X-Virus-Scanned: clean according to Sophos on Logan.com Return-Path: Received: from fed1rmmtao102.cox.net ([68.230.241.44] verified) by logan.com (CommuniGate Pro SMTP 5.2.3) with ESMTP id 2924361 for flyrotary@lancaironline.net; Fri, 16 May 2008 01:43:11 -0400 Received-SPF: none receiver=logan.com; client-ip=68.230.241.44; envelope-from=rv-4mike@cox.net Received: from fed1rmimpo02.cox.net ([70.169.32.72]) by fed1rmmtao102.cox.net (InterMail vM.7.08.02.01 201-2186-121-102-20070209) with ESMTP id <20080516054232.PRBR2291.fed1rmmtao102.cox.net@fed1rmimpo02.cox.net> for ; Fri, 16 May 2008 01:42:32 -0400 Received: from wills ([68.105.85.56]) by fed1rmimpo02.cox.net with bizsmtp id S5iV1Z00A1CvZmk045iXS5; Fri, 16 May 2008 01:42:31 -0400 Message-ID: <000f01c8b717$a165e700$38556944@wills> From: "Mike Wills" To: "Rotary motors in aircraft" References: Subject: Re: [FlyRotary] Re: Oil thoughts Date: Thu, 15 May 2008 22:42:29 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_000C_01C8B6DC.F4BAC3C0" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.3138 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.3198 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_000C_01C8B6DC.F4BAC3C0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Per the Washington Post 2 Feb 2008: "Exxon broke the record it = previously had set for a US corporation, earning $40.6 billion in 2007". = Chevron's profits rose 29% in the same year to $4.9 billion. http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2007/02/01/AR2007020= 100714.html From the NewYork Times: Exxon earns $1287 per second in profit (not = gross) for every second in 2007. http://www.nytimes.com/2008/02/01/business/01cnd-exxon.html?_r=3D1&oref=3D= slogin Sadly Exxon's CEO only earned $16.7 million last year. $1.75 million in = salary, $3.36 million in bonuses, and $5.7 million in stock awards. A = pay raise of 28%. Wish I'd gotten a 28% raise last year so I could = afford to pay for this damn gas, and virtually everything else in the = country that has gone up as a result in the rapid ramp up in gas prices. http://www.marketwatch.com/news/story/exxon-ceos-compensation-increased-2= 007/story.aspx?guid=3D%7B9C6AF009-D527-48D7-A01B-55D0CF5D621A%7D I agree there is plenty of blame to go around. I expect to get screwed = by OPEC but I'm pretty pissed that the US economy is on the way to the = toilet while US oil corporations continue to reap obscene profits. I = think given a choice between big government and big oil the bigger = crooks by far are big oil. Just my opinion though. And with that I'll = quit this thread and go back to talking about airplanes and engines. = It's less depressing. Mike Wills RV-4 N144MW ----- Original Message -----=20 From: Timothy Peters=20 To: Rotary motors in aircraft=20 Sent: Thursday, May 15, 2008 5:46 AM Subject: [FlyRotary] Re: Oil thoughts Whoops... I'm usually just a lurker, but I can't let that one go. = ;-) If you look at the financial statements for Exxon (just to pick on the = most common name taken in vain), you will see that they drill roughly = 20% of the crude oil they use. The rest they buy. Now this crude oil = is valuable. About $126 a barrel on the open market the last time I = checked. =20 However when you look at the refining operations, Exxon is loosing big = money ($3 billion 2 quarters back, although I haven't looked at the = actual refining loss for last quarter.) That's right... the big evil = oil company is actually subsidizing the cost of gasoline in the U.S. Heck, if I was the evil bastard running Exxon, I would sell everything = I drilled to China and pocket the extra money. Profits would be way up! = =20 Timothy (doesn't know when to shut up) Peters aka MarbleTurtle Dalton, GA. =20 ----- Original Message -----=20 From: Mike Wills=20 To: Rotary motors in aircraft=20 Sent: Tuesday, May 13, 2008 8:57 PM Subject: [FlyRotary] Re: Oil thoughts Not sure I agree with anything you said without a lot of research to = check your facts. One thing is certain - I disagree with your last = paragraph. While I dont put a whole lot of faith in politicians I put = less in the big oil companies. The profits these guys are reporting = while single handedly wrecking the economy are disgraceful. Lets not = jail them - lets prosecute them for raping our economy. Thats just my opinion. Now can we go back to discussing something = less depressing? Mike Wills RV-4 N144MW ----- Original Message -----=20 From: Lehanover@aol.com=20 To: Rotary motors in aircraft=20 Sent: Tuesday, May 13, 2008 7:52 AM Subject: [FlyRotary] Oil thoughts Since we are sitting on a 600 year supply of oil in the US, I = wonder why we are still looking at biofuels as a source for anything? We = know how to pump oil out of the ground, we are now equipped to do just = that.=20 Canada is 99.9% unexplored. The US is 98% unexplored. There may be = a 60 year supply just in ANWR.=20 Less than 1% of the US population can find ANWR on a map. Fewer = know that ANWR is an acronym. =20 A smaller number will ever see it. None of the West coast waters = has been explored, None of the East coast waters have been explored. The = gulf is only partially explored and the last test well indicates up to = 15 billion barrels may be available at just that one dome. The Chinese = are drilling in the gulf. They are not stupid, and they don't need any = permission from us to drill. What sane person would suggest that we take = off in a new direction looking for an oil substitute?=20 All of the alliterative energy sources in our future, are just pie = in the sky when it comes to replacing oil. If all of the future hopes from 10 years ago had been put on line, = they still wouldn't add up to 1% of the picture. Its going to be oil for = the next 30 years at least, so we need to quit wishing in one hand and = listening to the tree huggers, and start passing out exploration = permits, and open all government owned lands for exploration. The permit = for building a new refinery should cost $100.00, and take a week to = process. There should be no permit required for exploration, with the = land owners permission. Then start cutting down the amount of oil that = can be imported each year until it is down to zero from the Moslem = controlled sources. Just one super tanker sunk in the strait of Hormuz = and the whole of the earth will be in deep dodo in less than 2 weeks. = And with a real shortage, and the armed forces getting first call you = won't have to worry about high prices, there won't be any oil for = recreational use at all. And then suggest that we make fuel out of feed grains, or any kind = of food? The number of independent truckers on the road is dropping = daily. Prices for everything will continue to climb. If there is no = additional payment for fuel the private truck owners cannot make a dime = with fuel over $4.00 a gallon. So their rigs are parked now.=20 Let the free market determine how much alcohol is used in motor = fuels. No price supports for corn for ethanol, ever, period. All food = stuffs, meat and poultry, many plastics, and motor fuels go up because = of the use of ethanol in fuels. The energy available in each gallon goes = down when ethanol is added. It takes more energy to make a gallon than = is in each gallon. Fuel milage goes down with ethanol. With pure ethanol = look for 30% less power, lower milage and more cost. =20 We should be importing oil only from sources we can trust. Mexico = and Canada are two of those.=20 Sending cash to the Mideast to be used against us is insane.=20 Two of the choices for president want to tax the oil companies for = windfall profits. This is shear genius, in the Wile E. Coyote sense of = the term. Where do we suppose that oil companies, or any company get = their profits? And what will these companies do to make up for profits = lost to the imbeciles in our Government?=20 Why $6.00 a gallon fuel will cover that my friends. That will be = $10.00 a gallon for low lead aviation fuel just for starters. But that just my opinion, and I could be wrong. Lynn E. Hanover -------------------------------------------------------------------------= - Wondering what's for Dinner Tonight? Get new twists on family = favorites at AOL Food. ------=_NextPart_000_000C_01C8B6DC.F4BAC3C0 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Per the Washington Post 2 Feb 2008: "Exxon broke the record it = previously=20 had set for a US corporation, earning $40.6 billion in 2007". Chevron's = profits=20 rose 29% in the same year to $4.9 billion.
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article= /2007/02/01/AR2007020100714.html
 
