X-Virus-Scanned: clean according to Sophos on Logan.com Return-Path: Received: from fmailhost05.isp.att.net ([207.115.11.55] verified) by logan.com (CommuniGate Pro SMTP 5.2c1) with ESMTP id 2455512 for flyrotary@lancaironline.net; Sun, 04 Nov 2007 19:23:37 -0500 Received-SPF: pass receiver=logan.com; client-ip=207.115.11.55; envelope-from=bbradburry@bellsouth.net Received: from arptk8ng400 (adsl-146-122-172.mco.bellsouth.net[72.146.122.172]) by bellsouth.net (frfwmhc05) with SMTP id <20071105002300H0500es38ue>; Mon, 5 Nov 2007 00:23:00 +0000 X-Originating-IP: [72.146.122.172] From: "Bill Bradburry" To: "'Rotary motors in aircraft'" References: In-Reply-To: Subject: RE: [FlyRotary] Re: Fuel delivery at WOT Date: Sun, 4 Nov 2007 19:23:16 -0500 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_000C_01C81F18.26B8A390" X-Mailer: Microsoft Office Outlook 11 Thread-Index: AcgfLdnp2/AbeYGwSfWcpRBM+9XR6gAE6wNA X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.0.6000.16545 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_000C_01C81F18.26B8A390 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Tracy, You currently have it for the snubber update. I assume that when it comes back, the MAP data as well as the injector flow rate will be set to different numbers to reflect the snubber update? I noticed at the roundup that the MAP data was quite different on the EC-2s that had the snubber update??? Thanks, Bill B _____ From: Rotary motors in aircraft [mailto:flyrotary@lancaironline.net] On Behalf Of Tracy Crook Sent: Sunday, November 04, 2007 4:58 PM To: Rotary motors in aircraft Subject: [FlyRotary] Re: Fuel delivery at WOT 238 Is kind of high for Mode 3 but you obviously did need to increase it. I'd try lowering it a bit (210 or so?) and then start tuning in Mode 1 or 9. all the way from idle to WOT in 1/2" steps of MAP. If you have not had the snubber update yet, do that first or you will have to start over again after having that done. Tracy On 10/24/07, Bill Bradburry wrote: I had not previously made any adjustments to Mode 3 or 1. Today I tried turning up the manual mixture to max and was able to get 4800 rpm. I also checked the Mode 3 at 22" and found that it needed to be increased. I increased it 10-12 punches (a lot) before it would center the monitor. I was then able to get to 4800 with the mixture at center and 5100 with it all the way rich. Now I have to turn the mixture almost all the way lean to center it at low rpms. The injector flow setting is now 238. ??? I think I am on the right track, but still need some work. I will bring the MAP data when I come Saturday. Thanks, Bill B _____ From: Rotary motors in aircraft [mailto: flyrotary@lancaironline.net] On Behalf Of Tracy Crook Sent: Wednesday, October 24, 2007 12:25 AM To: Rotary motors in aircraft Subject: [FlyRotary] Re: Fuel delivery at WOT Bill, Prior to running autotune you should manually tune to get mixture in the ball park. To give any more meaningful feedback I would need to know if you have done any adjustment to Mode 3 and/or Mode 1? Could you get the same result (as cold start switch) by turning up the manual mixture control? What was your mixture monitor telling you during all these tests? Are you out of range on the MAP correction table (already at max?) Did you set Mode 3 at 22 - 24" MAP prior to making other adjustments as suggested in the instructions? But Ed's advice was good. The fact that you could get enough fuel flow by doing anything at the EC2 tells you that the fuel system is capable of delivering enough fuel (this assumes the fuel pressure was OK which your data indicates is the case). The snubber and diagnostic modes are not related. The diagnostics went in some time before the snubber change. Don't know which version you have. Tracy Crook On 10/23/07, Bill Bradburry < bbradburry@bellsouth.net> wrote: I have been concerned that I am not getting the static rpm that others are getting with similar props. I have the stock Renesis with the Performance Props 76 X 88. I seem to be limited to about 4200 rpm. I hit 4800 once the other day, but did not know what might have caused the change. I just finished the install of the pressure overflow bottle per Lynn's msg of a while back and was running the engine up to try and eliminate any air that might still be in the engine. I noticed that when the rpm reached 4200 or so, I still had about an inch of throttle left. After pondering that for a couple of minutes, I pushed the throttle to the wall, the engine started to run rough, and I reached over and flipped the cold start switch on.. Mein Cod!!! It immediately hit 5350! Apparently I am not getting enough fuel flow to support high rpm. I have not done the self tuning at high rpm yet, but I would not expect that the fuel flow would be so low as to limit the rpm. What suggestions do you have? My ability to self tune has been limited due to cooling issues.especially at WOT! Lynn , it is too early to be sure yet, but your idea for the pressure bottle looks like it is going to help the cooling a lot. It may not be the complete solution, but it seems to be a step in the right direction. Thanks! Bill B ------=_NextPart_000_000C_01C81F18.26B8A390 Content-Type: text/html; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

Tracy,

You currently have it for the snubber update.  I assume = that when it comes back, the MAP data as well as the injector flow rate will be = set to different numbers to reflect the snubber = update?

