X-Virus-Scanned: clean according to Sophos on Logan.com Return-Path: Received: from aspensprings.uwyo.edu ([129.72.10.32] verified) by logan.com (CommuniGate Pro SMTP 5.4.0) with ESMTPS id 5041503 for flyrotary@lancaironline.net; Sun, 03 Jul 2011 22:14:38 -0400 Received-SPF: none receiver=logan.com; client-ip=129.72.10.32; envelope-from=SBoese@uwyo.edu Received: from ponyexpress-ht4.uwyo.edu (extlb.uwyo.edu [172.26.4.4]) by aspensprings.uwyo.edu (8.14.4/8.14.4) with ESMTP id p642E0wL014997 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=AES128-SHA bits=128 verify=FAIL) for ; Sun, 3 Jul 2011 20:14:00 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from SBoese@uwyo.edu) Received: from ponyexpress-m10.uwyo.edu ([fe80::60dd:cb9e:6f71:3d48]) by ponyexpress-ht4.uwyo.edu ([fe80::8de7:b225:a85b:d0ee%13]) with mapi id 14.01.0289.001; Sun, 3 Jul 2011 20:14:00 -0600 From: "Steven W. Boese" To: Rotary motors in aircraft Subject: RE: [FlyRotary] Re: Leaking injectors? Thread-Topic: [FlyRotary] Re: Leaking injectors? Thread-Index: AQHMObvBbHGUqxyAOkWmZNtJpWsUiJTbZrEn Date: Mon, 4 Jul 2011 02:13:59 +0000 Message-ID: <3E8191F276108F4481AB0721BBA9269E05814A3D@ponyexpress-m10.uwyo.edu> References: In-Reply-To: Accept-Language: en-US Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: x-originating-ip: [75.220.71.198] Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="_000_3E8191F276108F4481AB0721BBA9269E05814A3Dponyexpressm10u_" MIME-Version: 1.0 --_000_3E8191F276108F4481AB0721BBA9269E05814A3Dponyexpressm10u_ Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable My standard shutdown procedure has always been to cut the power to the fuel= pumps until the engine stops and then shut down the power to the rest of t= he system. In early May, after sitting overnight at an airport away from h= ome, the engine started on only one rotor and then started to run on both r= otors after a few seconds. It did this twice more after being shut down at= least overnight. Finally, the engine refused to start at all. Removing t= he spark plugs indicated a flooded condition, much more evident on rotor on= e than rotor two. Removing the injectors and pressurizing them on my injec= tor test rail, the primary injector of rotor one leaked fuel at a slow drip= and the secondary injector of rotor two would form a drop of fuel that wou= ld evaporate fast enough that it didn't actually drip. The other two injec= tors remained dry. Since all those injectors were most likely the original= ones from 1986 and had well over 100,000 miles before use in the aircraft,= I replaced them with new ones from RC Engineering. I haven't had flooding= problems since the replacement. Apparently, there was enough fuel that co= uld leak through the injectors and cause flooding even after the shutdown p= rocedure that involved killing the engine by shutting off the fuel pumps. = Probably, heat soaking the firewall forward fuel lines and fuel after shutd= own resulted in pressure buildup and enough fuel leaking through the worn i= njectors to cause a problem. Just my recent experience for what it is wort= h. Steve Boese RV6A, 1986 13B NA, RD1A, EC2 ________________________________ From: Rotary motors in aircraft [flyrotary@lancaironline.net] on behalf of = Charlie England [ceengland@bellsouth.net] Sent: Sunday, July 03, 2011 1:59 PM To: Rotary motors in aircraft Subject: [FlyRotary] Re: Leaking injectors? I think that the idea is to shut down the pump(s) with the engine running. = The injectors will continue to do their thing, & the engine quits when pres= sure drops too low to flow through the open injectors. Charlie On 07/03/2011 02:28 PM, Kelly Troyer wrote: No !!...........The check valve is located in the inlet to the pump and wil= l hold regulated pressure indefinately or until relieved by leaky injectors or the afore mentioned by= pass sysrem......... Kelly Troyer "DYKE DELTA JD2" (Eventually) "13B ROTARY"_ Engine "RWS"_RD1C/EC2/EM2 "MISTRAL"_Backplate/Oil Manifold "TURBONETICS"_TO4E50 Turbo From: Ernest Christley To: Rotary motors in aircraft Sent: Sunday, July 3, 2011 2:15 PM Subject: [FlyRotary] Re: Leaking injectors? On 07/02/2011 09:52 AM, Kelly Troyer wrote: Ernest, Your EFI fuel pumps have a check valve in them and will hold regulated = pressure for a long time or until leaky injectors relieve this pressure..........Sho= rt of replacing the injectors the fix is to put a pressure relief orifice from the fuel pre= ssure line to the fuel return line... Shouldn't shutting down by cutting power to the fuel pump relieve the press= ure, though? --_000_3E8191F276108F4481AB0721BBA9269E05814A3Dponyexpressm10u_ Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

