X-Virus-Scanned: clean according to Sophos on Logan.com Return-Path: Received: from rwcrmhc15.comcast.net ([216.148.227.155] verified) by logan.com (CommuniGate Pro SMTP 5.2c1) with ESMTP id 2431196 for flyrotary@lancaironline.net; Wed, 24 Oct 2007 15:38:02 -0400 Received-SPF: none receiver=logan.com; client-ip=216.148.227.155; envelope-from=hoursaway1@comcast.net Received: from rmailcenter78.comcast.net ([204.127.197.178]) by comcast.net (rwcrmhc15) with SMTP id <20071024193715m1500a1qgne>; Wed, 24 Oct 2007 19:37:15 +0000 Received: from [208.254.22.50] by rmailcenter78.comcast.net; Wed, 24 Oct 2007 19:37:13 +0000 From: hoursaway1@comcast.net To: "Rotary motors in aircraft" Subject: Re: [FlyRotary] Re: 350 lbs dry Date: Wed, 24 Oct 2007 19:37:13 +0000 Message-Id: <102420071937.12981.471F9EE90006063D000032B52200761394CE970E990E9C9D9A0108@comcast.net> X-Mailer: AT&T Message Center Version 1 (Oct 4 2006) X-Authenticated-Sender: aG91cnNhd2F5MUBjb21jYXN0Lm5ldA== MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="NextPart_Webmail_9m3u9jl4l_12981_1193254633_0" --NextPart_Webmail_9m3u9jl4l_12981_1193254633_0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Thanks Ed, my thoughts were the same, I work as an auto tech at a Cadillac dealer, specialize in auto trans & computer controlled sys., put a Tech II diog. tool on my wife's Deville & my Chevy PU, drove the heck out of them, then down loaded the info to PC (more mem. & power in PC) then spread the info out & graphed it so I could see milliseconds looking for fast spikes in voltage or drops (vacant areas). It was very accurately controlled, (I was told that some aircraft radios were very voltage sensitive & that was my only concern, not any longer). Thanks again Ed, I'll let you all get back to the correct topic of this thread, I wish we had weighed our eng. assem. before perm. mounting, will be weighing aircraft soon. David RV-6A Rotary. -------------- Original message -------------- From: "Ed Anderson" David, I initially set it up (wired it) so I could add an external alternator voltage regulator, however, I have now flow with the same alternator for 10 years using the internal regulator without a problem. I never added the external regulator. In all the years, I have had automobiles with internally regulated alternators, I have had a very few fail, but none ever failed in a mode to generate high voltage (always lower voltage). Certainly not to say it couldn't happen, but I feel comfortable with the present arrangement. YMMV Ed ----- Original Message ----- From: hoursaway1@comcast.net To: Rotary motors in aircraft Sent: Wednesday, October 24, 2007 10:52 AM Subject: [FlyRotary] Re: 350 lbs dry Ed;; The Mazda alt. that you are useing has the volt. reg. internal, are you useing an external reg. also, I set up the harness for an external to be added if needed, do not want to if not needed, how is it working for you. Thanks, David Cook, RV-6A Rotary Lansing MI. (getting close.) -------------- Original message -------------- From: "Ed Anderson" > Don't beat yourself up about 400 lbs. While we all would like to see our > installations weigh in at 300 lbs - I have not yet seen any credible figures > showing that having happened. I think probably that Perry Mick would come > the closest when he was flying with no PSRU - just direct drive. > > While my early inexperence with aircraft design led me to the flawed "...if > in doubt, make it stout."" philosphy - I just never realized how quickly an > ounce here and an ounce there would quickly add up to 170 lbs overweight - > did have 44 lbs of battery, but still heavy. > > In any case, to make you feel a bit better, here is the breakout of my FWF > installation 377 lbs dry and 406 wet. > > > Ed > > Engine Data > > Manufacture: Mazda Model: Rotary 13B(6 Port) Serial No: > > Displacement: 80 CID Oil Pressure Max: 85 Psi Min: 20 Psi > > Rated H.P: 160 at 6500 RPM > > Weight: > > Dry > > Engine (core) 190 Lbs (Mazda 13B) > > Starter: 10 Lbs (Toyota Geared) > > Alternator: 9 Lbs (Mazda 70A) > > Ignition Coils Assembl: 7 Lbs (Mazda) > > Evaporator Cores (2): 7 Lbs (Fitted with AN-16 Threaded fittings) > > Oil Cooler: 4 Lbs (Earl's) > > Intake Manifold: 15 Lbs (Machined) > > Fule Injector Body: 3 Lbs (TWM) > > Air Box: 1 Lb (Made out of 0.032 2034 Alum) > > Oil Filter Remote: 3 Lbs (Wolfs) > > Misc. Brakets, Hose (etc): 25 Lbs (Mostly Earl's Stainless Steel > Braid/Fittings) > > Exhaust 5 Lbs (Stainless Steel, D oes not include Muffler) > > Mufflers 16 Lbs (Stainless Stell 3 1/2" Dia Borlo 32" Length, 2 Required, 8 > lbs each) > > PSRU RWS 2.85:1 42 lbs > > Propeller 18 lbs > > Motor mount 19 lbs > > Total (Dry): 377 Lbs > > Wet > > Coolant (8 Qts) 16 Lbs > > Oil ( 6 Qts) 13 Lbs > > Total: 406 Lbs > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Scott" > To: "Rotary motors in aircraft" > Sent: Tuesday, October 23, 2007 6:31 PM > Subject: [FlyRotary] 350 lbs dry > > > I finally reached a point when everything was mounted on the engine and > wanted to know the dry weight. It came in at around 350 pounds. > > Add in a 3 blade IVO prop, oil, and coolant and I am at 400 pounds... > > Needless to say that is not what I was hop ing for as Zenith lists their FWF > for a wet O360 with a 2 blade metal prop at 400 pounds. > > What have others come it at for a dry weight for their 13b setups? > > > > > > __________________________________________________ > Do You Yahoo!? > Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around > http://mail.yahoo.com > > -- > Homepage: http://www.flyrotary.com/ > Archive and UnSub: > http://mail.lancaironline.net:81/lists/flyrotary/List.html > > > -- > Homepage: http://www.flyrotary.com/ > Archive and UnSub: http://mail.lancaironline.net:81/lists/flyrotary/List.html --NextPart_Webmail_9m3u9jl4l_12981_1193254633_0 Content-Type: text/html Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit
Thanks Ed, my thoughts were the same, I work as an auto tech at a Cadillac dealer, specialize in auto trans & computer controlled sys., put a Tech II diog. tool on my wife's Deville & my Chevy PU, drove the heck out of them, then down loaded the info to PC (more mem. & power in PC) then spread the info out & graphed it so I could see milliseconds looking for fast spikes in voltage or drops (vacant areas). It was very accurately controlled, (I was told that some aircraft radios were very voltage sensitive & that was my only concern, not any longer).  Thanks again Ed, I'll let you all get back to the correct topic of this thread, I wish we had weighed our eng. assem. before perm. mounting, will be weighing aircraft soon.  David   RV-6A Rotary.
 
