X-Virus-Scanned: clean according to Sophos on Logan.com Return-Path: Received: from fed1rmmtao102.cox.net ([68.230.241.44] verified) by logan.com (CommuniGate Pro SMTP 5.2c1) with ESMTP id 2602869 for flyrotary@lancaironline.net; Mon, 17 Dec 2007 20:50:00 -0500 Received-SPF: none receiver=logan.com; client-ip=68.230.241.44; envelope-from=alventures@cox.net Received: from fed1rmimpo02.cox.net ([70.169.32.72]) by fed1rmmtao102.cox.net (InterMail vM.7.08.02.01 201-2186-121-102-20070209) with ESMTP id <20071218014921.WMQC24689.fed1rmmtao102.cox.net@fed1rmimpo02.cox.net> for ; Mon, 17 Dec 2007 20:49:21 -0500 Received: from BigAl ([72.192.143.193]) by fed1rmimpo02.cox.net with bizsmtp id S1pN1Y00S4AaN600000000; Mon, 17 Dec 2007 20:49:23 -0500 From: "Al Gietzen" To: "'Rotary motors in aircraft'" Subject: RE: [FlyRotary] Re: EC-2 troubles Date: Mon, 17 Dec 2007 17:50:00 -0800 Message-ID: <000001c84118$4d22dc90$6401a8c0@BigAl> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0001_01C840D5.3EFF9C90" X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook, Build 10.0.6626 Importance: Normal In-Reply-To: X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.3198 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0001_01C840D5.3EFF9C90 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable I have separated the injector wires and the coil wires from the rest. There's a ground block located between the two with a connection through = the firewall to another ground block and engine ground. Batteries are in = the back though. There's a #2 welding cable going from the ground block to = the battery. It routes down the right side away from all the smaller wires. = =20 When you say "smaller wires" do you mean current carrying wires that = power things, and return current from the alternator - or just instrumentation wires? Good practice, especially in a composite plane, is to use = twisted pair (power/grnd) to cancel noise. Having power leads away from the = ground return forms a big loop antenna for radiating EMF from wires that carry noisy current. I suspect that is not much help at this point. =20 Probably the noisiest wires we have in our planes are the alternator = output and the power for the coils and injectors. =20 The nav/com is mounted near the EM-2 and could possibly be the culprit, based on Al's recommendations. The EM-2 display is right above the = nav/com. Maybe I need to move the nav/com to the back of the plane? =20 =20 The Nav/Com itself should not be an issue, the antenna lead should only 'leak' low levels of RF unless the impedance match isn't good, or bad connection to the antenna. Is your EM2 display remote from the Data Acquisition Module? Those leads, the serial leads between the EM2 and = EC2, and the power leads to the EC2 should be kept away from the noisy wires. But then, I'm no expert on this stuff. Tracking down electrical noise = takes an expert with an oscilloscope.=20 You were on a good track suspecting the solid state relay if the problem = did not occur prior to installing it. You may need to add snubbers there. Switching relays definitely generates a noise spike. Al=20 =20 ------=_NextPart_000_0001_01C840D5.3EFF9C90 Content-Type: text/html; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

  I have separated the injector = wires and the coil wires from the rest. There's a ground block located = between the two with a connection through the firewall to another ground block and = engine ground.  Batteries are in the back though.  There's a #2 = welding cable going from the ground block to the battery.  It routes down = the right side away from all the smaller wires. 

When you say “smaller = wires” do you mean current carrying wires that power things, and return current = from the alternator – or just instrumentation wires?  Good = practice, especially in a composite plane, is to use twisted pair (power/grnd) to = cancel noise. Having power leads away from the ground return forms a big loop = antenna for radiating EMF from wires that carry noisy current. I suspect that is = not much help at this point.

 

Probably the noisiest wires we = have in our planes are the alternator output and the power for the coils and = injectors.

 

The nav/com is mounted near the EM-2 and = could possibly be the culprit, based on Al's recommendations.  The EM-2 = display is right above the nav/com.  Maybe I need to move the nav/com to = the back of the plane? 

 

The Nav/Com = itself should not be an issue, the antenna lead should only ‘leak’ = low levels of RF unless the impedance match isn’t good, or bad = connection to the antenna.  Is your EM2 display remote from the Data Acquisition = Module?  Those leads, the serial leads between the EM2 and EC2, and the power = leads to the EC2 should be kept away from the noisy wires.

But then, I’m no expert on this stuff.  Tracking down electrical noise takes an expert with an = oscilloscope.

You were on a good track suspecting the = solid state relay = if the problem did not occur prior to installing it. You may = need to add snubbers there.  Switching relays definitely generates a = noise spike.

Al

 

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