X-Virus-Scanned: clean according to Sophos on Logan.com Return-Path: Received: from nm17-vm0.access.bullet.mail.sp2.yahoo.com ([98.139.44.168] verified) by logan.com (CommuniGate Pro SMTP 5.4c3j) with SMTP id 4968473 for flyrotary@lancaironline.net; Fri, 06 May 2011 02:24:37 -0400 Received-SPF: none receiver=logan.com; client-ip=98.139.44.168; envelope-from=keltro@att.net Received: from [98.139.44.97] by nm17.access.bullet.mail.sp2.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 06 May 2011 06:24:01 -0000 Received: from [98.139.44.67] by tm2.access.bullet.mail.sp2.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 06 May 2011 06:24:01 -0000 Received: from [127.0.0.1] by omp1004.access.mail.sp2.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 06 May 2011 06:24:01 -0000 X-Yahoo-Newman-Property: ymail-3 X-Yahoo-Newman-Id: 703735.23567.bm@omp1004.access.mail.sp2.yahoo.com Received: (qmail 57922 invoked by uid 60001); 6 May 2011 06:24:01 -0000 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=att.net; s=s1024; t=1304663041; bh=snBWAXH9A3idYmzudB7a7QpczkZvIKM2wT5YJ3W/YZM=; h=Message-ID:X-YMail-OSG:Received:X-Mailer:References:Date:From:Subject:To:In-Reply-To:MIME-Version:Content-Type; b=UQhN+tkdyRd88LP8iWhCcJYxRhMf12wImERxIUBQPYUH5kwiAgD+GrHm9Btws/IMN48Lp3ffnUBsgasq83JOiSMYYC+HhlY2aS/64lxaVgfomQjVWPKwCt7gGSbGZeM9w951KJptxEyB9GyCi0w7kyt+r1Z0xG90RN9Lxk55398= DomainKey-Signature:a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=s1024; d=att.net; h=Message-ID:X-YMail-OSG:Received:X-Mailer:References:Date:From:Subject:To:In-Reply-To:MIME-Version:Content-Type; b=tWA4uDg4QOnCK/b0BREqISJk3M7Efom8DC6wXoCyVvwFn833gIZoXKAGegVUR2Y0/S+AmINxT1ikBU76GzidSazuAMCo/or7+cDc6D3fJgh7FsP27AYIfbzqGWFM4IhEfgItptVu8n3SyRWIaUCTM6yVkC6R2r2JTxyF8w1Z9qI=; Message-ID: <462000.46525.qm@web83902.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> X-YMail-OSG: rRPan0IVM1mQFxGmlhOP9tLtkGVePEEjWADhAPXanmrYTjV oeXDvYoRfDRkX62MWVSB1y3Ttt3.KjncubFaHhKoni077PeZB3rK0swY3p3S v3WJVVe9ubooGGz7.cvX7pKCC.xC2v76j7osPQqCifT.wCseb248A798Q3_B vqGDAGYdtXDAEl3CGOlfY07srhf0ACqHzfyjRInf5xfxekIFNZzEj.._7q7V Heu3GA49lDOdpnxqpxDguXdDU45MsvfrapQJKBDx4e.8JX4VPUaO0dBBiCaj hTAnCjIfdshZ4UkG21Qk9pCtWV5Ie88ljbC07y1spAeKEUuAskw.oPndksy3 nlOLnLxUsrym3BT5tZ2rqBDPKYdRKlIlqTIsx7Md9yM5Hy7JNZrg8fjdJyzv PZRspVwhMwZ_y2oxKR8kudAKAHRHJ9hawZ1Pa2Ds.Pl32r24Zw66qZrxXQFD fX1wTZs5NKMBn9uKzym6bQLJQlidKZnnTfkF2._w.CQ-- Received: from [208.114.46.26] by web83902.mail.sp1.yahoo.com via HTTP; Thu, 05 May 2011 23:24:01 PDT X-Mailer: YahooMailRC/559 YahooMailWebService/0.8.110.299900 References: <00a601cc0b8e$8490de90$8db29bb0$@charter.net> Date: Thu, 5 May 2011 23:24:01 -0700 (PDT) From: Kelly Troyer Subject: Back-plate (93-95 Front Side Hsd Needed) To: Rotary motors in aircraft In-Reply-To: <00a601cc0b8e$8490de90$8db29bb0$@charter.