X-Virus-Scanned: clean according to Sophos on Logan.com Return-Path: Received: from smtp106.sbc.mail.re2.yahoo.com ([68.142.229.99] verified) by logan.com (CommuniGate Pro SMTP 5.2.5) with SMTP id 3029481 for flyrotary@lancaironline.net; Wed, 16 Jul 2008 22:08:43 -0400 Received: (qmail 83713 invoked from network); 17 Jul 2008 02:08:41 -0000 DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=s1024; d=sbcglobal.net; h=Received:X-YMail-OSG:X-Yahoo-Newman-Property:Message-ID:From:To:References:Subject:Date:MIME-Version:Content-Type:X-Priority:X-MSMail-Priority:X-Mailer:X-MimeOLE; b=JWabsKa6hu4oatdXHPrqTZEyJGTwpUR6xEe1oqh2bhqC+lRiwNf0e+7fQ18l5DVle8XEmDCsyTmVvhbt+Pnu6UZg5CCkMl+ESDkGhnKTDFaUt6DxMemDorGqwm2/005SE5G23lZPeYoL0lVII51Yc1yLhA12i2nhHaSrZ76JdnA= ; Received: from unknown (HELO mom) (downing.j@sbcglobal.net@75.40.230.154 with login) by smtp106.sbc.mail.re2.yahoo.com with SMTP; 17 Jul 2008 02:08:40 -0000 X-YMail-OSG: SW.t50gVM1kdiXYCeoLsGYwSkT1o8H0bqgbli4DOIbPdAtuiFxuwIyy1fHwIKDUjQLLYhmW3B.G9l2bdPnF2MR70Ef.FBpPqOtrSc7Kso3Ssu98CKZNgiHx3aQFW5sjNZBQX6fqQxlIFCTfUkgxjq1Cz X-Yahoo-Newman-Property: ymail-3 Message-ID: <002301c8e7b3$3613f920$4001a8c0@gateway.2wire.net> From: "John Downing" To: "Rotary motors in aircraft" References: Subject: Re: [FlyRotary] Re: No Spark from Coils Date: Wed, 16 Jul 2008 22:17:03 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0020_01C8E791.ACFA0600" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1409 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1409 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0020_01C8E791.ACFA0600 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Tracy, the new plugs came today and are installed. I have a Heath Kit = analog volt-ohm tester, would it work better than the digital one. I = don't think I can find an oscilloscope around here. The EC2 serial = number is in the early 500's as I recall and doesn't have the diagnostic = modes. I will try and check pin C for voltage pulse before I turn on = the fuel to save flooding a new set of plugs. Thankyou JohnD ----- Original Message -----=20 From: Tracy Crook=20 To: Rotary motors in aircraft=20 Sent: Wednesday, July 16, 2008 3:14 PM Subject: [FlyRotary] Re: No Spark from Coils Bob gave you good advice John. Pin C should have about a 3 - 4 volt = pulse on it though (when cranking or running). 27 volts sounds like = measurement error. There is no source of voltage that high in the = system. =20 Do you have the diagnostic modes? Try it if so. =20 Tracy (back from Colorado) On Sat, Jul 12, 2008 at 12:12 AM, Bob White wrote: Hi John, Pin A to engine ground is correct, pin B to EC2 ground is correct, = +12V on pin D is correct. I'm not sure what you will read on pin C with = a voltmeter. It should pulse from 0 to +12V, and you will need an oscilloscope to see it properly. What really concerns me is the 27 Volts. The EC2 ground lead is connected to the EC2 ground stud, and that should be connected to airframe ground near the EC2, so that voltage should basically be zero. I'm not sure why you would see anything anywhere above the 12 to 14 volt bus voltage. My first suggestion would be to double check ground connections at = the EC2, and make sure there is a ground strap between the engine and battery that will handle the starter currents. The minimum load on pins 20 and 21 is several K ohms, and shouldn't cause any problems, but just to be sure, can you disconnect it temporarily? Bob W. On Fri, 11 Jul 2008 23:29:31 -0400 "John Downing" wrote: > Bob W, today I joined the non-start rotor club, I expected it not = to start after following the Saga of Buly and Chris. We don't have any = ignition. We checked the wires to the coils and , all coil plugs have = ground to block on pin A, ground to EC2 on pin B, voltage on Pin D. On = cranking, Pin C on the volt ohm meter on cranking shows 9 volts, = dropping to 7 volts which is a steady reading on not pulsing. Pin B = which is the ground to the EC2, voltage rises to 27 volts. What is the = voltage that we should be seeing on pins B and C and should C show a = pushing voltage? Is the Tach interface that you sent me, which is = connected to EC2 pins 20 and 21 for leading coils having anything to do = with the fact that the coils are not firing. JohnD > -- N93BD - Rotary Powered BD-4 - http://www.bob-white.com 3.8 Hours Total Time and holding Cables for your rotary installation - = http://roblinstores.com/cables/ -- Homepage: http://www.flyrotary.com/ Archive and UnSub: = http://mail.lancaironline.net:81/lists/flyrotary/List.html ------=_NextPart_000_0020_01C8E791.ACFA0600 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Tracy, the new plugs came today and are = installed.  I have a Heath Kit analog volt-ohm tester, would it = work better=20 than the digital one.  I don't think I can find an oscilloscope = around=20 here.  The EC2 serial number is in the early 500's as I recall and = doesn't=20 have the diagnostic modes.  I will try and check pin C for voltage = pulse=20 before I turn on the fuel to save flooding a new set of plugs. =20 Thankyou  JohnD
----- Original Message -----
From:=20 Tracy=20 Crook
Sent: Wednesday, July 16, 2008 = 3:14=20 PM
Subject: [FlyRotary] Re: No = Spark from=20 Coils

