X-Virus-Scanned: clean according to Sophos on Logan.com Return-Path: Received: from cdptpa-omtalb.mail.rr.com ([75.180.132.123] verified) by logan.com (CommuniGate Pro SMTP 5.4.1) with ESMTP id 5086781 for flyrotary@lancaironline.net; Tue, 09 Aug 2011 09:42:39 -0400 Received-SPF: pass receiver=logan.com; client-ip=75.180.132.123; envelope-from=eanderson@carolina.rr.com Return-Path: X-Authority-Analysis: v=1.1 cv=pLPlkKcK38cN4Cv4YkVeTGGRYpmKez/IrX640LVKWnc= c=1 sm=0 a=AiD-62Oz9HsA:10 a=rPkcCx1H5rrOSfN0dPC7kw==:17 a=ayC55rCoAAAA:8 a=Ia-xEzejAAAA:8 a=on22okXAAAAA:8 a=C0JR4fy94OPcsVkA304A:9 a=qLCeriBZ5tl5OT9A5NQA:7 a=pILNOxqGKmIA:10 a=EJfFEF4JnhUA:10 a=MIlHpNspmyAA:10 a=-_VOgJYex-MA:10 a=EzXvWhQp4_cA:10 a=pGLkceISAAAA:8 a=ox5AG0p8jk9B5smWlPoA:9 a=6C06nAZvA_6QFAnpagcA:7 a=tXsnliwV7b4A:10 a=MSl-tDqOz04A:10 a=at0Q5_2dr5wA:10 a=ZHUsY8zHUz0Vp2Os_2YA:9 a=1Vq_FK4TplAA:10 a=51nItO4Ekp-e_3z1jNwA:9 a=9SQSOrgtHGne4zT3sTkA:9 a=rPkcCx1H5rrOSfN0dPC7kw==:117 X-Cloudmark-Score: 0 X-Originating-IP: 174.110.167.5 Received: from [174.110.167.5] ([174.110.167.5:51207] helo=EdPC) by cdptpa-oedge04.mail.rr.com (envelope-from ) (ecelerity 2.2.3.46 r()) with ESMTP id 6A/2A-20202-A29314E4; Tue, 09 Aug 2011 13:42:03 +0000 Message-ID: From: "Ed Anderson" To: "Rotary motors in aircraft" References: In-Reply-To: Subject: Re: [FlyRotary] Re: Sam Hodges Force landing - All OK Date: Tue, 9 Aug 2011 09:40:54 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/related; type="multipart/alternative"; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0016_01CC5678.6EDB1EA0" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Importance: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Windows Live Mail 14.0.8117.416 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V14.0.8117.416 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0016_01CC5678.6EDB1EA0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_001_0017_01CC5678.6EDB1EA0" ------=_NextPart_001_0017_01CC5678.6EDB1EA0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="Windows-1252" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable 1. Yes, - he has the six port AndAir selector system 2. Not certain - don't believe so, I'll check 3. Not certain - I'll check 4. Yes, plus some extended run up time Ed From: Mark Steitle=20 Sent: Tuesday, August 09, 2011 9:17 AM To: Rotary motors in aircraft=20 Subject: [FlyRotary] Re: Sam Hodges Force landing - All OK Ed, =20 Some questions: =20 1) Does Sam's system have a fuel return circuit? =20 2) Does his system have an air-bleed circuit? =20 3) Was he running mogas or 100LL? =20 4) Was the A/C sitting in the hot sun long enough to significantly = preheat the fuel? =20 Mark (98* is a cool day for this time of year in Austin, TX) On Tue, Aug 9, 2011 at 8:06 AM, Ed Anderson = wrote: Talked with Sam again last night. After getting the aircraft back to = hangar and FAA investigator had done his thing, Sam asked the = investigator whether he wanted him to fire up the engine. The = investigator told Sam that was up to him. So Sam turned on all the = switches and the engine fired right up and ran smoothly - the = investigator commented he was amazed at how smooth the rotary ran. So = the engine and it subsystem (at least initially) appears to function = normally. =20 It appears the nose gear did not fold when Sam encountered the fence - = but apparently the one nose gear rod retaining bolt in the motor mount = may have sheared and permitted the rod and nose gear to fold side ways. = Spinner and prop apparently incurred some damage - which may (or may = not) be minor and fixable. The right wing spar is bent so that wing is = toast, fuselage appears OK and left wing with some trailing edge damage = (probably fixable). Further discussion with Sam leads me to believe that the highest = probably cause was a "vapor lock" of some type in the fuel line. Sam = stated the engine never stopped running (correction to my earlier report = - where I stated it had quit), but just continued to sputter and failed = to produce power. =20 The ignition checked out OK as did the rest of the system back in the = hangar. The symptom of sputtering engine and no power would put a fuel = system problem high on my list of suspects and given the high ambient = temps (98F) and the run up before take off -- would leave me to believe = those conditions could have lead to diminished fuel flow. =20 Sam is going to inspect his coarse filter to ensure it was not = partially obstructed.=20 One item of note is that Sam does not have any sort of boost pump = between tanks and his EFI pumps. In my early days of testing while = doing power-on stalls (high power low cooling airflow) on a hot day, my = engine started to sputter (unlike Sam I had plenty of altitude when it = happened) and I noticed my fuel pressure fluctuating between 20 - 35 = psi. I turned on my Facet boost pump (puts out approx 6 psi pressure) = and it immediately squelch the problem. So I now take off/land with = boost pump on and have never since had that problem. We know that any obstruction in a fuel line produces at least a small = pressure drop down stream - Given the suction of the EFI pumps and even = minor restriction of the coarse filter - a lower pressure region would = exist between filter and EFI pumps - elevated temperatures could be = enough to cause some of the fuel in this area to flash into a gaseous = state - which of course is not pumped very well. Its my opinion that a = boost pump is a worthwhile addition in keep pressure in the low pressure = part of the fuel system sufficiently high to prevent the fuel from = percolating - particularly on HOT ambient days. However, make certain = that the boost pump is of a type that does not obstruct fuel flow during = a malfuction or when off. Will provide any further details as Sam provides them. As we all know engine failure right after take off is probably the = most difficult and challenging situation you will face. Unless you = immediately lower the nose, your airspeed will bleed off almost = immedately and a stall will occur. So Sam certain is to be commended = for his quick and effective action responding to the event. Ed From: Jeff Whaley=20 Sent: Tuesday, August 09, 2011 7:49 AM To: Rotary motors in aircraft=20 Subject: [FlyRotary] Re: Sam Hodges Force landing - All OK Hmmm, two forced landings in one week =85 I hope the trend stops here! Good job Sam for getting down safely from such a critical point =85 = 200-300=92 on take-off is about as bad as it gets. Let=92s hope we get an answer soon as to the cause. Jeff From: "Ed Anderson" =20 Subject: Sam Hodge Force landing - All OK =20 Date: Mon, 8 Aug 2011 12:12:16 -0400 =20 To: "Rotary motors in aircraft" = =20 =20 =20 =20 Sam Hodges just called me to tell me about his forced landing = after take off at Paducha on 7 August. Ed K had notified me the day = before of the incident but I wanted to get more details from Sam before = reporting. Engine sputtered and quit approx 200-300 ft after take off - = Sam stated he had time to switch from A to B controller - but it made no = difference. It was a hot 97F day. Sam had performed runup before take = off and all appeared OK. Sam made it to a dirt road after the engine quit, but the nose = gear failed and the aircraft also incurred some damage to the wing tips. = He and his spouse Rose were shaken up a bit but bascially OK except for = sore muscles, etc. Sam is meeting FAA guy to go over the aircraft - back at the = hangar- today. =20 As those of you who make it to the Paducha flyin last fall know = - Sam and Rose have a beautifuly Renesis installation in an RV-7A - a = really nice looking package.=20 Sam has been working out the bugs of his installation - = wrestling with temperatures primarily and this flight was to check out = the effectiveness of some of his recent changes. I'm sure Sam will let us know whatever is uncovered pertinent to = the incident. Just great that no one was seriously injured or worst Ed =20 Jeff Whaley Manager, Test and Repair International Datacasting Corp. Tele: 613-596-4120 (ext: 2295) Fax: 613-596-9208 www.datacast.com This message, and the documents attached hereto, is intended only for = the addressee and may contain privileged or confidential information. = Any unauthorized disclosure is strictly prohibited. If you have received = this message in error, please notify us immediately so that we may = correct our internal records. Please then delete the original message. = Thank you. ------=_NextPart_001_0017_01CC5678.6EDB1EA0 Content-Type: text/html; charset="Windows-1252" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
1.  Yes, - he has the six port = AndAir selector=20  system
2.  Not certain - don't believe so, I'll=20 check
3.  Not certain - I'll check
4.  Yes, plus some extended run up = time
 
