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Message-ID: <B97DB471C1304343B3669A9FB661F9CB@ownerf1fc517b8>
From: "George Lendich" <lendich@aanet.com.au>
To: "Rotary motors in aircraft" <flyrotary@lancaironline.net>
References: <list-4191273@logan.com>
Subject: Re: [FlyRotary] Re: More tuning
Date: Thu, 1 Apr 2010 16:24:45 +1000
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Chris,
Did you do any measurements when you got it - it is a nice piece of work =
IMHO.
George (down under)=20
  Just a data point....I have the Mistral intake if anyone wants to take =
a gander at it and try to gather ideas for their own.  Of course, it is =
installed and I am about ready to crank it all up following some =
concentration in other areas for a while.  But you are welcome to look.

  All the best,

  Chris Barber
  Houston, GSOT

-------------------------------------------------------------------------=
-----

  From: Rotary motors in aircraft [flyrotary@lancaironline.net] on =
behalf of Lynn Hanover [lehanover@gmail.com]
  Sent: Wednesday, March 31, 2010 9:12 PM
  To: Rotary motors in aircraft
  Subject: [FlyRotary] More tuning


   A coupleof sharp motor tuners and a day or so on a good repeatable =
dyno can zero in on acceptable intake design that should set a good =
baseline for what really works. You can sliderule / use fancy computer =
programs and other methods of determining optimum designs but nothing =
trumps real time data in a running engine. Just my .02 cents worth.
  =20
  Ben Haas


  Oh, to have my own dyno again.

  The point was that there are many rotary engines to think about. Now =
days you probably have a 13B side intake port, periphery exhaust, or the =
now common Renesis with side intake and exhaust. And now converting both =
styles to a home made periphery intake. Neither exsists in nature, so =
you may well be on your own tuning wise.=20

  Stick to the basics. Velocities reversions, harmonics DIE, radius, =
Mach numbers.  As in radio wave reception, you are probably operating in =
the 1/4 wave regeion. Remember the thing you built in the attic to get =
killer reception on the black and white TV? The lower channel numbers =
had such a long wave length that it took a big attic to hang just a 1/4 =
wave length antenna.  And the UHF antenna was just a loop with barely =
12" of wire involved.=20

  Remember the Cross Ram Dodges, with 4 barrel carbs hanging outboard of =
the rocker covers. 460 foot pounds of torque. The runners were at least =
4 times the length of the dual plane regular manifold.=20

  So was the cross ram the full tuned length and the regular street =
manifold runners were the 1/4 wave length? Or was the cross ram the half =
wave length? Usually the best harmonic peaks will be divisable by 4.=20

  So all of this harmonic, standing wave, pulse tuning stuff applies to =
one dynamic situation based on that engine RPM. Change the RPM and =
everything else changes too. There is nothing static about airplane =
engines. So the best guess is to get it close to cruise RPM and then =
tune the daylights out of it. The airplane is a kind of dyno. It =
provides a variable load. The engine controller provides the tuning =
capability. Every flight can be used to recover usefull data.=20

  Use the SAE tables to return all data to the SAE standard day at sea =
level. Make only one change per test. Record everything. Keep the =
records.=20

  Or, just copy the Mistral intake.

  Lynn E. Hanover
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<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>Chris,</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>Did you do any measurements when you =
got it - it is=20
a nice piece of work IMHO.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>George (down under)</FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE dir=3Dltr=20
style=3D"PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; =
BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">
  <DIV=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 13px; COLOR: #000000; DIRECTION: ltr; FONT-FAMILY: =
Tahoma">
  <DIV>Just a data point....I have the Mistral intake if anyone wants to =
take a=20
  gander at it and try to gather ideas for their own.&nbsp; Of course, =
it is=20
  installed and I am about ready to crank it all up following some =
concentration=20
  in other areas for a while.&nbsp; But you are welcome to look.</DIV>
  <DIV>&nbsp;</DIV>
  <DIV>All the best,</DIV>
  <DIV>&nbsp;</DIV>
  <DIV>Chris Barber</DIV>
  <DIV>Houston, GSOT<A></A></DIV>
  <DIV style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 16px; COLOR: #000000; FONT-FAMILY: Times New =
Roman">
  <HR tabIndex=3D-1>

