X-Virus-Scanned: clean according to Sophos on Logan.com Return-Path: Received: from mail-bw0-f226.google.com ([209.85.218.226] verified) by logan.com (CommuniGate Pro SMTP 5.3c1) with ESMTP id 3951468 for flyrotary@lancaironline.net; Fri, 06 Nov 2009 16:09:51 -0500 Received-SPF: pass receiver=logan.com; client-ip=209.85.218.226; envelope-from=msteitle@gmail.com Received: by bwz26 with SMTP id 26so1633125bwz.27 for ; Fri, 06 Nov 2009 13:09:16 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=domainkey-signature:mime-version:received:in-reply-to:references :date:message-id:subject:from:to:content-type; bh=pXrNkzVAWSh4MGRkOJjXMmzlmakM3zyq9cPMEIFp+ag=; b=UJUL02Hpun//DKugeKe6M1kdWl9tRPvuI+rol82urjsg2gCrC3awC9XOr9pRV98E73 dTh25/ZiPbdZGbG6HyZNY73BhOHTW9ayRR2zEv6+wuUKKCG3rrezAZ+GXPJwpWAqxtSA WTsU08Z68UkFAMEiRH0VWYaener5J5ozMLQqE= DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; c=nofws; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=mime-version:in-reply-to:references:date:message-id:subject:from:to :content-type; b=VKv07KJqbiIabIoFZJy/+AoIa63AWRrhu42PxU55XTsoYEbyEP8wZ/cOTZnoNhfwDK H9GN2ZmOZgOs4pLjqo57JX96IsGTvaomDA6NGdMWq7jbBCfxpmo0c3vDlQ8wAjKUGAgt +A7h8azAUhWDLO1jsdTrjsgptnp+4ckbGFL38= MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.204.11.6 with SMTP id r6mr5165818bkr.29.1257541756132; Fri, 06 Nov 2009 13:09:16 -0800 (PST) In-Reply-To: References: Date: Fri, 6 Nov 2009 15:09:16 -0600 Message-ID: <5cf132c0911061309r5c27e384yc015e0a4fb4b9714@mail.gmail.com> Subject: Re: [FlyRotary] Re: PRIVATE - TES O-Ring Dimensions From: Mark Steitle To: Rotary motors in aircraft Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=00032555929aaa1f4e0477ba4174 --00032555929aaa1f4e0477ba4174 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable George, Highly scientific method - I used the lid to the Go-Jo container... it fit perfectly down into the oil ring groove. I then sprayed around the outer surface and let it soak, hosed it off, then turned it over and did the othe= r side. Worked great. For the 3 faces of the rotors I put a pvc pipe through the centers of all three rotors and suspended them and slid them together and sprayed each face, rotated and repeated until all 9 faces were covered. After they set for a while, I lifted the rotors by the pvc pipe and took them outside and hosed them off with the garden hose. I had to repeat a few times, but it sure beat scraping them clean by hand. When done, I sprayed with corrosion inhibitor. Mark On Fri, Nov 6, 2009 at 2:33 PM, George Lendich wrote= : > Mark, > I don't think there would be much difference, for fitment, between .190 a= nd > .210 anyway, about half a millimeter, but it's good to keep things ( size= s) > straight for those wanting to use them - especially when Kelly went to so > much trouble to confirm them. > > What method did you use to protect the bearing surface- taped-up the > bearing surface or grease? I assume you had to soak the rotors for a whil= e? > George ( down under) > > > George, > > Stretching on boards would only make them bigger. One dim. was already > 1/4" too big to start with. It is nearly impossible to shrink them witho= ut > cutting and splicing. Anyway, I got it confirmed that the correct dia is > 11.190 (I used 11.210" on my first engine and they fit great). Now to ge= t > my order placed and move on. > > BTW.. regarding cleaning rotors, someone asked if oven cleaner would work= . > Yes it does! I tried it and it worked great! I used two different brand= s > (with different chemical compounds) and both worked like a champ. It too= k a > few applications to get through the really thick stuff, and I suggest you > protect the bearings, but this worked better than using Coastal Power Cle= an > as I did when cleaning up my first engine. Using oven cleaner, I got all > three rotors cleaned up in a couple of hours time. Just don't breath th= e > fumes, get it on your skin, or in your eyes! > > Mark S. > > > > > On Fri, Nov 6, 2009 at 1:01 AM, George Lendich wrot= e: > >> Mark, >> I believe Pl was advised of these proper measurements, but ignored them. >> It may be he refused to believe that he was