X-Virus-Scanned: clean according to Sophos on Logan.com Return-Path: Received: from nm23-vm0.access.bullet.mail.mud.yahoo.com ([66.94.236.141] verified) by logan.com (CommuniGate Pro SMTP 5.4c3j) with SMTP id 4960900 for flyrotary@lancaironline.net; Thu, 28 Apr 2011 16:23:41 -0400 Received-SPF: none receiver=logan.com; client-ip=66.94.236.141; envelope-from=ceengland@bellsouth.net Received: from [66.94.237.198] by nm23.access.bullet.mail.mud.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 28 Apr 2011 20:23:06 -0000 Received: from [66.94.237.112] by tm9.access.bullet.mail.mud.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 28 Apr 2011 20:23:06 -0000 Received: from [127.0.0.1] by omp1017.access.mail.mud.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 28 Apr 2011 20:23:06 -0000 X-Yahoo-Newman-Id: 807556.71909.bm@omp1017.access.mail.mud.yahoo.com Received: (qmail 19752 invoked from network); 28 Apr 2011 20:23:06 -0000 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=bellsouth.net; s=s1024; t=1304022186; bh=XFR/NksZ5crDz3myYdDqKwZfMC5S3YLcBRQMrREn25A=; h=Received:X-Yahoo-SMTP:X-YMail-OSG:X-Yahoo-Newman-Property:Message-ID:Date:From:User-Agent:MIME-Version:To:Subject:References:In-Reply-To:Content-Type; b=iQU6o9FzcELum6m+ubq52O6vJP3Z523yymq14GhSUDRmOEl6mnDsmNDjlMaIDGU5bCc/Qj63qEcbQo8uCCrjl+P3/G45us847yb8UgZ81BctlHNd7bDCjhAYmTsrggo4sFkvqjM3qCuz/DPwcRM5r9X3INxFRoXqDMAvXoVr7lk= Received: from [192.168.10.8] (ceengland@98.95.179.58 with plain) by smtp109.sbc.mail.mud.yahoo.com with SMTP; 28 Apr 2011 13:23:06 -0700 PDT X-Yahoo-SMTP: uXJ_6LOswBCr8InijhYErvjWlJuRkoKPGNeiuu7PA.5wcGoy X-YMail-OSG: QzI1W2AVM1ntnt_.YcLg99IcK23b3gQzPd5sKFD8UfNiQI6 5NbuHOGObn19f1Olz5FKxkuP53x8Yrpdru8cn5r76bMP3NmD0FIUoTpCzy9U XaTVtze4_w9YT62O2hlGq.w8YhC1jOcOJ01oA.ir8WW..S7qTD.itlC4l3aq lO_PA85kfMUHe4yeRCh_uSCMDP1Z.9yj2sNCDlCdk.fiBdXvjRNUCWfPEKjg iMdYrax3654vCqPAT1EPnLAAANClB2ZuRDSg9VOfLLh8.W9MhLKX8i6aeWif kw7J7N.cpRwB2PQTLMa0Zf16vVVqRwCuWmyAt0UcdUOQ5wCnvN9uhvH8QFPy 8utrCwILUYvXHVHv5krkkJIxn5frAIA-- X-Yahoo-Newman-Property: ymail-3 Message-ID: <4DB9CCA9.4040600@bellsouth.net> Date: Thu, 28 Apr 2011 15:23:05 -0500 From: Charlie England User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.1; en-US; rv:1.9.2.15) Gecko/20110303 Thunderbird/3.1.9 MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Rotary motors in aircraft Subject: Re: [FlyRotary] Re: Cooling Inlets References: In-Reply-To: Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="------------050908010405010202070306" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --------------050908010405010202070306 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit On 4/28/2011 8:07 AM, Tracy wrote: > Finally got around to finishing my cooling inlets. (pictures > attached) Up until now they were simply round pipes sticking out of > the cowl. The pipes are still there but they have properly shaped > bellmouths on them. The shape and contours were derived from a NASA > contractor report (NASA_CR3485) that you can find via Google. Lots of > math & formulas in it but I just copied the best performing inlet > picture of the contour. Apparently there is an optimum radius for > the inner and outer lip of the inlet. There was no change to the > inlet diameters of 5.25" on water cooler and 4.75" on oil cooler. > > The simple pipes performed adequately in level flight at moderate > cruise settings even on hot days but oil temps would quickly hit > redline at high power level flight and in climb. > > The significant change with the new inlet shape is that they appear to > capture off-axis air flow (like in climb and swirling flow induced > by prop at high power) MUCH better than the simple pipes. First > flight test was on a 94 deg. F day and I could not get the oil temp > above 200 degrees in a max power climb. They may have gone higher > if the air temperature remained constant but at 3500 fpm the rapidly > decreasing OAT kept the temps well under redline (210 deg F). > > I have an air pressure instrument reading the pressure in front of the > oil cooler and was amazed at the pressure recovered from the prop > wash. At 130 MPH the pressure would almost double when the throttle > was advanced to WOT. That did not happen nearly as much with the > simple pipes. > > These inlets ROCK! > > Tracy Crook > Perfect timing for me; I need to decide whether to take a loss & sell my (RV-7) James Lyc style cowl & replace it with James' rotary cowl, or just modify the existing cowl. Some questions: Prior reading seemed to indicate that the oil cooler did ~1/3 of the cooling, implying a 2/1 ratio on air requirements. This setup seems to have a significantly higher percentage allocated to oil. Is this a byproduct of heat exchanger differences, or the less efficient heat transfer ability of oil, or....? 2nd, assuming similar inlet & diffuser efficiencies, could the inlet areas mentioned be reduced by roughly 1/3 with reasonable expectation of cooling a 2 rotor Renesis? On the subject of exit area: Does either heat exchanger have an exit duct? The RV guys with really fast Lyc powered planes all have some variation of exit ducting to smoothly re-accelerate and redirect exit air parallel to & at or above the slipstream. Even the stock RV-8 has a rounded lip at the bottom of the firewall (which the really fast guys say is much too small a radius...). And there's always the near-mythical P-51 system... Thanks, Charlie --------------050908010405010202070306 Content-Type: text/html; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit On 4/28/2011 8:07 AM, Tracy wrote:
Finally got around to finishing my cooling inlets. (pictures attached)  Up until now they were simply round pipes sticking out of the cowl.   The pipes are still there but they have properly shaped bellmouths on them.   The shape and contours were derived from a NASA contractor report (NASA_CR3485) that you can find via Google.  Lots of math & formulas in it but I just copied the best performing inlet picture of the contour.   Apparently there is an optimum radius for the inner and outer lip of the inlet.   There was no change to the inlet diameters of 5.25" on water cooler and 4.75" on oil cooler.

