X-Virus-Scanned: clean according to Sophos on Logan.com Return-Path: Received: from [64.129.170.194] (HELO VIRCOM1.fcdata.private) by logan.com (CommuniGate Pro SMTP 6.0c1) with ESMTP id 5724825 for flyrotary@lancaironline.net; Wed, 22 Aug 2012 21:50:27 -0400 Received-SPF: none receiver=logan.com; client-ip=64.129.170.194; envelope-from=cbarber@texasattorney.net Received: from FCD-MAIL06.FCDATA.PRIVATE (unverified [172.16.5.23]) by VIRCOM1.fcdata.private (Vircom SMTPRS 5.1.1024.13396) with ESMTP id for ; Wed, 22 Aug 2012 20:48:54 -0500 X-Modus-BlackList: 172.16.5.23=OK;cbarber@texasattorney.net=OK X-Modus-RBL: 172.16.5.23=Excluded X-Modus-Trusted: 172.16.5.23=NO X-Modus-Audit: FALSE;0;0;0 Received: from FCD-MAIL05.FCDATA.PRIVATE ([fe80::809d:a06e:5913:452e]) by FCD-MAIL06.FCDATA.PRIVATE ([fe80::697f:d6aa:b87:78d8%17]) with mapi id 14.01.0379.000; Wed, 22 Aug 2012 20:51:01 -0500 From: Chris Barber To: Rotary motors in aircraft CC: Rotary motors in aircraft Subject: Re: [FlyRotary] Re: Check Temps on Climbout was e: [FlyRotary]Turboquestion. Thread-Topic: [FlyRotary] Re: Check Temps on Climbout was e: [FlyRotary]Turboquestion. Thread-Index: AQHNgL4QEwh0t4XKakmWDqqH4m+d5pdmoa4g Date: Thu, 23 Aug 2012 01:49:50 +0000 Message-ID: References: In-Reply-To: Accept-Language: en-US Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="_000_AC323D99F591493FAF864E45D5D5D172texasattorneynet_" MIME-Version: 1.0 --_000_AC323D99F591493FAF864E45D5D5D172texasattorneynet_ Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Yes. That is correct. The 3lb spring limits boost it is the lowest I have a= s I wanted to start low. I checked my intercooler and it is flowing well. No obstruction or leak I c= ould find. It may be the location of the blow of valve. I will remove it an= d see if I get good boost Sent from my iPhone 4 On Aug 22, 2012, at 6:30 PM, "CozyGirrrl@aol.com= " > wrote: Andrew, I believe the 3 lb spring he is talking about is the wastegate spri= ng, this limits boost, the 3 lb one is the lowest boost available, as the s= prings get stronger the more exhaust is forced through the turbo. Chris? Chrissi & Randi www.CozyGirrrl.com ClickBonds 10/$7.50 CG Products, Custom Aircraft Hardware Chairwomen, Sun-N-Fun Engine Workshop In a message dated 8/22/2012 6:08:30 P.M. Central Daylight Time, andrew@mar= tinag.com.au writes: Chris if your blow off valve is before the intercooler, it may just be opening to= o soon with that 3lb spring and allowing all your air to vent, then the eng= ine would act as NA but with the intercooler as a added restriction. try a = heavier spring. Andrew On Thu, Aug 23, 2012 at 6:53 AM, Chris Barber > wrote: Thanks Ed. I am pleased you verified my concern after my cooling skyrocketi= ng yesterday when I went to full power. Trying to determine where the restriction is now. You are the best. Sent from my iPhone 4 On Aug 22, 2012, at 4:48 PM, "Ed Anderson" > wrote: > Chris, One thing to be checking on your next take off is your coolant/oil= temps. As you know take-off is the worst combination of low cooling air m= ass flow and max engine temperature due to WOT. > > You would be surprised how quickly (with the additional power you now hav= e) you will exceed your cooling limits if not careful. So I would be certa= in to check the temps at a frequent rate on your next take-off until you kn= ow how the