X-Virus-Scanned: clean according to Sophos on Logan.com Return-Path: Received: from nm17.access.bullet.mail.sp2.yahoo.com ([98.139.44.144] verified) by logan.com (CommuniGate Pro SMTP 5.4.0) with SMTP id 5046975 for flyrotary@lancaironline.net; Sat, 09 Jul 2011 12:56:56 -0400 Received-SPF: none receiver=logan.com; client-ip=98.139.44.144; envelope-from=keltro@att.net Received: from [98.139.44.96] by nm17.access.bullet.mail.sp2.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 09 Jul 2011 16:56:23 -0000 Received: from [98.139.44.88] by tm1.access.bullet.mail.sp2.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 09 Jul 2011 16:56:23 -0000 Received: from [127.0.0.1] by omp1025.access.mail.sp2.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 09 Jul 2011 16:56:23 -0000 X-Yahoo-Newman-Property: ymail-3 X-Yahoo-Newman-Id: 327483.98868.bm@omp1025.access.mail.sp2.yahoo.com Received: (qmail 2812 invoked by uid 60001); 9 Jul 2011 16:56:23 -0000 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=att.net; s=s1024; t=1310230582; bh=zrAcyuqBajGzOLr2v4Gtj3m9L0NlDY0wSzUQLqLAs1Y=; h=X-YMail-OSG:Received:X-Mailer:References:Message-ID:Date:From:Reply-To:Subject:To:In-Reply-To:MIME-Version:Content-Type; b=xhnh/KAqjWMgLvhV4+uNed1YD3t2awqBWnHuyQE2ITy66vRY3bzqC+pJs98hfEL/s7TyluFQKpTKUoHoGpTPxBtro6qhVRd8QAsv5fpKSCuKMQZJ9jpmHGFkY7qezQ50pnIzjswvPiS8DRfxwaZLa3+LCG164ZMpBIGg9fS6fwo= DomainKey-Signature:a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=s1024; d=att.net; h=X-YMail-OSG:Received:X-Mailer:References:Message-ID:Date:From:Reply-To:Subject:To:In-Reply-To:MIME-Version:Content-Type; b=G1lYRVUHgPe6bM1PPGqkmldFe4RHX1Pw9RPvWLQylxDP8l9eWn8QxMQ0s7LNgbfPvi1v6r3fCDGian8GqSTqNff2DfbRbsqOK5q07XVTaT8rqDTqVRE/sQAfDtyONFRBFTLc40Tx1lMRFUN20JS71Ba42geeo5w04yVzJxSVGfM=; X-YMail-OSG: yUtoHVUVM1kFWN2OxyDr_NW3HNByh6oHu9fcQCU1Ld_g7zE xBGGmbvCbO_d4BjV4hxqJNQOz53.Fzc5PtjUScmLz1EI8tShUhuomjN19E4. 3ht3sUIRNyMxYrWSjBYJzsJRTAw3ZN_9w6PkL2Yv9E4UISS2pNFoPIPGmBbJ nC83svY6fRlZWcMeWEOpL8RXOz__q4aoLDVO9__piaH6KOkJ9ZiVsE0uagFl IRqUAtBe0Wo79zIlGjQlg6JCzI8YLcqZER_z_4fT_k4s_6bYlcYdecVuDpV3 npgTkt.ZgXcdiXa1H5aQ.Sns86LC8Z7O5kT0Yu8D_slDoyZZDBDmkFp3K.P2 kXg8COdAbrVBJSEiPT1X6jUXoSuCtNrG2DHaj Received: from [208.114.39.18] by web83909.mail.sp1.yahoo.com via HTTP; Sat, 09 Jul 2011 09:56:22 PDT X-Mailer: YahooMailWebService/0.8.112.307740 References: Message-ID: <1310230582.421.YahooMailNeo@web83909.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> Date: Sat, 9 Jul 2011 09:56:22 -0700 (PDT) From: Kelly Troyer Reply-To: Kelly Troyer Subject: Re: sheilded plug wires To: Rotary motors in aircraft In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="0-1950174468-1310230582=:421" --0-1950174468-1310230582=:421 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Brian=0A=A0=A0 Apparently the shield you are proposeing is not a good Idea.= .........The reason why is noted in the=0A"Magnacor"=A0link in my previous = post................=0A=0AKelly Troyer=0A"DYKE DELTA JD2" (Eventually)=0A"1= 3B ROTARY"_ Engine=0A"RWS"_RD1C/EC2/EM2=0A"MISTRAL"_Backplate/Oil Manifold= =0A"TURBONETICS"_TO4E50 Turbo=0A=0AFrom: "bktrub@aol.com" = =0ATo: Rotary motors in aircraft =0ASent: Satu= rday, July 9, 2011 11:51 AM=0ASubject: [FlyRotary] Re: sheilded plug wires= =0A=0A=0AOk,=A0 theory is nice, I=A0prefer to just think it is all magic.= =A0My apologies, but I am the product of our public school system : )=0A=A0= =0AWhat I'd like to know is this-=A0am I fabricating the wires correctly? I= cut the insulation about 1/2 inch back from the inner conductor, and then = crimp the terminal so that the conductor is folded back against the wire un= der the terminal crimp.=0AThere is no outer braid or anything which actuall= y grounds against the engine. I am thinking of putting an outer braid aroun= d the wires and then grounding that on one end. =0A=0ABrian Trubee=0A=0A=0A= =0A=0A-----Original Message-----=0AFrom: Charlie England =0ATo: Rotary motors in aircraft =0ASen= t: Sat, Jul 9, 2011 9:11 am=0ASubject: [FlyRotary] Re: sheilded plug wires= =0A=0A=0ATo expand on that for the electron-challenged, an inductor is effe= ctively a frequency dependent resistor. The higher the frequency, the highe= r the resistance. So, the fundamental pulse to the plug makes it through (t= hough slowed slightly), while the harmonics (noise) that were generated=A0 = can't get past the extra resistance presented to them.=0A=0AThe reverse is = true for a capacitor. That's one of the reasons why you see capacitors with= one leg tied to the power supply & the other to ground. The capacitor bloc= ks DC but passes higher frequencies (the noise) to ground.=0A=0AI have no d= oubt that the above will make physicists cringe, but it's close enough to w= orking knowledge for us builders to use.=0A=0ACharlie=0A=0AOn 07/09/2011 08= :28 AM, Tracy wrote: =0AIn this case "shielded" is the wrong term. =A0 The = spiral wire does not actually shield the noise, it prevents the noise from = being transmitted. =A0 =A0It acts as an inductor to prevent the propagation= of the noise generated at the spark gap from propagating up the wire.=0A>= =0A>=0A>Tracy=0A>=0A>Sent from my iPad=0A>=0A>On Jul 9, 2011, at 2:09 AM, L= ehanover@aol.com wrote:=0A>=0A>=0A>It has to do with the resistance of the = long thin Monel wire. An impedance mismatch and inductive reactance. What t= he mechanism is I do not know. That is why Tracy is here, to explain such m= atters.=0A>>=0A>>Lynn E. Hanover=0A>>=0A>>In a message dated 7/8/2011 11:08= :09 P.M. Paraguay Standard Time, SBoese@uwyo.edu writes:=0A>>My last massag= e got a little garbled, the way I have my wires configured now, the conduct= or and spiral wrap are exposed and folded under the crimped teminal ends, s= o aren't both the conductor and the spiral wrap acting as a conductor? What= is doing the shielding?=0A>>>=0A>>>Brian Trubee=0A>>> --0-1950174468-1310230582=:421 Content-Type: text/html; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Brian
   Apparen= tly the shield you are proposeing is not a good Idea..........The reason wh= y is noted in the
"Magnacor" link= in my previous post................
 