My standard shutdown procedure has always been to cut the power to the f= uel pumps until the engine stops and then shut down the power to the rest o= f the system.  In early May, after sitting overnight at an airport awa= y from home, the engine started on only one rotor and then started to run on both rotors after a few seconds. = ; It did this twice more after being shut down at least overnight.  Fi= nally, the engine refused to start at all.  Removing the spark plugs i= ndicated a flooded condition, much more evident on rotor one than rotor two.  Removing the injectors and pressur= izing them on my injector test rail, the primary injector of rotor one leak= ed fuel at a slow drip and the secondary injector of rotor two would form a= drop of fuel that would evaporate fast enough that it didn't actually drip.  The other two injectors remained dry.&= nbsp; Since all those injectors were most likely the original ones fro= m 1986 and had well over 100,000 miles before use in the aircraft, I replac= ed them with new ones from RC Engineering.  I haven't had flooding problems since the replacement.  Apparently, there = was enough fuel that could leak through the injectors and cause flooding ev= en after the shutdown procedure that involved killing the engine by shuttin= g off the fuel pumps.  Probably, heat soaking the firewall forward fuel lines and fuel after shutdown resulted in p= ressure buildup and enough fuel leaking through the worn injectors to cause= a problem.  Just my recent experience for what it is worth.

 

Steve = Boese

RV6A, 1986 13B NA, RD1A, EC2

 

From: Rotary motors in aircraft [flyrotary= @lancaironline.net] on behalf of Charlie England [ceengland@bellsouth.net]<= br> Sent: Sunday, July 03, 2011 1:59 PM
To: Rotary motors in aircraft
Subject: [FlyRotary] Re: Leaking injectors?

I think that the idea is to shut down the pump(s) with the engine runn= ing. The injectors will continue to do their thing, & the engine quits = when pressure drops too low to flow through the open injectors.

Charlie

On 07/03/2011 02:28 PM, Kelly Troyer wrote:
No !!...........The = check valve is located in the inlet to the pump and will hold regulated&nbs= p;pressure
indefinately or until relieved by leaky inj= ectors or the afore mentioned bypass sysrem.........
 
Kelly Troyer
"DYKE DELTA JD2" (Eve= ntually)
"13B ROTARY"_ Engine
"RWS"_RD1C/EC2/EM2
"MISTRAL"_Backplate/Oil Manifold
"TURBONETICS"_TO4E50 Turbo

From: Ernest Christley <echristley@att.net>
To: Rotary motors in aircra= ft <flyrotary@lancaironline.net>
Sent: Sunday, July 3, 2011 = 2:15 PM
Subject: [FlyRotary] Re: Le= aking injectors?

On 07/02/2011 09:52 AM, Kelly Troyer wrote:
Ernest,
    Your EFI fuel pumps have a check v= alve in them and will hold regulated pressure
for a long time or until leaky injectors relieve this pressure..= ........Short of replacing
the injectors the fix is to put a pressure relief orifice from the fuel pressure line&nbs= p; to
the fuel return line...

Shouldn't shutting down by cutting power to the fuel pump relieve the press= ure, though?



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