wrong. Sure as hell beats >> stretching them on a board, the right size pops directly into place. The >> beauty of fractional fittings. >> George (down under) >> >> George, >> >> My research and measurments confirm these dimensions. Thanks for the >> info. >> >> Mark >> >> On Thu, Nov 5, 2009 at 6:59 PM, George Lendich wro= te: >> >>> >>> >>> Mark, >>> Kelly Troyer, sent some end housings to Jeff Chrysler of Creavey, to ma= ke >>> absolutely sure of sizing. Jeff promised me that he would hold a record= of >>> the proper size for all Mazda Rotary requests. >>> >>> The sizes ID by Jeff where as you have stated.for the oil seals - and >>> Coolant seals are >>> PFA-Sil 0.093 section 11.190 inch ID >>> PFA-Sil 0.093 section 8.950 inch ID >>> HTH >>> George (down under) >>> >>> >>> Paul, >>> >>> I'm sending this to you "private" so as not to confuse everyone with a >>> bunch of dimensions that may, or may not, turn out to be correct. I sp= oke >>> with Jeff today thinking that he would be able to verify the correct si= zes >>> and he doesn't have those dimensions. >>> >>> Looking through my archives, I found an old email stating that I >>> initially used the 11.340" dimension, but it turned out to be too large= and >>> I had to send it back to have it re-sized to 11.230" which worked perfe= ctly >>> (didn't require stretching) and laid in the groove very nicely. >>> >>> >>> >>> I found my receipt from Creavy Seal Co. Unfortunately, it is only for >>> one coolant seal, and both oil seals. >>> >>> >>> >>> As for the outer coolant seal=85 Originally I ordered a set of SIL .093= =96 >>> 11.340 ID o-rings. These proved to be too big and I had to send them b= ack. >>> Note that 11.340 minus .090 is 11.230=85 the correct size. I had given= them a >>> size based on CL, not ID. So, be sure you=92re on the same page when o= rdering >>> these things. After a few emails to Jeff Chrysler, we got it right on = the >>> re-order with these numbers=85 *SIL .093 =96 11.230*. These fit perfect= ly. >>> I can find no records for what I ordered on the inner coolant seals. H= ere >>> is an email I sent to Jeff Chrysler at Creavy Seal after fit-checking t= he >>> new outer coolant o-rings. >>> >>> >>> >>> Attn: Jeff Chrysler >>> >>> >>> >>> Hi Jeff, >>> >>> The reworked TES o-rings fit perfect. Final dimension for the outer >>> coolant o-rings is .093 x 11.230" ID. Thank you so much for all your h= elp. >>> I can start putting my engine back together now. I have passed this >>> information along to Paul Lamar as well. This size should work for all= 13B >>> and 20B engines, but you may want to verify size before using it for th= e new >>> Renesis engines. >>> >>> >>> >>> Thanks again for your assistance, >>> >>> Mark Steitle >>> >>> >>> >>> The information for the two oil seals are SIL .093 =96 4.680 ID, and SI= L >>> .118 =96 4.330 ID. >>> >>> >>> >>> Using your example of how to measure and calculate the coolant o-ring >>> dimensions, I ran the numbers and came up with 11.182" for the outer co= olant >>> o-ring. Based on this info, I order based on the 11.230" dimension for= the >>> outer o-ring. I'll let you know how it works out. >>> >>> All of the other dims agree with my numbers. >>> >>> Thanks, >>> Mark >>> >>> >> > --00032555929aaa1f4e0477ba4174 Content-Type: text/html; charset=windows-1252 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
George,
=A0
Highly scientific method - I used the lid to the Go-Jo container... it= fit perfectly down into the oil ring groove.=A0 I=A0then sprayed around th= e outer surface and let it soak,=A0hosed it off, then=A0turned it over and = did the other side.=A0 Worked great.=A0
=A0
For the=A03 faces of the rotors I put=A0a pvc pipe through the centers= of all three rotors and suspended them and slid them together and sprayed= =A0each face, rotated and repeated until all=A09 faces were covered.=A0 Aft= er they set for a while, I lifted the rotors by the pvc pipe and took them = outside and hosed them off with the garden hose.=A0 I had to repeat a few t= imes, but it sure beat scraping them clean by hand.=A0
=A0
When done, I sprayed with corrosion inhibitor.
=A0
Mark

