X-Virus-Scanned: clean according to Sophos on Logan.com Return-Path: Received: from poplet2.per.eftel.com ([203.24.100.45] verified) by logan.com (CommuniGate Pro SMTP 5.2.14) with ESMTP id 3750373 for flyrotary@lancaironline.net; Thu, 09 Jul 2009 03:01:09 -0400 Received-SPF: none receiver=logan.com; client-ip=203.24.100.45; envelope-from=lendich@aanet.com.au Received: from sv1-1.aanet.com.au (sv1-1.per.aanet.com.au [203.24.100.68]) by poplet2.per.eftel.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0474D173979 for ; Thu, 9 Jul 2009 15:00:30 +0800 (WST) Received: from ownerf1fc517b8 (203.171.92.134.static.rev.aanet.com.au [203.171.92.134]) by sv1-1.aanet.com.au (Postfix) with SMTP id 361FABEC012 for ; Thu, 9 Jul 2009 15:00:28 +0800 (WST) Message-ID: <0E8C1872CEC84CE0AFD37072963FC677@ownerf1fc517b8> From: "George Lendich" To: "Rotary motors in aircraft" References: Subject: Re: [FlyRotary] Re: SAG- Spark plugs 2592 or 2692? Date: Thu, 9 Jul 2009 17:00:27 +1000 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0025_01CA00B6.C2630E80" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.5512 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.5579 X-Antivirus: avast! (VPS 090708-0, 07/08/2009), Outbound message X-Antivirus-Status: Clean This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0025_01CA00B6.C2630E80 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Chris and Bill, It's handy to have an old housing to screw new type plugs into before = you actually put them into the working engine. It's then easy to see how far the plug extends by looking from the = inside of the housing. George (down under) So, I am guessing by this thread that it is ok to use the none = shrouded stock NKG plugs. I have not looked, but now assume that the = more standard type automotive plug fits even with it longer electrodes = extending further out. Cpl. Christopher Barber, JD Badge 330 Bellaire Police Department 5110 Jessamine Bellaire, Texas 77401 713-668-0487 713-662-8289 fax CBarber@BellairePolice.com -------------------------------------------------------------------------= ----- From: Rotary motors in aircraft on behalf of Kelly Troyer Sent: Wed 7/8/2009 6:44 PM To: Rotary motors in aircraft Subject: [FlyRotary] SAG- Spark plugs 2592 or 2692? Bill, You are correct................You have to look up the AR2592 plugs = by part number............This plug is actually used in some early Chevrolet and Chrysler Big block = engines for racing.......... -- Kelly Troyer=20 "Dyke Delta"_13B ROTARY Engine=20 "RWS"_RD1C/EC2/EM2=20 "Mistral"_Backplate/Oil Manifold=20 -------------- Original message from "Bill Bradburry" = : --------------=20 Kelly, I don't see a call out for the rotary engine in the Autolite = info.??? Bill B=20 -------------------------------------------------------------------------= --- From: Rotary motors in aircraft [mailto:flyrotary@lancaironline.net] = On Behalf Of Kelly Troyer Sent: Wednesday, July 08, 2009 3:27 PM To: Rotary motors in aircraft Subject: [FlyRotary] SAG- Spark plugs 2592 or 2692? Jeff and All, I believe the mystery is solved...............Apparently = "AR2692" is a typo error and "AR2592" is correct..............Check out the link = below............Full of info.....=20 http://www.autolite.com/pdf/Autolite_HP_Apps.pdf Kelly Troyer=20 "Dyke Delta"_13B ROTARY Engine=20 "RWS"_RD1C/EC2/EM2=20 "Mistral"_Backplate/Oil Manifold=20 -------------- Original message from "Kelly Troyer" = : --------------=20 Jeff, I have never found a trace of a "AR2692"............Lynn which = is correct ??................... -- Kelly Troyer=20 "Dyke Delta"_13B ROTARY Engine=20 "RWS"_RD1C/EC2/EM2=20 "Mistral"_Backplate/Oil Manifold=20 -------------- Original message from Jeff Whaley = : --------------=20 Lynn's email referenced 2 part numbers . Poor folks race with = Autolight AR2692 and . In the picture, left to right is the Autolight = AR2592. So which number is it correct? 