threshold, and doubles the injector = pulse width at MAP above the staging threshold.  I remember investigat= ing this when first using the controllers but don't remember the exact deta= ils.  My backup system does work at low MAP.

 

= Steve

 

From: Rotary motors in aircraft <flyrotary@lancairo= nline.net> on behalf of Bill Bradburry <flyrotary@lancaironline.net&g= t;
Sent: Wednesday, January 20, 2016 11:15 AM
To: Rotar= y motors in aircraft
Subject: [FlyRotary] Re: What do you think m= ay be happening?

 

Bobby,

I am sorry I was not clear and the reason was that I was not clea= r myself.

 <= /span>

The injector disable switches are f= or in case you lose an injector in flight and the engine starts to run on o= nly one rotor.  You can disable either of the primary or secondary inj= ectors which will take the failed injector out of the circuit.

<= span style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:navy'>T= racy says you should test this to make sure that it works.  That is wh= ere my question came from.  You can only test the disable switches whe= n the engine is not staged.  If the engine is staged, and you turn off= the primary injectors, the engine will die because the secondary injectors= are not running, and if you turn off the secondary injectors, the engine w= ill run rich because you turned on the cold start but the secondaries were = not running anyway.

 

I am not sure what would h= appen if you lost a primary injector in flight, disabled the primary inject= ors, then reduced power to the staging point in order to land???  I su= spect all would get quiet!  :>(<= o:p>

 

Bill <= /span>

 

<= div>

From:<= span style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma",sans-serif;color:black'= > Rotary motors in aircraft [mailto:flyrotary@lancaironline.net]
Sen= t: Wednesday, January 20, 2016 11:35 AM
To: Rotary motors in = aircraft
Subject: [FlyRotary] Re: What do you think may be happen= ing?

 <= /p>

Bill,

 

I=E2=80=99m not sure I understand the question.  If your refer= ring to my =E2=80=9Ccenter off switch position=E2=80=9D it=E2=80=99s not us= ed in flight. Intentionally anyway J It=E2=80=99s used to shut= down the engine. Primary injector switch of course. Same switch used for b= oth primary and secondary injectors.

 

Bobby

 

From: Rotary m= otors in aircraft [mailto:flyrotary@lancaironline.net]
Sent: Wed= nesday, January 20, 2016 10:55 AM
To: Rotary motors in aircraftSubject: [FlyRotary] Re: What do you think may be happening?

 

<= p style=3D'background:white'> 

 

Ch= anging the subject a minute=E2=80=A6How do you disable the secondary=E2=80= =99s when the engine is staged??  They are not running anyway???

 

Bill =

 

 

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