From the NewYork Times: Exxon earns $1287 per second in profit (not = gross)=20 for every second in 2007.
 
http://www.nytimes.com/2008/02/01/business/01cnd-exx= on.html?_r=3D1&oref=3Dslogin
 
Sadly Exxon's CEO only earned $16.7 million last year. $1.75 = million in=20 salary, $3.36 million in bonuses, and $5.7 million in stock awards. A = pay raise=20 of 28%. Wish I'd gotten a 28% raise last year so I could afford to pay = for this=20 damn gas, and virtually everything else in the country that has gone up = as a=20 result in the rapid ramp up in gas prices.
 
http://www.marketwatch.com/news/story/exxon-ceos-compensation-increased-= 2007/story.aspx?guid=3D%7B9C6AF009-D527-48D7-A01B-55D0CF5D621A%7D
 
I agree there is plenty of blame to go around. I expect to get = screwed=20 by OPEC but I'm pretty pissed that the US economy is on the way to = the=20 toilet while US oil corporations continue to reap obscene = profits. I think=20 given a choice between big government and big oil the bigger crooks by = far are=20 big oil. Just my opinion though. And with that I'll quit this thread and = go back=20 to talking about airplanes and engines. It's less depressing.
 
Mike Wills
 
RV-4 N144MW
----- Original Message -----
From:=20 Timothy=20 Peters
Sent: Thursday, May 15, 2008 = 5:46=20 AM
Subject: [FlyRotary] Re: Oil=20 thoughts

Whoops...  I'm usually just a lurker, but I can't let that = one=20 go.  ;-)
 
If you look at the financial statements for Exxon (just to pick = on the=20 most common name taken in vain), you will see that they drill roughly = 20% of=20 the crude oil they use.  The rest they buy.  Now this crude = oil is=20 valuable.  About $126 a barrel on the open market the last time I = checked. 
 
