X-Virus-Scanned: clean according to Sophos on Logan.com Return-Path: Received: from [64.129.170.194] (HELO VIRCOM1.fcdata.private) by logan.com (CommuniGate Pro SMTP 5.3.11) with ESMTP id 4655567 for flyrotary@lancaironline.net; Mon, 27 Dec 2010 10:24:02 -0500 Received-SPF: none receiver=logan.com; client-ip=64.129.170.194; envelope-from=cbarber@texasattorney.net Received: from FCD-MAIL06.FCDATA.PRIVATE ([fe80::697f:d6aa:b87:78d8]) by FCD-MAIL05.FCDATA.PRIVATE ([fe80::809d:a06e:5913:452e%15]) with mapi id 14.01.0218.012; Mon, 27 Dec 2010 09:20:18 -0600 From: Chris Barber To: Rotary motors in aircraft CC: Rotary motors in aircraft Subject: Re: [FlyRotary] Re: Chris - Update needed Thread-Topic: [FlyRotary] Re: Chris - Update needed Thread-Index: AQHLpdNoNipbuJhaRkms5abf0l2YEZO0aGuH Date: Mon, 27 Dec 2010 15:23:02 +0000 Message-ID: References: In-Reply-To: Accept-Language: en-US Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="_000_D98FAB35408D46F8863CE7967C0DB20Atexasattorneynet_" MIME-Version: 1.0 --_000_D98FAB35408D46F8863CE7967C0DB20Atexasattorneynet_ Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable I agree Rino. I have made an observation since I removed the prop. Without the load of th= e prop the engine is starting pretty much like you would expect a car to st= art. I will likely reinstall the prop today and hopefully push forward. Chris Sent from my iPhone 4 On Dec 27, 2010, at 8:36 AM, "Rino" > wrote: Chris, It is a car engine, it should start like a car engine, you turn the ignitio= n key and it starts --- every time. If not something must be changed to ma= ke it so. That is the way mine starts and I have no secret technique. I = think one should not have to remember a complex process every time he start= s the engine. That is one of the reasons I choosed the rotary to the Lycom= ing and I am glad I did! Rino Lacombe Renesis powered Glass Goose Chris, For hot starts you might try (1) pump on (2) EC2 on (3) one prime (4) in= jectors disabled (5) Starter (6) injectors on after it fires) (you still may have to fiddle with the mixture with this me= thod)..............Might be worth a try.................<:) Kelly Troyer "DYKE DELTA JD2" (Eventually) "13B ROTARY"_ Engine "RWS"_RD1C/EC2/EM2 "MISTRAL"_Backplate/Oil Manifold "TURBONETICS"_TO4E50 Turbo ________________________________ From: Chris Barber > To: Rotary motors in aircraft > Sent: Sat, December 25, 2010 5:20:43 PM Subject: [FlyRotary] Re: Chris - Update needed I was hesitant to provide info as I was having oil pressure issues again an= d I dreaded the idea of posting having to pull the engine again. I could ju= st hear Al Wicks keyboard tuning up. :-) Anyway, I started basic trouble shooting, had removed the prop preparing to= pull the engine off. Before I did so I figured it would be less messy to d= rain the pan (gee, ya think?). When I did so I only had about one quart com= e out. Odd? I added oil, removed the hose from the cooler and cranked her over remotely= and oil flowed strong and in quantity. So I checked and secured my hose connections, added about five quarts of Ro= yal Purple and cranked her up sans prop, confidant that I was comfortable e= nough with the engine to keep her from over spinning. I checked the manual pressure gauge I had attached and it was pegged at 80,= up from 20. Reinstalled my EC2 electric gauge and got the same result. Now, this turbo with out the prop is way quieter. Without the prop it produ= ces a low throaty rumble that say POWER. Except for the exhaust (rich mixtu= re due to cold temp), noise and spinning prop flange you could not tell it = was running. It was dead smooth. It was kind of weird walking were the prop= usually is while it was running. Not a good habit. All three starts produced good oil press at around 2600 fpm. Check the basics (or so I hope and this isn't some new anomolie). Mark, the ecu is back in. The engine seems to be running strong and smooth.= I am developing just a hair over 6300 rpm static at about 34 map. That is = with the IVO inflight adjustable set at it's finest setting of about 45 deg= ree. Another distraction is my EGT readings working. I have discussed this prev= iously and still need to assess it along with bad fuel pressure readings. My current project, if the oil pressure is ok, is to develop a hot start ro= utine. Currently it wants full rich and a few shots of prime for a cold sta= rt. Cold it starts easily. However, warm start is a pita. I seem to be having luck with severe lean mi= xture until it catches and fires up. Otherwise, it seems just about to catc= h, but doesn't quite do so. It may take a few attempt and excessive crankin= g, and of course holding my tongue just right. Also, what seems to have mad= e a big difference too and making warm cranks better is two new batteries w= ith a combined cranking amps of 710, up from what was probably only about 3= 50 ish CAmps before. Other than that I am working on the devil in the details. Geesh there are a= lot of details, but at last hopefully it is not proof of concept, but flig= ht ready. Questions?????? :-) Sent from my iPhone 4 On Dec 25, 2010, at 3:41 PM, "Mark Steitle" <mst= eitle@gmail.com> wrote: > Chris, > > You've been silent for too long. I was curious if you ever got your EC-2= back from being checked & upgraded? If so, was that the problem? How abo= ut a status update? > > Mark -- Homepage: http://www.flyrotary.com/ Archive and UnSub: http://mail.lancaironline.net:81/lists/flyrotary/List.html --_000_D98FAB35408D46F8863CE7967C0DB20Atexasattorneynet_ Content-Type: text/html; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
I agree Rino. 