The simple pipes performed adequately in level flight at moderate cruise settings even on hot days but oil temps would quickly hit redline at high power level flight and in climb. 

The significant change with the new inlet shape is that they appear to capture off-axis air flow  (like in climb and swirling flow  induced by prop at high power)  MUCH better than the simple pipes.    First flight test was on a 94 deg. F day and I could not get the oil temp above 200 degrees in a max power climb.    They may have gone higher if the air temperature remained constant but at 3500 fpm the rapidly decreasing OAT kept the temps well under redline (210 deg F).

I have an air pressure instrument reading the pressure in front of the oil cooler and was amazed at the pressure recovered from the prop wash.  At 130 MPH the pressure would almost double when the throttle was advanced to WOT.   That did not happen nearly as much with the simple pipes.  

These inlets ROCK!

Tracy Crook

Perfect timing for me; I need to decide whether to take a loss & sell my (RV-7)  James Lyc style cowl & replace it with James' rotary cowl, or just modify the existing cowl.

Some questions:
Prior reading seemed to indicate that the oil cooler did ~1/3 of the cooling, implying a 2/1 ratio on air requirements. This setup seems to have a significantly higher percentage allocated to oil. Is this a byproduct of heat exchanger differences, or the less efficient heat transfer ability of oil, or....?

2nd, assuming similar inlet & diffuser efficiencies, could the inlet areas mentioned be reduced by roughly 1/3 with reasonable expectation of cooling a 2 rotor Renesis?

On the subject of exit area: Does either heat exchanger have an exit duct? The RV guys with really fast Lyc powered planes all have some variation of exit ducting to smoothly re-accelerate and redirect exit air parallel to & at or above the slipstream. Even the stock RV-8 has a rounded lip at the bottom of the firewall (which the really fast guys say is much too small a radius...). And there's always the near-mythical P-51 system...

Thanks,

Charlie


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