Bob gave you good advice John.  Pin C should have about a 3 = - 4 volt=20 pulse on it though (when cranking or running).  27 volts sounds = like=20 measurement error.  There is no source of voltage that high in = the=20 system. 
 
Do you have the diagnostic modes?  Try it if so.  =
 
Tracy (back from Colorado)

On Sat, Jul 12, 2008 at 12:12 AM, Bob White = <bob@bob-white.com> wrote:
Hi=20 John,

Pin A to engine ground is correct, pin B to EC2 ground = is=20 correct, +12V
on pin D is correct.  I'm not sure what you = will read=20 on pin C with a
voltmeter.  It should pulse from 0 to +12V, = and you=20 will need an
oscilloscope to see it properly.  What really = concerns=20 me is the 27
Volts.  The EC2 ground lead is connected to the = EC2=20 ground stud, and
that should be connected to airframe ground near = the=20 EC2, so that
voltage should basically be zero.  I'm not sure = why you=20 would see
anything anywhere above the 12 to 14 volt bus=20 voltage.

My first suggestion would be to double check ground=20 connections at the
EC2, and make sure there is a ground strap = between the=20 engine and
battery that will handle the starter = currents.

The=20 minimum load on pins 20 and 21 is several K ohms, and = shouldn't
cause any=20 problems, but just to be sure, can you disconnect=20 it
temporarily?

Bob W.


On Fri, 11 Jul 2008 23:29:31 = -0400
"John=20 Downing" <downing.j@sbcglobal.net>=20 wrote:

> Bob W,  today I joined the non-start rotor = club, I=20 expected it not to start after following the Saga of Buly and Chris. =  We don't have any ignition.  We checked the wires to the = coils=20 and , all coil plugs have ground to block on pin A, ground to EC2 on = pin B,=20 voltage on Pin D.  On cranking,  Pin C on the volt ohm = meter on=20 cranking shows 9 volts, dropping to 7 volts which is a steady = reading on not=20 pulsing.  Pin B which is the ground to the EC2, voltage rises = to 27=20 volts.  What is the voltage that we should be seeing on pins B = and C=20 and should C show a pushing voltage?  Is the Tach interface = that you=20 sent me, which is connected to EC2 pins 20 and 21 for leading coils = having=20 anything to do with the fact that the coils are not firing.=20  JohnD
>


--
N93BD - Rotary Powered = BD-4 - http://www.bob-white.com
3.8 Hours Total Time = and=20 holding
Cables for your rotary installation - http://roblinstores.com/cables/

--
Homepage:  http://www.flyrotary.com/
Archive and UnSub: =   http://mail.lancaironline.net:81/lists/flyrotary/List.htm= l

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