I have made an observation since I removed the prop. Without the load = of the prop the engine is starting pretty much like you would expect a car = to start. 

I will likely reinstall the prop today and hopefully push forward.&nbs= p;

Chris

Sent from my iPhone 4

On Dec 27, 2010, at 8:36 AM, "Rino" <lacombr@nbnet.nb.ca> wrote:

Chris,
 
It is a car engine, it should start li= ke a car engine, you turn the ignition key and it starts --- every time.&nb= sp; If not something must be changed to make it so.  That is the way m= ine starts and I have no secret technique.   I think one should not have to remember a complex process every time he star= ts the engine.  That is one of the reasons I choosed the rotary to the= Lycoming and I am glad I did!
 
Rino Lacombe
Renesis powered Glass Goose
 

Chris,
   For hot starts you might try (1) pump on (2) EC2 on (3) o= ne prime (4) injectors disabled (5) Starter (6) injectors on
after it fires) (you still may have to fiddle with the mixture with th= is method)..............Might be worth a try.................<:)   

Kelly Troyer
"DYKE DELTA JD2" (Eventually)

"13B ROTARY"_ Engine
"RWS"_RD1C/EC2/EM2
"MISTRAL"_Backplate/Oil Manifold

"TURBONETICS"_TO4E50 Turbo


<= br>
From: Chris Barber <cbarber@texasattorney.net><= br> To: Rotary motors in aircra= ft <flyrotary@lancaironli= ne.net>
Sent: Sat, December 25, 201= 0 5:20:43 PM
Subject: [FlyRotary] Re: Ch= ris - Update needed

I was hesitant to provide info as I was having oil pressure issues again an= d I dreaded the idea of posting having to pull the engine again. I could ju= st hear Al Wicks keyboard tuning up. :-)

Anyway, I started basic trouble shooting, had removed the prop preparing to= pull the engine off. Before I did so I figured it would be less messy to d= rain the pan (gee, ya think?). When I did so I only had about one quart com= e out. Odd?

I added oil, removed the hose from the cooler and cranked her over remotely= and oil flowed strong and in quantity.

So I checked and secured my hose connections, added about five quarts of Ro= yal Purple and cranked her up sans prop, confidant that I was comfortable e= nough with the engine to keep her from over spinning.

I checked the manual pressure gauge I had attached and it was pegged at 80,= up from 20. Reinstalled my EC2 electric gauge and got the same result.

Now, this turbo with out the prop is way quieter. Without the prop it produ= ces a low throaty rumble that say POWER. Except for the exhaust (rich mixtu= re due to cold temp), noise and spinning prop flange you could not tell it = was running. It was dead smooth. It was kind of weird walking were the prop usually is while it was running= . Not a good habit.

All three starts produced good oil press at around 2600 fpm.

Check the basics (or so I hope and this isn't some new anomolie).

Mark, the ecu is back in. The engine seems to be running strong and smooth.= I am developing just a hair over 6300 rpm static at about 34 map. That is = with the IVO inflight adjustable set at it's finest setting of about 45 deg= ree.

Another distraction is my EGT readings working.  I have discussed this= previously and still need to assess it along with bad fuel pressure readin= gs.

My current project, if the oil pressure is ok, is to develop a hot start ro= utine. Currently it wants full rich and a few shots of prime for a cold sta= rt. Cold it starts easily.

However, warm start is a pita. I seem to be having luck with severe lean mi= xture until it catches and fires up. Otherwise, it seems just about to catc= h, but doesn't quite do so. It may take a few attempt and excessive crankin= g, and of course holding my tongue just right. Also, what seems to have made a big difference too and making = warm cranks better is two new batteries with a combined cranking amps of 71= 0, up from what was probably only about 350 ish CAmps before. 

Other than that I am working on the devil in the details. Geesh there are a= lot of details, but at last hopefully it is not proof of concept, but flig= ht ready. 

Questions?????? :-)

Sent from my iPhone 4

On Dec 25, 2010, at 3:41 PM, "Mark Steitle" <msteitle@gmail.com> wrote:

> Chris, 
>
> You've been silent for too long.  I was curious if you ever got y= our EC-2 back from being checked & upgraded?  If so, was that the = problem?  How about a status update? 
>
> Mark

--
Homepage:  http://www.flyrotary.com/
Archive and UnSub:  = http://mail.lancaironline.net:81/lists/flyrotary/List.html
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