Ed
Sent: Tuesday, August 09, 2011 9:17 AM
Subject: [FlyRotary] Re: Sam Hodges Force landing - All=20 OK

Ed, =20

Some questions:  
1)  Does Sam's system have a fuel return circuit?  
2)  Does his system have an air-bleed circuit?  
3)  Was he running mogas or 100LL?  
4)  Was the A/C sitting in the hot sun long enough to = significantly=20 preheat the fuel?    

Mark
(98* is a cool day for this time of year in Austin, TX)


On Tue, Aug 9, 2011 at 8:06 AM, Ed Anderson = <eanderson@carolina.rr.com&g= t;=20 wrote:
Talked with Sam again last night.  After = getting=20 the aircraft back to hangar and FAA investigator had done his thing, = Sam asked=20 the investigator whether he wanted him to fire up the engine.  = The=20 investigator told Sam that was up to him.  So Sam turned on all = the=20 switches and the engine fired right up and ran smoothly - the = investigator=20 commented he was amazed at how smooth the rotary ran.  So the = engine and=20 it subsystem (at least initially) appears to function normally. =20
 
It appears the nose gear did not fold when Sam = encountered the fence - but apparently the one nose gear rod retaining = bolt in=20 the motor mount may have sheared and permitted the rod and nose gear = to fold=20 side ways.  Spinner and prop apparently incurred some damage - = which may=20 (or may not) be minor and fixable.  The right wing spar is bent = so that=20 wing is toast, fuselage appears OK and left wing with some trailing = edge=20 damage (probably fixable).
 