I noticed at the roundup that the MAP data was quite different = on the EC-2s that had the snubber update???

 

Thanks,

Bill B 

 

From: Rotary motors in aircraft [mailto:flyrotary@lancaironline.net] On Behalf Of Tracy Crook
Sent: Sunday, November = 04, 2007 4:58 PM
To: Rotary motors in aircraft
Subject: [FlyRotary] Re: = Fuel delivery at WOT

238 Is kind of high for Mode 3 but you obviously did need to = increase it.  I'd try lowering it a bit (210 or so?)  and then start = tuning in Mode 1 or 9.  all the way from idle to WOT in 1/2" steps of = MAP.

 

If you have not had the snubber update yet, do that first or you = will have to start over again after having that = done.

 

Tracy
=
 

On 10/24/07, Bill Bradburry <bbradburry@bellsouth.net>= wrote:

I had not previously made any adjustments to Mode 3 or 1. 

Today I tried turning up the manual mixture to max and = was able to get 4800 rpm.  I also checked the Mode 3 at 22" and = found that it needed to be increased.  I increased it 10-12 punches (a = lot) before it would center the monitor.  I was then able to get to 4800 = with the mixture at center and 5100 with it all the way rich. =

Now I have to turn the mixture almost all the way lean = to center it at low rpms.  The injector flow setting is now 238.  = ???

I think I am on the right track, but still need some work.  I will bring the MAP data when I come Saturday. =

 

Thanks,

Bill B

 

From: Rotary motors in aircraft [mailto: flyrotary@lancaironline.net] On Behalf Of Tracy = Crook
Sent: Wednesday, October = 24, 2007 12:25 AM
To: = Rotary motors in aircraft
Subject: = [FlyRotary] Re: Fuel delivery at WOT

 

Bill,

Prior to running autotune you should manually tune to get mixture in the ball park. 

 

To give any more meaningful feedback I would need to know if you have done any adjustment to Mode 3 and/or Mode 1?  Could you get the same result = (as cold start switch) by turning up the manual mixture control?  = What was your mixture monitor telling you during all these tests?  Are = you out of range on the MAP correction table (already at max?)  Did you set = Mode 3 at 22 - 24" MAP prior to making other adjustments as suggested in = the instructions?

 

But Ed's advice was good.  The fact that you could get enough fuel flow by = doing anything at the EC2 tells you that the fuel system is capable of = delivering enough fuel (this assumes the fuel pressure was OK which your data = indicates is the case).

 

The snubber and diagnostic modes are not related.  The diagnostics went = in some time before the snubber change. Don't know which version you have. =
 

Tracy Crook
 

On 10/23/07, Bill Bradburry = < bbradburry@bellsouth.net> wrote:

I have been concerned that I am not getting the static = rpm that others are getting with similar props.  I have the stock = Renesis with the Performance Props 76 X 88.  I seem to be limited to about 4200 rpm.  I hit 4800 once the other day, but did not know what might = have caused the change.  I just finished the install of the pressure = overflow bottle per Lynn's msg of a while back and was running the engine up to try and eliminate = any air that might still be in the engine.  I noticed that when the rpm = reached 4200 or so, I still had about an inch of throttle left.  After = pondering that for a couple of minutes, I pushed the throttle to the wall, the = engine started to run rough, and I reached over and flipped the cold start = switch on….

 

Mein Cod!!!

 

It immediately hit 5350!

 

Apparently I am not getting enough fuel flow to = support high rpm.  I have not done the self tuning at high rpm yet, but I would = not expect that the fuel flow would be so low as to limit the rpm.  =

 

What suggestions do you have?  My ability to self = tune has been limited due to cooling issues…especially at WOT! =

 

Lynn , it is too early to be sure yet, but your idea for the = pressure bottle looks like it is going to help the cooling a lot.  It may = not be the complete solution, but it seems to be a step in the right = direction.  Thanks!

 

 

Bill B

 

 

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