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="0-1778341598-1304663041=:46525" --0-1778341598-1304663041=:46525 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Marc,=0A=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 The Mistral backplate is for a= Dynafocal Type=C2=A01 ,=C2=A030 degree mount ring =0Awhich is standard for= most=C2=A0Lycoming 0-320 &=C2=A0all 0=C2=A0& I0-360 engines (that=C2=A0I = =0Aam aware of))..............The Dynafocal Type 2 , 18 degree mount ring w= as=0Adesigned for a specific 0-320 engine installed in the Twin Comanche wi= th=0Aan extra 2.5 inch extended prop hub..............This put the engine C= G ahead =0Athe 30 degree mount focal point=C2=A0 of approx 14.25 inches so = the 18 degree=0Amount was designed to again put the engine CG slightly behi= nd the 18 degree=0Afocal point.............If your Cardinal has the type 2 = ,=C2=A018 degree=C2=A0 mount then =0Ait =0A=0Aprobably has a 0-320 with the= extra pop hub length..........If not maybe Cessna=0Agot a good deal on thi= s particular 0-320 engine model back then.........If by=0Achance your Cardi= nal has an 0-360 then all bets are off as I haven't heard=0Aof a 0-360 mode= l with the Type 2 , 18 degree mount............<:)=0A=0A=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0= =C2=A0 As for the 93-95 13BREW front side plate Bryan may have found us an= =0Aunserviceable one............We will see............As many of these eng= nes that=0Ahave been=C2=A0over-heated , over-boosted and over-reved we shou= ld be able to =0Acome up with a junk one.............=0A=0AThanks Marc,=0A= =0A=C2=A0Kelly Troyer=0A"DYKE DELTA JD2" (Eventually)=0A"13B ROTARY"_ Engin= e=0A"RWS"_RD1C/EC2/EM2=0A"MISTRAL"_Backplate/Oil Manifold=0A"TURBONETICS"_T= O4E50 Turbo=0A=0A=0A=0A=0A________________________________=0AFrom: Marc Wie= se =0ATo: keltro@att.net=0ASent: Thu, May 5, 2011 8:4= 0:02 PM=0ASubject: RE: [FlyRotary] Re: Back-plate (93-95 Front Side Hsd Nee= ded)=0A=0A=0AKelly,=0AI also have a type II dynafocal engine mount (from a = Cardinal RG!)=E2=80=A6.=0AMarc =0A=C2=A0=0AFrom:Marc Wiese [mailto:cardmarc= @charter.net] =0ASent: Thursday, May 05, 2011 8:37 PM=0ATo: 'Rotary motors = in aircraft'; 'keltro@att.net'=0ASubject: RE: [FlyRotary] Re: Back-plate (9= 3-95 Front Side Hsd Needed)=0A=C2=A0=0AI may have one of those 13Brew =E2= =80=9Cfront plates=E2=80=9D, but it is =E2=80=9Cuseable=E2=80=9D.=0AI too w= ould like a dynafocal type II mount=E2=80=A6..for both of my 13Brews and th= e 20B=E2=80=A6=0AMarc=0A=C2=A0=0AFrom:Rotary motors in aircraft [mailto:fly= rotary@lancaironline.net] On Behalf Of =0AKelly Troyer=0ASent: Wednesday, M= ay 04, 2011 6:09 PM=0ATo: Rotary motors in aircraft=0ASubject: [FlyRotary] = Re: Back-plate (93-95 Front Side Hsd Needed)=0A=C2=A0=0ATo The Rotary Group= ,=0A=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 Yes I know I am a troublemaker (too much compu= ter time available=C2=A0with my =0Aday job) and some of you are probably si= ck of all my posts !!.............."But" =0Awith that being=C2=A0said one o= f our group is seriously considering the development =0Aof a "Mistral" type= =0Aback-plate to allow the use of a standard "Lycoming" "Dynafocal type 1" = engine =0Amount ring that will be a virtual "Bolt-on" to the=0A93-95 13BREW= =C2=A0, Cosmo 13B & 20B and the Renesis 13B Rotarys.............Several =0A= builders and potentials have indicated they=0Awould be interested in such a= back-plate (including me)............I have one of =0Athe few "Mistral" ba= ck-plates that ended up in the=0Ahands of experimenters (waited 2 years for= it)..........It is severely over =0Aengineered for our use (and overpriced= ) and has many=0Afeatures we do not need...........