X-Virus-Scanned: clean according to Sophos on Logan.com Return-Path: Received: from mail-gw0-f52.google.com ([74.125.83.52] verified) by logan.com (CommuniGate Pro SMTP 5.3.9) with ESMTP id 4468139 for flyrotary@lancaironline.net; Wed, 15 Sep 2010 14:58:44 -0400 Received-SPF: pass receiver=logan.com; client-ip=74.125.83.52; envelope-from=msteitle@gmail.com Received: by gwj20 with SMTP id 20so262896gwj.25 for ; Wed, 15 Sep 2010 11:58:09 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=domainkey-signature:mime-version:received:received:in-reply-to :references:date:message-id:subject:from:to:content-type; bh=Wn503MNwSUyGbBIlewdSFbRizRD9pmgPt39U/a4d0RE=; b=eyV9/LpRF4qEq/H4KsGu/vxvVQ63Uzp0BBW72roDd3bgKdipwfhD4FR8NAKVX4J7t/ 58VVTYm4rKE2kgm2UB53Mp60E7/liJRQOW0zSIowTUti6zo0jUgoR5PT8D2XqmonAnVH Yktq3tmbyTBMHI5YPGxoyvV/tZRHl7jgIks6E= DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; c=nofws; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=mime-version:in-reply-to:references:date:message-id:subject:from:to :content-type; b=V/OSNud9AYKdZN9XyfL2eCr7SqIpoE26tT+tFs1ALL91JP/yxPATEnFpJal4KOfYKi g9/yEKDhBYRw2s1MJjZDOkNQff8I0Z5HWMDSQofccm4GKsL4l79Xjd3ps7S4AgwrR9sY pv3LDn4iS0Ar2EO/Wt9pRqJqWqfF3twJt3FGw= MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.150.144.12 with SMTP id r12mr2581885ybd.117.1284577089688; Wed, 15 Sep 2010 11:58:09 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.231.173.137 with HTTP; Wed, 15 Sep 2010 11:58:09 -0700 (PDT) In-Reply-To: References: Date: Wed, 15 Sep 2010 13:58:09 -0500 Message-ID: Subject: Re: [FlyRotary] RPM drop out on EM2 (too close to first flight to procrastinate) From: Mark Steitle To: Rotary motors in aircraft Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=000e0cd56aa81e141b049050e9d3 --000e0cd56aa81e141b049050e9d3 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Chris, If you're thinking of calling Tracy, you need to do it right away as he's heading for Colorado for a while. He may already be gone. I would double-check the grounding. (my 2 cents worth) Mark On Wed, Sep 15, 2010 at 1:48 PM, Chris Barber wrote: > This issue has been briefly discussed before. Specifically in May of > 2009 by Don Walker with the topic of "Fine Tuning" > > > 2. *Starting at about 6000 RPM, the RPM display on the EM-2 starts > dropping out.* By the time the RPM gets to 6500 or so it is almost > completely gone, but comes back when I reduce the throttle. I have an > optical prop tach so I know it's speed > > with some possible solutions further down in the email > > > I have had an e-mail discussion with Tracy and he says there may be an > Electrical noise problem. He wrote, "a cap and a resistor on the injector > line to the EM-2". That's it, but no specifics or drawings. Anyone have > any thoughts on this? Right now I have EC-2 line 17 hooked to line p3-6 > on the EM-2. It was suggested to do this to make the signal stronger > rather than have it just come via the serial lines. By the way, I'm not an > EE or electronics tech so I really don't know what I'm doing, just a guy who > can usually follow directions. I suspect there may be a common cause to all > this. Perhaps it is electrical noise. It seems to be part of it. If the > noise problem takes care of some of this, great. Then on to the remaining. > My next experiment will be to run the engine with only the Essential buss on > and see if anything changes. I only have one Ground line off my battery to > the Firewall ground. If I remember correctly, 2 grounds run off that to the > engine and that's it. This cutting edge stuff takes forever. Thankfully > it's not bleeding edge. > > > Don, Tracy...Ed....??? Was there a resolution to this issue as I am having > the same thing happen to me. As I approach 6000 rpm the display on the EM2drops out to zero, but may flash other values as well. When I pull back on > the throttle, the display to appear to become happier and display what I > think/hope is accurate but will drop out again if I add power. > > I was somewhat pleased that this was described on an RV since often the > first thing folks will key in on for my project is the long wire runs on my > Velocity. Course, it could be the long wire runs, but RV's do not usually > have this particular issue. > > I also, like Don mentioned in his original post, am not a EE, but am > usually somewhat trainable. I would have no idea of where to start to > address these issues....especially such as adding a cap and resistor. Heck, > I don't even know what a cap is and just kinda sorto know what a resistor > is. Also, what "size" of these items would be used and how would they be > used??????installed?????etc????? > > I thought I would touch base here before I considered troubling Tracy with > a call based in ignorance and frustration. I did search the archives (as > evidenced by finding Don's post), however, determining WHAT to search for > can be a bit elusive as times. > > I am really quite close to potential first flight. Other than a > few gremlins like the one mentioned, I am pretty much left > with readjusting the toe in since the wings and engine have been > installed, setting the wing incidences to the canard again and weighing the > thing...oh, and calling my local DAR. > Another gremlin for your consideration. Again, concerning the EM2, I have > had the displayed numerals disappear. They will then come back. I have > RE-checked the wires and all is as it