On Fri, Nov 6, 2009 at 2:33 PM, George Lendich <= span dir=3D"ltr"><lendich@aanet.= com.au> wrote:
Mark,
I don't think there would be much = difference, for fitment,=A0between .190 and .210 anyway, about half a milli= meter, but it's good to keep things ( sizes) straight for those wanting= to use them - especially when=A0Kelly went to=A0so much trouble to confirm= them.
=A0
What method did you use to protect the= bearing surface- taped-up the bearing surface or grease? I assume you had = to soak the rotors for a while?
George ( down under)

George,
=A0
Stretching on boards would only make=A0them bigger.=A0 One dim.=A0was = already 1/4" too big to start with.=A0 It is nearly impossible to shri= nk them without cutting and splicing.=A0 Anyway, I got it confirmed that th= e correct dia=A0is 11.190 (I used 11.210" on my first engine and they = fit great).=A0 Now to get my order placed and move on.
=A0
BTW.. regarding cleaning rotors, someone asked if oven cleaner would w= ork.=A0 Yes it does!=A0 I tried it and it=A0worked great!=A0 I used two dif= ferent brands (with different chemical compounds) and both worked like a ch= amp.=A0 It took a few applications to get through the really thick stuff, a= nd I suggest you protect the bearings, but this worked better than using Co= astal Power Clean as I did when cleaning up my first engine.=A0 Using oven = cleaner, I got all three rotors cleaned up in a couple of hours time.=A0 = =A0Just don't breath the fumes, get it on your skin, or in your eyes!
=A0
Mark S.
=A0


=A0
On Fri, Nov 6, 2009 at 1:01 AM, George Lendich <= span dir=3D"ltr"><lendich@aanet.com.au> wrote:
Mark,
I believe Pl was advised of these prop= er measurements, but ignored them. It may be he refused to believe that he = was wrong. Sure as hell beats stretching them on a board, the right size po= ps directly into place. The beauty of fractional fittings.
George (down under)
George,
=A0
My research and measurments confirm these dimensions.=A0 Thanks for th= e info.
=A0
Mark=A0

On Thu, Nov 5, 2009 at 6:59 PM, George Lendich <= span dir=3D"ltr"><lendich@aanet.com.au> wrote:
=A0
=A0Mark,
Kelly Troyer, sent some end housings to Jef= f Chrysler of Creavey, to make absolutely sure of sizing. Jeff promised me = that he would hold a record of the proper size for all Mazda Rotary request= s.
=A0
The sizes ID by Jeff where as you have stat= ed.for the oil seals -=A0and=A0 Coolant seals are
PFA-Sil=A0=A0 0.093 section 11.190=A0 inch = ID
PFA-Sil=A0=A0 0.093 section=A0=A0 8.950 inc= h ID
HTH
George (down under)
=A0
=A0
Paul,
=A0
I'm sending this to you "private" so as not to confuse e= veryone with a bunch of dimensions that may, or may not, turn out to be cor= rect.=A0 I spoke with Jeff today thinking that he would be able to verify t= he correct sizes and he doesn't have those dimensions.
=A0
Looking through my archives, I found an old email stating that I initi= ally used the 11.340" dimension, but it turned out to be too large and= I=A0had to send it back to have it re-sized to 11.230" which worked p= erfectly (didn't require stretching) and=A0laid in the groove very nice= ly.
=A0
<snip>

I found my receipt from Creavy Seal Co.=A0 Unfortuna= tely, it is only for one coolant seal, and both oil seals.=A0

=A0

As for the outer coolant seal=85 Originally I ordere= d a set of SIL .093 =96 11.340 ID o-rings.=A0 These proved to be too big an= d I had to send them back.=A0 Note that 11.340 minus .090 is 11.230=85 the = correct size.=A0 I had given them a size based on CL, not ID.=A0 So, be sur= e you=92re on the same page when ordering these things.=A0 After a few emai= ls to Jeff Chrysler, we got it right on the re-order with these numbers=85 = SIL .093 =96 11.230. These fit perfectly.=A0 I can find no records f= or what I ordered on the inner coolant seals.=A0 Here is an email I sent to= Jeff Chrysler at Creavy Seal after fit-checking the new outer coolant o-ri= ngs.

=A0

Attn:=A0 Jeff Chrysler

=A0

Hi Jeff,

The reworked TES o-rings fit perfect.= =A0 Final dimension for the outer coolant o-rings is .093 x 11.230" ID= .=A0 Thank you so much for all your help.=A0 I can start putting my engine = back together now.=A0 I have passed this information along to Paul Lamar as= well.=A0 This size should work for all 13B and 20B engines, but you may wa= nt to verify size before using it for the new Renesis engines.=A0

=A0

Thanks again for your assistance,

Mark Steitle

=A0

The information for the two oil seals are SIL .093 = =96 4.680 ID, and SIL .118 =96 4.330 ID.

<snip>

=A0
Using your example of how to measure and calculate=A0the coolant o-rin= g dimensions, I ran the numbers and came up with 11.182" for the outer= coolant o-ring.=A0 Based on this info, I order based on the 11.230" d= imension for the outer o-ring.=A0 I'll let you know how it works out.
=A0
All of the other dims agree with my numbers.
=A0
Thanks,
Mark=A0=A0=A0
<= br>


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