=0A=C2=A0=0A=C2=A0=C2=A0= =C2=A0 If you have followed "Back-plate" string of posts recently you know = that =0AJarrett Johnson one our group with aspirations to=0Ainstall a Cosmo= 20B in his project started the discussion first about an =0Adeveloping an= =C2=A0intake manifold for 13B & 20B Rotarys=0A(which needs to be done also)= then=C2=A0I jumped in and said that a common=C2=A0engine =0Amount design m= ight also be needed and if=0Ayou have been reading the posts lately a lot o= f info has been kicked =0Aaround=C2=A0about=C2=A0the various=C2=A0Rotarys a= nd what=C2=A0it will take to=C2=A0"Marry" the "Mistral" =0Aback-plate with = a "RX8 "Renesis" water-pump (with the magic of digital scanning =0A& CAD) t= o design =0A=0Asuch a back-plate.........=0A=C2=A0=0A=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2= =A0 Those that have been on the Rotary forum for several years may remember= =0AJarrett posting his trials and tribulations in=0Abuilding a huge CAM mi= ll (at home).............He is a commercial designer with =0Athe talent and= equipment=C2=A0(including foundry)=0Ato pull this off............I have of= fered my "Mistral" back-plate to be scanned =0A(He trying to find someone= =C2=A0here in Okla to do=0Athe=C2=A0 job) and I also have a "Renesis" front= cover to scan............What we =0Areally need now is a 93-95 13BREW fron= t side=0Ahousing (unusable condition preferred as long as front side is und= amaged) to put =0Ain his hands as this is what the back-plate=0Awill bolt t= o..............If someone in the group has an unusable 93-95 13BREW =0Afron= t side housing they will donate I will pay=0Ato have it shipped to Jarrett.= .............You may contact me off the forum if =0Ayou would prefer.......= ...I have no horse in this race=0AI would just like to see such a product b= e made available to the group..........=0A=C2=A0=0Akeltro@att.net=0A=C2=A0= =C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=0AKelly Troyer=0A"DYKE DELTA JD2"(Eventually)=0A"13B ROT= ARY"_ Engine=0A"RWS"_RD1C/EC2/EM2=0A"MISTRAL"_Backplate/Oil Manifold=0A"TUR= BONETICS"_TO4E50 Turbo=0A=C2=A0=0A=C2=A0=0A=0A_____________________________= ___=0A=0AFrom:Kelly Troyer =0ATo: Rotary motors in aircraft= =0ASent: Tue, May 3, 2011 11:45:09 PM=0ASubje= ct: [FlyRotary] Re: Back-plate=0AJarrett,=0A=C2=A0=0A=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 Wil= l be a good idea to scan both the Mistral and Renesis =0Ahousings..........= ...You really need =0A=0Aa 93-95 13BREW=C2=A0(preferably) or Cosmo 20B fron= t housing to scan.............Most =0Aof my 13B=0Aengines are 86-91........= .....My=C2=A0Cosmo 13B is adaptable but=C2=A0lacks=C2=A0some of=C2=A0the = =0Amachined bolt=0Aand stud pads of the 13BREW, Renesis=C2=A0or Cosmo 20B f= ront side housing which you =0Aneed=0Ato make allowances for on the redesig= ned back-plate if you want it to fit all =0Athree versions of=0Athese engin= es..................Throw this out to the group and see if someone =0Ahas a= 1993-95=0A13BREW front side hsg (need not be usable) they would donate or = lend to the =0Aproject.........