Further discussion with Sam leads me to = believe that the=20 highest probably cause was a "vapor lock" of some type in the fuel = line. Sam=20 stated the engine never stopped running (correction to my earlier = report=20 - where I stated it had quit), but just continued to sputter and = failed=20 to produce power. 
 
The ignition checked out OK as did the rest of = the=20 system back in the hangar.  The symptom of sputtering engine and = no power=20 would put a fuel system problem high on my list of suspects and given = the high=20 ambient temps (98F) and the run up before take off  -- would = leave me to=20 believe those conditions could have lead to diminished fuel=20 flow. 
 
Sam is going to inspect his coarse filter to = ensure it=20 was not partially obstructed.
 
One item of note is that Sam does not have any = sort of=20 boost pump between tanks and his EFI pumps.  In my early days of = testing=20 while doing power-on stalls (high power low cooling airflow) on a hot = day, my=20 engine started to sputter (unlike Sam I had plenty of altitude when it = happened) and I noticed my fuel pressure fluctuating between 20 - 35=20 psi.  I turned on my Facet boost pump (puts out approx 6 psi = pressure)=20 and it immediately squelch the problem.  So I now take off/land = with=20 boost pump on and have never since had that problem.
 
We know that any obstruction in a fuel line = produces at=20 least a small pressure drop down stream - Given the suction of the EFI = pumps=20 and even minor restriction of the coarse filter - a lower pressure = region=20 would exist between filter and EFI pumps - elevated temperatures could = be=20 enough to cause some of the fuel in this area  to flash into a = gaseous=20 state - which of course is not pumped very well.  Its my opinion = that a=20 boost pump is a worthwhile addition in keep pressure in the low = pressure part=20 of the fuel system sufficiently high to prevent the fuel from = percolating -=20 particularly on HOT ambient days.  However, make certain that the = boost=20 pump is of a type that does not obstruct fuel flow during a malfuction = or when=20 off.
 
Will provide any further details as Sam = provides=20 them.
 
As we all know engine failure right after take = off is=20 probably the most difficult and challenging situation you will = face. =20 Unless you immediately lower the nose, your airspeed will bleed off = almost=20 immedately and a stall will occur.  So Sam certain is to be = commended for=20 his quick and effective action responding to the event.
 
Ed
 
 

From: Jeff Whaley =
Sent: Tuesday, August 09, 2011 7:49 AM
To: Rotary = motors in=20 aircraft
Subject: [FlyRotary] Re: Sam Hodges Force landing - All=20 OK

Hmmm, two forced landings in one week =85 I hope = the trend=20 stops here!

Good job Sam for getting down safely from such a = critical=20 point  =85 200-300=92 on take-off is about as bad as it=20 gets.

Let=92s hope we get an answer soon as to the=20 cause.

Jeff

 

From:

"Ed=20 Anderson" <eanderson@carolina.rr.com>

Subject:

Sam Hodge=20 Force landing - All = OK

Date:

Mon, 8 Aug=20 2011 12:12:16 = -0400

To:

"Rotary=20 motors in aircraft" <flyrotary@lancaironline.net><= /P>



Sam Hodges = just called=20 me to tell me about his forced landing after take off at Paducha = on 7=20 August.  Ed K had notified me the day before of the = incident but I=20 wanted to get more details from Sam before = reporting.

 

Engine = sputtered and=20 quit approx 200-300 ft after take off -  Sam stated he had = time to=20 switch from A to B controller - but it made no difference.  = It was=20 a hot 97F day.  Sam had performed runup before take off and = all=20 appeared OK.

 

Sam made it = to a dirt=20 road after the engine quit, but the nose gear failed and the = aircraft=20 also incurred some damage to the wing tips.  He and his = spouse Rose=20 were shaken up a bit but bascially OK except for sore muscles,=20 etc.

 

Sam is = meeting FAA guy=20 to go over the aircraft - back at the hangar- today.  =

 

As those of = you who make=20 it to the Paducha flyin last fall know - Sam and Rose have a = beautifuly=20 Renesis installation in an RV-7A - a really nice looking = package.=20

 

Sam has been = working out=20 the bugs of his installation - wrestling with temperatures = primarily and=20 this flight was to check out the effectiveness of some of his = recent=20 changes.

 

I'm sure Sam = will let us=20 know whatever is uncovered pertinent to the = incident.

 

Just great = that no one=20 was seriously injured or worst

 

Ed

 

 

Jeff=20 Whaley
Manager,=20 Test and Repair

International = Datacasting=20 Corp.

Tele: 613-596-4120=20 (ext: 2295)
Fax:  613-596-9208

www.datacast.com

 


This message, and the documents attached hereto, is = intended only=20 for the addressee and may contain privileged or confidential = information. Any=20 unauthorized disclosure is strictly prohibited. If you have received = this=20 message in error, please notify us immediately so that we may correct = our=20 internal records. Please then delete the original message. Thank=20 you.

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