However when you look at the refining operations, Exxon is = loosing big=20 money ($3 billion 2 quarters back, although I haven't looked at = the=20 actual refining loss for last quarter.)  That's right... the = big=20 evil oil company is actually subsidizing the cost of gasoline in the=20 U.S.
 
Heck, if I was the evil bastard running Exxon, I would sell = everything I=20 drilled to China and pocket the extra money.  Profits would be = way=20 up! 
 
Timothy (doesn't know when to shut up) Peters
aka MarbleTurtle
Dalton, GA. 
----- Original Message -----
From:=20 Mike = Wills=20
To: Rotary motors in = aircraft=20
Sent: Tuesday, May 13, 2008 = 8:57=20 PM
Subject: [FlyRotary] Re: Oil=20 thoughts

Not sure I agree with anything you said without a lot of = research to=20 check your facts. One thing is certain - I disagree with your last=20 paragraph. While I dont put a whole lot of faith in politicians I = put less=20 in the big oil companies. The profits these guys are reporting while = single=20 handedly wrecking the economy are disgraceful. Lets not jail them - = lets=20 prosecute them for raping our economy.
 
 Thats just my opinion. Now can we go back to discussing = something=20 less depressing?
 
Mike Wills
RV-4 N144MW
----- Original Message ----- =
From:=20 Lehanover@aol.com
To: Rotary motors in = aircraft=20
Sent: Tuesday, May 13, 2008 = 7:52=20 AM
Subject: [FlyRotary] Oil=20 thoughts

Since we are sitting on a 600 year supply of oil in the US, I = wonder=20 why we are still looking at biofuels as a source for anything? We = know how=20 to pump oil out of the ground, we are now equipped to do just = that.
Canada is 99.9% unexplored. The US is 98% unexplored. There = may be a=20 60 year supply just in ANWR.
Less than 1% of the US population can find ANWR on a map. = Fewer know=20 that ANWR is an acronym. 
A smaller number will ever see it. None of the West coast = waters has=20 been explored, None of the East coast waters have been explored. = The gulf=20 is only partially explored and the last test well indicates up to = 15=20 billion barrels may be available at just that one dome. The = Chinese are=20 drilling in the gulf. They are not stupid, and they don't need any = permission from us to drill. What sane person would suggest that = we take=20 off in a new direction looking for an oil substitute?
 
All of the alliterative energy sources in our future, are = just pie in=20 the sky when it comes to replacing oil.
If all of the future hopes from 10 years ago had been put on = line,=20 they still wouldn't add up to 1% of the picture. Its going to be = oil for=20 the next 30 years at least, so we need to quit wishing in one hand = and=20 listening to the tree huggers, and start passing out exploration = permits,=20 and open all government owned lands for exploration. The permit = for=20 building a new refinery should cost $100.00, and take a week to = process.=20 There should be no permit required for exploration, with the land = owners=20 permission. Then start cutting down the amount of oil that can be = imported=20 each year until it is down to zero from the Moslem controlled = sources.=20 Just one super tanker sunk in the strait of Hormuz and the whole = of the=20 earth will be in deep dodo in less than 2 weeks. And with a real = shortage,=20 and the armed forces getting first call you won't have to worry = about high=20 prices, there won't be any oil for recreational use at all.
 
And then suggest that we make fuel out of feed grains, or any = kind of=20 food? The number of independent truckers on the road is dropping = daily.=20 Prices for everything will continue to climb. If there is no = additional=20 payment for fuel the private truck owners cannot make a dime with = fuel=20 over $4.00 a gallon. So their rigs are parked now.
 
Let the free market determine how much alcohol is used in = motor=20 fuels. No price supports for corn for ethanol, ever, period. All = food=20 stuffs, meat and poultry, many plastics, and motor fuels go up = because of=20 the use of ethanol in fuels. The energy available in each = gallon goes=20 down when ethanol is added. It takes more energy to make a gallon = than is=20 in each gallon. Fuel milage goes down with ethanol. With pure = ethanol look=20 for 30% less power, lower milage and more cost.   
 
We should be importing oil only from sources we can trust. = Mexico and=20 Canada are two of those.
Sending cash to the Mideast to be used against us is insane. =
 
Two of the choices for president want to tax the oil = companies for=20 windfall profits. This is shear genius, in the Wile E. Coyote = sense of the=20 term. Where do we suppose that oil companies, or any company get = their=20 profits? And what will these companies do to make up for profits = lost to=20 the imbeciles in our Government?
Why $6.00 a gallon fuel will cover that my friends. That will = be=20 $10.00 a gallon for low lead aviation fuel just for = starters.
 
But that just my opinion, and I could be wrong.
 
Lynn E. Hanover



Wondering what's for Dinner Tonight? Get new twists on family favorites at AOL=20 = Food.
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