  <DIV id=3DdivRpF929256 style=3D"DIRECTION: ltr"><FONT face=3DTahoma =
color=3D#000000=20
  size=3D2><B>From:</B> Rotary motors in aircraft =
[flyrotary@lancaironline.net] on=20
  behalf of Lynn Hanover [lehanover@gmail.com]<BR><B>Sent:</B> =
Wednesday, March=20
  31, 2010 9:12 PM<BR><B>To:</B> Rotary motors in =
aircraft<BR><B>Subject:</B>=20
  [FlyRotary] More tuning<BR></FONT><BR></DIV>
  <DIV></DIV>
  <DIV>
  <DIV>&nbsp;A coupleof sharp motor tuners and a day or so on a good =
repeatable=20
  dyno can zero in on acceptable intake design that should set a good =
baseline=20
  for what really works. You can sliderule / use fancy computer programs =
and=20
  other methods of determining optimum designs but nothing trumps real =
time data=20
  in a running engine. Just my .02 cents worth.<BR>&nbsp;<BR><STRONG>Ben =

  Haas</STRONG><BR></DIV>
  <DIV>&nbsp;</DIV>
  <DIV>Oh, to have my own dyno again.</DIV>
  <DIV>&nbsp;</DIV>
  <DIV>The point was that there are many rotary engines to think about. =
Now days=20
  you probably have a 13B side intake port, periphery exhaust, or the =
now common=20
  Renesis with side intake and exhaust. And now converting both styles =
to a home=20
  made periphery intake. Neither exsists in nature, so you may well be =
on your=20
  own tuning wise. </DIV>
  <DIV>&nbsp;</DIV>
  <DIV>Stick to the basics. Velocities reversions, harmonics DIE, =
radius, Mach=20
  numbers.&nbsp; As in radio wave reception, you are probably operating =
in the=20
  1/4 wave regeion. Remember the thing you built in the attic to get =
killer=20
  reception on the black and white TV? The lower channel numbers had =
such a long=20
  wave length that it took a big attic to hang just a 1/4 wave length =
antenna.=20
  &nbsp;And the UHF antenna was just a loop with barely 12" of wire =
involved.=20
  </DIV>
  <DIV>&nbsp;</DIV>
  <DIV>Remember the Cross Ram Dodges, with 4 barrel carbs hanging =
outboard of=20
  the rocker covers. 460 foot pounds of torque. The runners were at =
least 4=20
  times the length of the dual plane regular manifold. </DIV>
  <DIV>&nbsp;</DIV>
  <DIV>So was the cross ram the full tuned length and the regular street =

  manifold runners were the 1/4 wave length? Or was the cross ram the =
half wave=20
  length? Usually the best harmonic peaks will be divisable by 4. </DIV>
  <DIV>&nbsp;</DIV>
  <DIV>So all of this harmonic, standing wave, pulse tuning stuff =
applies to one=20
  dynamic situation based on that engine RPM. Change the RPM and =
everything else=20
  changes too. There is nothing static about airplane engines. So the =
best guess=20
  is to get it close to cruise RPM and then tune the daylights out of =
it. The=20
  airplane is a kind of dyno. It provides a variable load. The engine =
controller=20
  provides the tuning capability. Every flight can be used to recover =
usefull=20
  data. </DIV>
  <DIV>&nbsp;</DIV>
  <DIV>Use the SAE tables to return all data to the SAE standard day at =
sea=20
  level. Make only one change per test. Record everything. Keep the =
records.=20
  </DIV>
  <DIV>&nbsp;</DIV>
  <DIV>Or, just copy the Mistral intake.</DIV>
  <DIV>&nbsp;</DIV>
  <DIV>Lynn E. =
Hanover</DIV></DIV></DIV></DIV></BLOCKQUOTE></BODY></HTML>

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