should be, as it has been when I > checked in the past. It may be the rheostat connection as it is the only > thing I have not yet checked and it sorta acts as if the rheostat has bee > turned. > > Finally, again, EM2, my EGT readings are jumping all over the place. From > maybe 300 degrees to 8500 degrees. It appears random and jumps all over > the place. Not surprising it trips my "trouble light". Again, I have > checked and rechecked the wires and connections. My next troubleshooting > check will be to pull the sensors themselves from the turbo manifold. I am > wondering if I placed the sensors too close to the rotary exhaust (about 3 > inches from the ports) and I fried the sensors. > > Tracy's tech day is Saturday, Right??? > > Thanks in advance guys. I would not have come this far without ya. > > All the best, > > Chris Barber > Houston > Velocity N17010 > --000e0cd56aa81e141b049050e9d3 Content-Type: text/html; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Chris,
=A0
If you're thinking of calling Tracy, you need to do it right away = as he's heading for Colorado for a while.=A0 He may already be gone.=A0=
=A0
I would double-check the grounding. (my 2 cents worth)
=A0
Mark

On Wed, Sep 15, 2010 at 1:48 PM, Chris Barber <cbarber@te= xasattorney.net> wrote:
This issue has been briefly discussed before.=A0 Specifically in May o= f 2009 by Don Walker with the topic of "Fine Tuning"
=A0
with some possible=A0solutions further down in the = email
=A0
=A0 I have had an e-mail discussion with Tracy and he says= there may be an Electrical noise problem.=A0 He wrote, "a cap and a r= esistor on the injector line to the EM-2".=A0 That's= it, but no specifics or drawings.=A0 Anyone have any thoughts on this?=A0 = Right now I have EC-2 line 17 hooked to line p3-6 on the EM-2.=A0 It was suggested to do this to make the signal stronger = rather than have it just come via the serial lines.=A0 By the way, I'm = not an EE or electronics tech so I really don't know what I'm doing= , just a guy who can usually follow directions.=A0 I suspect there may be a= common cause to all this.=A0 Perhaps it is electrical noise.=A0 It seems t= o be part of it.=A0 If the noise problem takes care of some of this, great.= =A0 Then on to the remaining.=A0 My next experiment will be to run the engi= ne with only the Essential buss on and see if anything changes.=A0 I only h= ave one Ground line off my battery to the Firewall ground.=A0 If I remember= correctly, 2 grounds run off that to the engine and that's it.=A0 This= cutting edge stuff takes forever.=A0 Thankfully it's not bleeding edge= .
=A0
Don, Tracy...Ed....??? Was there a resolution to this issu= e as I am having the same thing happen to me.=A0 As I approach 6000 rpm the= display on the=A0EM2 drops out to zero, but may flash other = values as well.=A0 When I pull back on the throttle, the display to = appear to become happier and display what I think/hope is accurate but will= drop out again if I add power.
=A0
I was somewhat pleased that this was=A0described on= an RV since often the first thing folks will key in on for my project is t= he long wire runs on my Velocity.=A0 Course, it could be the long wire runs= , but RV's do not usually have this particular issue.
=A0
I also, like Don mentioned in his original post, am not a = EE, but am usually somewhat trainable.=A0 I would have no idea of where to = start to address these issues....especially such as adding a cap and resist= or.=A0 Heck, I=A0don't even know what a cap is and just=A0kinda<= a>=A0sorto know what a resistor is.=A0 Also, what = "size" of these items would be used and how would they be used???= ???installed?????etc?????
=A0
I thought I would touch base here before I considered trou= bling Tracy with a call based in ignorance and frustration.=A0 I did search= the=A0archives (as evidenced by finding Don's post), however,= =A0determining WHAT to search for can be a bit elusive as times.
=A0
I am really quite close to potential first flight.=A0 Othe= r than a few=A0gremlins like the one mentioned, I am pretty much lef= t with=A0readjusting the toe in since the wings and engine have been= installed, setting the wing incidences to the canard again and weighing th= e thing...oh, and calling my local DAR.
Another=A0gremlin for your consideration.=A0 Again,= =A0concerning the EM2, I have had the displayed numera= ls disappear.=A0 They will then come back.=A0 I have RE-checked the = wires and all is as it should be, as it has been when I checked in the past= .=A0 It may be the=A0rheostat=A0=A0connection as it is the on= ly thing I have not yet checked and it=A0sorta acts as if the= =A0rheostat has bee turned.
=A0
Finally, again, EM2, my=A0EGT = readings are jumping all over the place.=A0 From maybe =A0300 degrees to 85= 00 degrees.=A0 It appears random and jumps all over the place.=A0 Not=A0sur= prising it trips my "trouble light".=A0 Again, I have chec= ked and rechecked the wires and connections.=A0 My next troubleshooting che= ck will be to pull the sensors themselves from the turbo manifold.=A0 I am = wondering if I placed the sensors too close to the rotary exhaust (about 3 = inches from the ports) and I fried the sensors.
=A0
Tracy's tech day is Saturday, Right???
=A0
Thanks in advance guys. I would not have come this far wit= hout ya.
=A0
All the best,
=A0
Chris Barber
Houston
Velocity N17010

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