2592 or 2692? Jeff From: Rotary motors in aircraft = [mailto:flyrotary@lancaironline.net] On Behalf Of Kelly Troyer Sent: Wednesday, July 08, 2009 2:35 PM To: Rotary motors in aircraft Subject: [FlyRotary] SAG- Spark plugs Lynn and Group, I checked my local "Auto Zone" and they claimed to be = unable to get the "AutoLite" AR2592 sparkplug...............Checked "Rock Auto" (Link = below) and they have them in packs of 4 for $2.69 (each plug)...........Ordered 8 of them = for $21.52 + $5.47 shipping but "AutoLite" has a rebate offer of $0.50 per plug for up to = 16 plugs until Nov. 30,2009 for copper core plugs (rebate link below).............To find = the sparkplug do a part number search (AR2592) , Add the manufacturer (AutoLite) , Then use = "all" for the part group because if you use "Ignition" and "Sparkplug" for part type it = will say "No part found".... FWIW=20 http://www.rockauto.com/catalog/raframecatalog.php?a=3DG-Store http://www.autolite.com/rebate/pdf/spark-plug-09.pdf -- Kelly Troyer=20 "Dyke Delta"_13B ROTARY Engine=20 "RWS"_RD1C/EC2/EM2=20 "Mistral"_Backplate/Oil Manifold=20 -------------- Original message from Lynn Hanover = : --------------=20 In a message dated 7/7/2009 3:22:56 P.M. Pacific Daylight = Time, bbradburry@bellsouth.net writes: Steve, I hope Lynn chimes in here. He has seen a lot of plugs = under a lot of conditions. They look pitted to me. There seems nothing = wrong with your conditions. The only thing on the list would be too = lean.?? Someone is out there writing up a great response right = now! :>) Bill B=20 That plug has been too hot.=20 Stock Mazda plugs are rather cold in heat range by way of = the guards around the shell. The electrode runs a bit hotter than = normal. Plug heat ranges are determined by how far down the shell the = porcelain touches. The longer the heat path, the hotter the plug.=20 Using car plugs in the aircraft application seems to be = asking for trouble. In the car on the freeway you use 2,600 RPM and 1/2 = throttle, maybe 24 to 28 HP. Not much of a challenge for a spark plug. = But there is the=20 driver who will jump into his 95 twin turbo in LA and run = out to LasVegas at full tilt and expect to still have an engine when he = gets there. And usually he does. So, if I was to use a street plug in = an aircraft, I would use the 93-95 twin turbo plug, whatever that is. The aircraft application, less the 100LL fuel problem, is = clearly a cold racing plug with a conventional gap or close to it.=20 Years ago when we started racing rotaries, Champion said to = use the N-57G Fine wire center with gold paladium plating and a = conventional ground strap. About 20% of the center wire is exposed in an = end view. The N-57G and similar are discontinued and the N-82 series = replaced it. The shell is thinner and the porcelain is wider. Same fine = wire center, no gold anything. 20% of the wire exposed in an end view.=20 Both worked fine even with points and a Kettering coil. Poor folks race with Autolight AR2692 end style and small = porcelain just like the N-57G. Full size center wire, conventional = strap, but 100% of the center wire is exposed in an end view. Actually = used by NASCAR and the local circle track people, and stocked by = Autozone and others. About $5.00 a box of 4. They work fine. I raced = them one weekend, no problems, but we were getting the NGK plugs for = free so I stuck with them.=20 The NGKR6725-115 stamped on the body actually means that the = heat range is 11.5 not 115. $25.00 each. 50% of the center wire exposed in an end view. Free for some = Rotary engined competitors. Retracted gap (the whole thing is inside the = shell. Fine wire center and fine wire ground strap. Ice cold. Long body = so it is easy to install and remove in the rotary.=20 I grind off those eyebrow things above the plug holes so I = can use any plug I like. And any 5/8" plug just goes in so easy. Most = heat ranges are available in the 5/8" shells.=20 Rotaries do not like high heat range plugs. The housings = crack across the leading plug hole. Over time a complete set of radial = cracks form.=20 In the picture, left to right is the Autolight AR2592, = Champion N-82, NGK R6725-115, and Champion=20 N-57G.=20 Lynn E. Hanover Warning: This e-mail transmission, and any documents, files or = previous e-mails attached to it, may contain confidential information = that is legally privileged. If you are not the intended recipient or the = person responsible for delivering it to the intended recipient, you are = hereby notified that any disclosure, copying, distribution or use of any = of the information contained in or attached to this transmission is = STRICTLY PROHIBITED. If you have received this transmission in error, = please immediately notify us by telephone at 713-662-8132 and destroy = the original transmission and its attachments without reading them. = Thank you. ------=_NextPart_000_0025_01CA00B6.C2630E80 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
 