system is going to react - hate to see you cook your engine duri= ng your first real Turbo climb out. > > I find for my Rv-6A that I needed to get to 120 mph IAS as quick as possi= ble to get on the good side of the cooling curve. So that generally meant = take off - get safely above surround obstructions, then level off/reduce cl= imb until airspeed hit 120. Then I could resume climb with cooling gradual= ly bring the temps down as altitude and airflow increased. Your sweet spot= airspeed would undoubtedly be different given different platform and cooli= ng set up. > > Ed > > -------------------------------------------------- > From: "Chris Barber" > > Sent: Monday, August 20, 2012 9:17 PM > To: "Rotary motors in aircraft" > > Subject: [FlyRotary] Turbo question. > >> As I have mentioned I have had what I think are incongruent readings reg= arding my manifold pressure (mp)and engine rpm. It seems I am getting quite= low mp as I add power to higher rpm. >> >> I am not well versed in this area but my thought is that as I add power,= even with slight boost (currently using a 3 lb spring in my wastegate) eve= ntually my mp should raise a bit more. >> >> Today I did some static test. I recorded engine RPM with the turbo hook= ed up and recorded the mp at 1000 rpm increments. Then I removed the turbo = plumbing from my intake and recorded the same info My results currently con= fuse me. >> >> With the turbo hooked up I am getting >> >> RPM. MP inches >> 2000 - 14.0 >> 3000 - 15.5 >> 4000 - 19.3 >> 5000 - 21.6 >> 5700 - 24.5 (topped out) >> >> With the turbo removed. >> >> 2000 - 15.8 >> 3000 - 15.3 >> 4000 - 19.7 >> 5000 - 24.8 >> 5833 - 29.8 >> >> Is this indicative of restriction in my plumbing? Perhaps in the inter c= ooler? A dirty air filter? A bad pop off valve or a leak not allowing the a= ir pressure getting to the intake. Or???? >> >> I am uncertain what other permitters I need to check and provide. I am j= ust starting my diagnosis in my Phase One testing. I only have 1.6 hours in= the air so far. I value ya'll's direction and input. >> >> Heck, perhaps this is working properly but it just doesn't seem right/co= mfortable. >> >> Thanks folks. >> >> Chris Barber >> Houston >> Velocity SE >> Rotary 13b turbo (?) :-) >> >> >> >> Sent from my iPhone 4 >> -- >> Homepage: http://www.flyrotary.com/ >> Archive and UnSub: http://mail.lancaironline.net:81/lists/flyrotary/List= .html >> >> >> ----- >> No virus found in this message. >> Checked by AVG - www.avg.com >> Version: 2012.0.2197 / Virus Database: 2437/5211 - Release Date: 08/20/1= 2 >> > > -- > Homepage: http://www.flyrotary.com/ > Archive and UnSub: http://mail.lancaironline.net:81/lists/flyrotary/Lis= t.html -- Homepage: http://www.flyrotary.com/ Archive and UnSub: http://mail.lancaironline.net:81/lists/flyrotary/List.= html -- Regards Andrew Martin Martin Ag 275 Newmarracarra Rd Moonyoonooka WA 6532 0427477144 08 99241145 andrew@martinag.com.au --_000_AC323D99F591493FAF864E45D5D5D172texasattorneynet_ Content-Type: text/html; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Yes. That is correct. The 3lb spring limits boost it is the lowest I h= ave as I wanted to start low. 
I checked my intercooler and it is flowing well. No obstruction or lea= k I could find. It may be the location of the blow of valve. I will remove = it and see if I get good boost