=0A=C2=A0=0A=C2=A0=C2=A0 You really need thi= s front side housing in front of you......... Even with =0Aall the scans no= thing =0A=0Abeats having the actual hardware............IMHO=0A=C2=A0=0ABes= t Regards,=0A=C2=A0=0AKelly Troyer=0A"DYKE DELTA JD2"(Eventually)=0A"13B RO= TARY"_ Engine=0A"RWS"_RD1C/EC2/EM2=0A"MISTRAL"_Backplate/Oil Manifold=0A"TU= RBONETICS"_TO4E50 Turbo=0A=C2=A0=0A=C2=A0=0A=0A____________________________= ____=0A=0AFrom:H & J Johnson =0ATo: Rotary motors in= aircraft =0ASent: Tue, May 3, 2011 10:43:03 P= M=0ASubject: [FlyRotary] Re: Back-plate=0AEvening Kelly, so just thought I'= d send a note w/ an update. I did find a fella =0Ain Tulsa who has access t= o a laser scanner. He's getting me some pricing=0Aon what it would cost to = get the job done. I'm thinking it might be a good idea =0Ato get both the M= istral housing as well as a Renisis Front Cover scanned? =0A=0AI'd like to = get=C2=A0an Iron=C2=A0[preferably the side that mates to the front =0Acover= ]=C2=A0scanned as well but don't know if you've got one handy [as in, not '= in' =0Aan engine]. I could always =0A=0Ado it here in time but that might t= ake a bit before I get my hands on one that =0Ais=C2=A0not in an engine.=0A= =C2=A0=0AI'll keep you posted as this goes and see where we get.=0A=0AJarre= tt Johnson =0Awww.innovention-tech.com =0A--=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 Homepage:=C2= =A0 http://www.flyrotary.com/=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 Archive and UnSub:=C2=A0=C2= =A0 =0Ahttp://mail.lancaironline.net:81/lists/flyrotary/List.html --0-1778341598-1304663041=:46525 Content-Type: text/html; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
=0A
Marc,
=0A
     &n= bsp; The Mistral backplate is for a Dynafocal Type 1 , 30 degree = mount ring
=0A
which is standard for most Lycoming 0-320 &am= p; all 0 & I0-360 engines (that I
=0A
am aware= of))..............The Dynafocal Type 2 , 18 degree mount ring was
=0A=
designed for a specific 0-320 engine installed in the Twin Comanche wi= th
=0A
an extra 2.5 inch extended prop hub..............This put t= he engine CG ahead
=0A
the 30 degree mount focal point  of a= pprox 14.25 inches so the 18 degree
=0A
mount was designed to agai= n put the engine CG slightly behind the 18 degree
=0A
focal point.= ............If your Cardinal has the type 2 , 18 degree  mount th= en it
=0A
probably has a 0-320 with the extra pop hub length.....= .....If not maybe Cessna
=0A
got a good deal on this particular 0-= 320 engine model back then.........If by
=0A
chance your Cardinal = has an 0-360 then all bets are off as I haven't heard
=0A
of a 0-3= 60 model with the Type 2 , 18 degree mount............<:)
=0A
&= nbsp;
=0A
     As for the 93-95 13BREW front s= ide plate Bryan may have found us an
=0A
unserviceable one........= ....We will see............As many of these engnes that
=0A
have b= een over-heated , over-boosted and over-reved we should be able to =0A
come up with a junk one.............
=0A
 