Chris and Bill,
It's handy to have an old housing to = screw new=20 type plugs into before you actually put them into the working = engine.
It's then easy to see how far the plug = extends=20 by looking from the inside of the housing.
George (down under)
 
So, I am = guessing by this=20 thread that it is ok to use the none shrouded stock NKG plugs.  I = have=20 not looked, but now assume that the more standard type = automotive plug=20 fits even with it longer electrodes extending further = out.
 
Cpl. Christopher Barber, = JD
Badge 330
Bellaire Police Department
5110 Jessamine
Bellaire, Texas 77401
 
713-668-0487
713-662-8289 fax
 
CBarber@BellairePolice.com

From: Rotary motors in aircraft on = behalf of=20 Kelly Troyer
Sent: Wed 7/8/2009 6:44 PM
To: Rotary = motors=20 in aircraft
Subject: [FlyRotary] SAG- Spark plugs 2592 or=20 2692?

Bill,
 You are correct................You have to look up the = AR2592 plugs=20 by part number............This plug
is actually used in some early Chevrolet and Chrysler Big = block=20 engines for racing..........
--
Kelly Troyer
"Dyke = Delta"_13B=20 ROTARY Engine
"RWS"_RD1C/EC2/EM2
"Mistral"_Backplate/Oil = Manifold=20



 
--------------=20 Original message from "Bill Bradburry" = <bbradburry@bellsouth.net>:=20 --------------

Kelly,

I don=92t see a call out for the rotary = engine in the=20 Autolite info=85???

 

Bill B 

 

From:=20 Rotary motors in aircraft [mailto:flyrotary@lancaironline.net] = On Behalf Of Kelly = Troyer
Sent: Wednesday, July 08, = 2009 3:27=20 PM
To: Rotary = motors in=20 aircraft
Subject: = [FlyRotary] SAG- Spark plugs 2592 or 2692?

Jeff and All,

 

       I = believe the=20 mystery is solved...............Apparently "AR2692" is a typo=20 error

and "AR2592" is correct..............Check = out the=20 link below............Full of = info..... 

 

   http://www.auto= lite.com/pdf/Autolite_HP_Apps.pdf

 


Kelly Troyer
"Dyke = Delta"_13B=20 ROTARY Engine
"RWS"_RD1C/EC2/EM2
"Mistral"_Backplate/Oil = Manifold=20


 

-------------- Original message from = "Kelly=20 Troyer" <keltro@att.net>: --------------=20


Jeff,

  I have never found a trace of a=20 "AR2692"............Lynn which is correct=20 ??...................

--
Kelly=20 Troyer
"Dyke Delta"_13B ROTARY Engine
"RWS"_RD1C/EC2/EM2=20
"Mistral"_Backplate/Oil Manifold =


 

-------------- Original message from = Jeff Whaley=20 <jwhaley@datacast.com>: --------------

Lynn=92s email=20 referenced 2 part numbers =85 Poor folks race with = Autolight=20 AR2692 and =85 In the picture, left to right is the Autolight = AR2592.

So = which number is=20 it correct? 2592 or 2692?

Jeff

 

From:=20 Rotary motors in aircraft [mailto:flyrotary@lancaironline.net] = On Behalf Of Kelly=20 Troyer
Sent: = Wednesday,=20 July 08, 2009 2:35 PM
To: Rotary motors in=20 aircraft
Subject:=20 [FlyRotary] SAG- Spark plugs

 

Lynn and = Group,

 

        =20 I checked my local "Auto Zone" and they claimed to be unable = to get=20 the "AutoLite"

AR2592 = sparkplug...............Checked "Rock=20 Auto" (Link below) and they have them = in

packs of 4 for $2.69 (each=20 plug)...........Ordered 8 of them for $21.52 + $5.47=20 shipping

but "AutoLite" has a rebate offer of = $0.50 per=20 plug for up to 16 plugs until Nov. = 30,2009

for copper core plugs (rebate link=20 below).............To find the sparkplug do a part=20 number

search (AR2592) , Add the = manufacturer=20 (AutoLite) , Then use "all" for the part = group

because if you use "Ignition" and = "Sparkplug"=20 for part type it will say "No part = found"....