Sent from my iPhone 4

On Aug 22, 2012, at 6:30 PM, "Co= zyGirrrl@aol.com" <CozyGi= rrrl@aol.com> wrote:

Andrew, I believe the 3 lb spring he is talking about is the wastegate= spring, this limits boost, the 3 lb one is the lowest boost available, as = the springs get stronger the more exhaust is forced through the turbo.
Chris?
 
Chrissi & Randi

www.CozyGirrrl.com
ClickBonds 10/$7.50
CG Products, Custom Aircraft Hardware
Chairwomen, Sun-N-Fun Engine Workshop
 
In a message dated 8/22/2012 6:08:30 P.M. Central Daylight Time, andrew@martinag.com.au writes:
Chris

if your blow off valve is before the intercooler, it may just be opening to= o soon with that 3lb spring and allowing all your air to vent, then the eng= ine would act as NA but with the intercooler as a added restriction. try a = heavier spring.

Andrew

On Thu, Aug 23, 2012 at 6:53 AM, Chris Barber <cbarber@texasattorney.net>= wrote:
Thanks Ed. I am pleased you verified my concern after my cooling skyrocketi= ng yesterday when I went to full power.

Trying to determine where the restriction is now.

You are the best.

Sent from my iPhone 4

On Aug 22, 2012, at 4:48 PM, "Ed Anderson" <= eanderson@carolina.rr.com> wrote:

> Chris, One thing to be checking on your next take off is your coolant/= oil temps.  As you know take-off is the worst combination of low cooli= ng air mass flow and max engine temperature due to WOT.
>
> You would be surprised how quickly (with the additional power you now = have) you will exceed your cooling limits if not careful.  So I would = be certain to check the temps at a frequent rate on your next take-off unti= l you know how the system is going to react - hate to see you cook your engine during your first real Turbo climb out.=
>
> I find for my Rv-6A that I needed to get to 120 mph IAS as quick as po= ssible to get on the good side of the cooling curve.  So that generall= y meant take off - get safely above surround obstructions, then level off/r= educe climb until airspeed hit 120.  Then I could resume climb with cooling gradually bring the temps down as altitu= de and airflow increased.  Your sweet spot airspeed would undoubtedly = be different given different platform and cooling set up.
>
> Ed
>
> --------------------------------------------------
> From: "Chris Barber" <cbarber@texasattorney.= net>
> Sent: Monday, August 20, 2012 9:17 PM
> To: "Rotary motors in aircraft" <flyrota= ry@lancaironline.net>
> Subject: [FlyRotary] Turbo question.
>
>> As I have mentioned I have had what I think are incongruent readin= gs regarding my manifold pressure (mp)and engine rpm. It seems I am getting= quite low mp as I add power to higher rpm.
>>
>> I am not well versed in this area but my thought is that as I add = power, even with slight boost (currently using a 3 lb spring in my wastegat= e) eventually my mp should raise a bit more.
>>
>> Today I did some static test. I recorded engine RPM with the  = ;turbo hooked up and recorded the mp at 1000 rpm increments. Then I removed= the turbo plumbing from my intake and recorded the same info My results cu= rrently confuse me.
>>
>> With the turbo hooked up I am getting
>>
>> RPM.   MP inches
>> 2000 - 14.0
>> 3000 - 15.5
>> 4000 - 19.3
>> 5000 - 21.6
>> 5700 - 24.5 (topped out)
>>
>> With the turbo removed.
>>
>> 2000 - 15.8
>> 3000 - 15.3
>> 4000 - 19.7
>> 5000 - 24.8
>> 5833 - 29.8
>>
>> Is this indicative of restriction in my plumbing? Perhaps in the i= nter cooler? A dirty air filter? A bad pop off valve or a leak not allowing= the air pressure getting to the intake. Or????
>>
>> I am uncertain what other permitters I need to check and provide. = I am just starting my diagnosis in my Phase One testing. I only have 1.6 ho= urs in the air so far. I value ya'll's direction and input.
>>
>> Heck, perhaps this is working properly but it just doesn't seem ri= ght/comfortable.
>>
>> Thanks folks.
>>
>> Chris Barber
>> Houston
>> Velocity SE
>> Rotary 13b turbo (?) :-)
>>
>>
>>
>> Sent from my iPhone 4
>> --
>> Homepage:  http://www.flyrotary.com/
>> Archive and UnSub: http://mail.lancaironline.net:81/lists/flyrotary/List.html
>>
>>
>> -----
>> No virus found in this message.
>> Checked by AVG - www.avg.com
>> Version: 2012.0.2197 / Virus Database: 2437/5211 - Release Date: 0= 8/20/12
>>
>
> --
> Homepage:  http://www.flyrotary.com/
> Archive and UnSub:   http://mail.lancaironline.net:81/lists/flyrotary/List.html

--
Homepage:  http://www.flyrotary.com/
Archive and UnSub:   http://mail.lancaironline.net:81/lists/flyrotary/List.html



--
Regards

Andrew Martin
Martin Ag
275 Newmarracarra Rd
Moonyoonooka WA 6532

0427477144
08 99241145
andrew@martinag.com.au
--_000_AC323D99F591493FAF864E45D5D5D172texasattorneynet_--