= =0A
Thanks Marc,
=0A
 
=0A
 Kelly Troyer"DYKE DELTA JD2" (Eventually)=
=0A

"13B ROTARY"_ Engine
"RWS"_RD1C/EC2/EM2
"= MISTRAL"_Backplate/Oil Manifold

=0A

"TURBONETICS"_TO4E50 Turbo

=0A<= DIV>
=0A

=0A
=0A
=0AFrom: Marc Wiese &l= t;cardmarc@charter.net>
To: keltro@att.net
Sent:<= /B> Thu, May 5, 2011 8:40:02 PM
Sub= ject: RE: [FlyRotary] Re: Back-plate (93-95 Front Side Hsd Neede= d)

=0A=0A=0A
=0A

Kelly,

=0A

= I also have a type II dynafocal engine mount (from a Cardinal RG!)=E2=80=A6= .

=0A

 

=0A
=0A
=0A

From: Marc Wiese [ma= ilto:cardmarc@charter.net]
Sent: Thursday, May 05, 2011 8:37 PM<= BR>To: 'Rotary motors in aircraft'; 'keltro@att.net'
Subject:<= /B> RE: [FlyRotary] Re: Back-plate (93-95 Front Side Hsd Needed)

=
=0A

 

=0A

I may have one of thos= e 13Brew =E2=80=9Cfront plates=E2=80=9D, but it is =E2=80=9Cuseable=E2=80= =9D.

=0A

I too would like a dynafocal type II mount=E2=80=A6..= for both of my 13Brews and the 20B=E2=80=A6

=0A

Marc=0A

 

=0A
=0A
=0A

From: Rotary motors in aircraft [mailto:flyrotary@lanc= aironline.net] On Behalf Of Kelly Troyer
Sent: Wednesday, = May 04, 2011 6:09 PM
To: Rotary motors in aircraft
Subject:= [FlyRotary] Re: Back-plate (93-95 Front Side Hsd Needed)

=0A

 

=0A
=0A
=0A

To The R= otary Group,

=0A
=0A

     Yes I= know I am a troublemaker (too much computer time available with my da= y job) and some of you are probably sick of all my posts !!.............."B= ut" with that being said one of our group is seriously considering the= development of a "Mistral" type

=0A
=0A

back-plate= to allow the use of a standard "Lycoming" "Dynafocal type 1" engine mount = ring that will be a virtual "Bolt-on" to the

=0A
=0A

would be interested in such a back-plate (including me)....= ........I have one of the few "Mistral" back-plates that ended up in the

=0A
=0A

hands of experimenters (waited 2 years for it= )..........It is severely over engineered for our use (and overpriced) and = has many

=0A
=0A

features we do not need...........=

=0A
=0A

 

=0A
=0A

&nb= sp;   If you have followed "Back-plate" string of posts recently = you know that Jarrett Johnson one our group with aspirations to

<= /DIV>=0A
=0A

install a Cosmo 20B in his project started the discuss= ion first about an developing an intake manifold for 13B & 20B Rot= arys

=0A
=0A

(which needs to be done also) then&nbs= p;I jumped in and said that a common engine mount design might also be= needed and if

=0A
=0A

you have been reading the p= osts lately a lot of info has been kicked around about the variou= s Rotarys and what it will take to "Marry" the "Mistral" bac= k-plate with a "RX8 "Renesis" water-pump (with the magic of digital scannin= g & CAD) to design

=0A
=0A

such a back-plate..= .......

=0A
=0A

 

=0A
=0A<= P class=3DMsoNormal>     Those that have been on the Rotary forum for s= everal years may remember Jarrett posting his trials and tribulations in

=0A
=0A

building a huge CAM mill (at home)...........= ..He is a commercial designer with the talent and equipment (including= foundry)

=0A
=0A

to pull this off............I hav= e offered my "Mistral" back-plate to be scanned (He trying to find someone&= nbsp;here in Okla to do

=0A
=0A

the  job) and = I also have a "Renesis" front cover to scan............What we really need = now is a 93-95 13BREW front side

=0A
=0A

housing (u= nusable condition preferred as long as front side is undamaged) to put in h= is hands as this is what the back-plate

=0A
=0A

wil= l bolt to..............If someone in the group has an unusable 93-95 13BREW= front side housing they will donate I will pay

=0A
=0A=

to have it shipped to Jarrett..............You may contact me off the = forum if you would prefer..........I have no horse in this race

<= /DIV>=0A
=0A

I would just like to see such a product be made availa= ble to the group..........