 

FWIW 

 

 

h= ttp://www.rockauto.com/catalog/raframecatalog.php?a=3DG-Store<= /FONT>

 

http://www.= autolite.com/rebate/pdf/spark-plug-09.pdf

--
Kelly Troyer
"Dyke = Delta"_13B ROTARY=20 Engine
"RWS"_RD1C/EC2/EM2
"Mistral"_Backplate/Oil = Manifold=20

 

-------------- Original message = from Lynn=20 Hanover <lehanover@gmail.com>: --------------=20

In a message dated 7/7/2009 = 3:22:56 P.M.=20 Pacific Daylight Time, bbradburry@bellsouth.net=20 writes:

Steve,
I=20 hope Lynn chimes in here.  He has seen a lot of plugs = under a=20 lot of
conditions.  They look pitted to me.  = There=20 seems nothing wrong with your
conditions.  The = only thing=20 on the list would be too lean.??
Someone is out there = writing=20 up a great response right now!  :>)
Bill B=20

That plug has been too hot.=20

 

Stock Mazda plugs are rather cold = in heat=20 range by way of the guards around the shell. The electrode = runs a=20 bit hotter than normal. Plug heat ranges are determined by = how far=20 down the shell the porcelain touches. The longer the heat = path, the=20 hotter the plug.

 

Using car plugs in the aircraft = application=20 seems to be asking for trouble. In the car on the freeway = you use=20 2,600 RPM and 1/2 throttle, maybe 24 to 28 HP. Not much = of a=20 challenge for a spark plug. But there is the=20

driver who will jump into his 95 = twin turbo=20 in LA and run out to LasVegas at full tilt and expect = to still=20 have an engine when he gets there. And usually he does. =  So, if=20 I was to use a street plug in an aircraft, I would use the = 93-95=20 twin turbo plug, whatever that is.

 

The aircraft application, less the = 100LL=20 fuel problem, is clearly a cold racing plug with a = conventional gap=20 or close to it.

 

Years ago when we started racing = rotaries,=20 Champion said to use the N-57G Fine wire center with gold = paladium=20 plating and a conventional ground strap. About 20% of the = center=20 wire is exposed in an end view.

 

The N-57G and similar are = discontinued and=20 the N-82 series replaced it. The shell is thinner and the = porcelain=20 is wider. Same fine wire center, no gold anything. 20% of = the wire=20 exposed in an end view.

Both worked fine even with points = and a=20 Kettering coil.

 

Poor folks race with Autolight = AR2692 end=20 style and small porcelain just like the N-57G. Full size = center=20 wire, conventional strap, but 100% of the center wire is = exposed in=20 an end view. Actually used by NASCAR and the local circle = track=20 people, and stocked by Autozone and others. About $5.00 a = box of 4.=20 They work fine. I raced them one weekend, no problems, but = we were=20 getting the NGK plugs for free so I stuck with them.=20

 

The NGKR6725-115 stamped on the = body=20 actually means that the heat range is 11.5 not 115. $25.00=20 each.

50% of the center wire exposed in = an end=20 view. Free for some Rotary engined competitors. Retracted = gap (the=20 whole thing is inside the shell. Fine wire center and fine = wire=20 ground strap. Ice cold. Long body so it is easy to install = and=20 remove in the rotary.

 

I grind off those eyebrow things = above the=20 plug holes so I can use any plug I like. And any 5/8" plug = just goes=20 in so easy. Most heat ranges are available in the 5/8" = shells.=20

 

Rotaries do not like high heat = range plugs.=20 The housings crack across the leading plug hole. Over time a = complete set of radial cracks form.

 

In the picture, left to right is = the=20 Autolight AR2592, Champion N-82, NGK R6725-115, and Champion =

N-57G. 

 

Lynn E. = Hanover

 


Warning:=20 This e-mail transmission, and any documents, files or previous e-mails = attached to it, may contain confidential information that is legally=20 privileged. If you are not the intended recipient or the person = responsible=20 for delivering it to the intended recipient, you are hereby notified = that any=20 disclosure, copying, distribution or use of any of the information = contained=20 in or attached to this transmission is STRICTLY PROHIBITED. If you = have=20 received this transmission in error, please immediately notify us by = telephone=20 at 713-662-8132 and destroy the original transmission and its = attachments=20 without reading them. Thank you.

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