Kelly Troyer
"DYKE DELTA JD2" (Eventually)
"13B ROTARY"_ Engine
"RWS"_RD1C/EC2/EM2
"MISTRAL"_Backplate/Oil = Manifold
"TURBONETICS"_TO4E50 Turbo

From:= "bktrub@aol.com" <bktrub@aol.com>
To: Rotary motors in aircraft <flyrotary@lan= caironline.net>
Sent:= Saturday, July 9, 2011 11:51 AM
Su= bject: [FlyRotary] Re: sheilded plug wires

Ok,  theory is nice, = I prefer to just think it is all magic. My apologies, but I am th= e product of our public school system : )
 
What I'd like to know is t= his- am I fabricating the wires correctly? I cut the insulation about = 1/2 inch back from the inner conductor, and then crimp the terminal so that= the conductor is folded back against the wire under the terminal crimp.
There is no outer braid or anything which actually grounds against the= engine. I am thinking of putting an outer braid around the wires and then = grounding that on one end.
 
Brian Trubee



-----Original Message-----
From: Charlie England <ceengland@bellsout= h.net>
To: Rotary motors in aircraft <flyrotary@lancaironline.net&= gt;
Sent: Sat, Jul 9, 2011 9:11 am
Subject: [FlyRotary] Re: sheilded = plug wires

To = expand on that for the electron-challenged, an inductor is effectively a fr= equency dependent resistor. The higher the frequency, the higher the resist= ance. So, the fundamental pulse to the plug makes it through (though slowed= slightly), while the harmonics (noise) that were generated  can't get= past the extra resistance presented to them.

The reverse is true fo= r a capacitor. That's one of the reasons why you see capacitors with one le= g tied to the power supply & the other to ground. The capacitor blocks = DC but passes higher frequencies (the noise) to ground.

I have no do= ubt that the above will make physicists cringe, but it's close enough to wo= rking knowledge for us builders to use.

Charlie

On 07/09/2011= 08:28 AM, Tracy wrote:=20
In this case "shielded" is the wrong term.   The spiral wire does= not actually shield the noise, it prevents the noise from being transmitte= d.    It acts as an inductor to prevent the propagation of the no= ise generated at the spark gap from propagating up the wire.

Tracy

Sent from my iPad

On Jul 9, 2011, at 2:09 AM, Lehanove= r@aol.com wrote:

It has to do with the resistance of the long thin Monel wire. An imped= ance mismatch and inductive reactance. What the mechanism is I do not know.= That is why Tracy is here, to explain such matters.
 
Lynn E. Hanover
 
In a message dated 7/8/2011 11:08:09 P.M. Paraguay Standard Time, SBoese@uwyo.edu writes:
My last massage got a little garbled, the way I have my wires configur= ed now, the conductor and spiral wrap are exposed and folded under the crim= ped teminal ends, so aren't both the conductor and the spiral wrap acting a= s a conductor? What is doing the shielding?
 
Brian Trubee



--0-1950174468-1310230582=:421--