=0A
=0A

=  

=0A=0A
=0A

    

=0A

Kelly Troyer
"DYK= E DELTA JD2"(Eventually)

=0A

"13B ROTARY"_ Engine
"RWS"_RD= 1C/EC2/EM2
"MISTRAL"_Backplate/Oil Manifold

=0A

"TURBONETICS"_TO4E50 Turbo<= /SPAN>

=0A
=0A

 

=0A
=0A

 

=0A
=0A
=0A=0A
=0A

From: Kelly Troyer <keltro@att.net>
To: Ro= tary motors in aircraft <flyrotary@lancaironline.net>
Sent:= Tue, May 3, 2011 11:45:09 PM
Subject: [FlyRotary] Re: Back-plate=

=0A
=0A
=0A

Jarrett,

=0A
=0A

 

=0A
=0A

    Will be a good i= dea to scan both the Mistral and Renesis housings.............You really ne= ed

=0A
=0A

a 93-95 13BREW (preferably) or Cos= mo 20B front housing to scan.............Most of my 13B

=0A=
=0A

engines are 86-91.............My Cosmo 13B is adaptable b= ut lacks some of the machined bolt

=0A
= =0A

and stud pads of the 13BREW, Renesis or Cosmo 20B front side h= ousing which you need

=0A
=0A

to make allowances fo= r on the redesigned back-plate if you want it to fit all three versions of<= /SPAN>

=0A
=0A

these engines..................Throw this o= ut to the group and see if someone has a 1993-95

=0A
= =0A

13BREW front side hsg (need not be usable) they would donate or len= d to the project.........

=0A
=0A

<= SPAN style=3D"FONT-FAMILY: 'sans-serif'; FONT-SIZE: 14pt"> 

=
=0A
=0A

   You really need this front side housing = in front of you......... Even with all the scans nothing

= =0A
=0A

beats having the actual hardware............IMHO

=
=0A
=0A

 

=0A
=0A

Best Regards,<= /SPAN>

=0A
=0A

 

=0A

Kelly Troyer
"DYKE DELTA J= D2"

=0A

"13B ROTARY"_ Engine
"RWS"_RD1C/EC2/EM= 2
"MISTRAL"_Backplate/Oil Manifold

=0A

"TURBONETICS"_TO4E50 Turbo

= =0A
=0A

 

=0A
=0A

 

=0A=
=0A
= =0A
=0A
=0A

From: H & J Johnson <hjjohnson@sasktel.net>
To: = Rotary motors in aircraft <flyrotary@lancaironline.net>
Sent: Tue, May 3, 2011 10:43:03 PM
Subject: [FlyRotary] Re: Back-pla= te

=0A

Evening Kelly, so just thought I'd send a note w/ an upd= ate. I did find a fella in Tulsa who has access to a laser scanner. He's ge= tting me some pricing

=0A

on what it would cost to get the job done. I= 'm thinking it might be a good idea to get both the Mistral housing as well= as a Renisis Front Cover scanned?

=0A

I'd like to get an Iron&n= bsp;[preferably the side that mates to the front cover] scanned as wel= l but don't know if you've got one handy [as in, not 'in' an engine]. I cou= ld always

=0A

do it here in time but that might take a bit before I g= et my hands on one that is not in an engine.

=0A

 

=0A

I'll keep you posted as this goes and see whe= re we get.

Jarrett Johnson
www.innovention-tech.com

--    Homepage:  http://www.flyrotary.com/  = ;  Archive and UnSub:   http://mail.lancaironline.net:81/lis= ts/flyrotary/List.html
--0-1778341598-1304663041=:46525--