-------------- Original message --------------
From: "Ed Anderson" <eanderson@carolina.rr.com>
David, I initially set it up (wired it) so I could add an external alternator voltage regulator, however, I have now flow with the same alternator for 10 years using the internal regulator without a problem.  I never added the external regulator.
 
  In all the years, I have had automobiles with internally regulated alternators, I have had a very few fail, but none ever failed in a mode to generate high voltage (always lower voltage).  Certainly not to say it couldn't happen, but I feel comfortable with the present arrangement.
 
YMMV
 
Ed
----- Original Message -----
Sent: Wednesday, October 24, 2007 10:52 AM
Subject: [FlyRotary] Re: 350 lbs dry

Ed;; The Mazda alt. that you are useing has the volt. reg. internal, are you useing an external reg. also, I set up the harness for an external to be added if needed, do not want to if not needed, how is it working for you.  Thanks,  David Cook,  RV-6A Rotary Lansing MI. (getting close.)
 
-------------- Original message --------------
From: "Ed Anderson" <eanderson@carolina.rr.com>

> Don't beat yourself up about 400 lbs. While we all would like to see our
> installations weigh in at 300 lbs - I have not yet seen any credible figures
> showing that having happened. I think probably that Perry Mick would come
> the closest when he was flying with no PSRU - just direct drive.
>
> While my early inexperence with aircraft design led me to the flawed "...if
> in doubt, make it stout."" philosphy - I just never realized how quickly an
> ounce here and an ounce there would quickly add up to 170 lbs overweight -
> did have 44 lbs of battery, but still heavy.
>
> In any case, to make you feel a bit better, here is the breakout of my FWF
> installation 377 lbs dry and 406 wet.
>
>
> Ed
>
> Engine Data
>
> Manufacture: Mazda Model: Rotary 13B(6 Port) Serial No:
>
> Displacement: 80 CID Oil Pressure Max: 85 Psi Min: 20 Psi
>
> Rated H.P: 160 at 6500 RPM
>
> Weight:
>
> Dry
>
> Engine (core) 190 Lbs (Mazda 13B)
>
> Starter: 10 Lbs (Toyota Geared)
>
> Alternator: 9 Lbs (Mazda 70A)
>
> Ignition Coils Assembl: 7 Lbs (Mazda)
>
> Evaporator Cores (2): 7 Lbs (Fitted with AN-16 Threaded fittings)
>
> Oil Cooler: 4 Lbs (Earl's)
>
> Intake Manifold: 15 Lbs (Machined)
>
> Fule Injector Body: 3 Lbs (TWM)
>
> Air Box: 1 Lb (Made out of 0.032 2034 Alum)
>
> Oil Filter Remote: 3 Lbs (Wolfs)
>
> Misc. Brakets, Hose (etc): 25 Lbs (Mostly Earl's Stainless Steel
> Braid/Fittings)
>
> Exhaust 5 Lbs (Stainless Steel, D oes not include Muffler)
>
> Mufflers 16 Lbs (Stainless Stell 3 1/2" Dia Borlo 32" Length, 2 Required, 8
> lbs each)
>
> PSRU RWS 2.85:1 42 lbs
>
> Propeller 18 lbs
>
> Motor mount 19 lbs
>
> Total (Dry): 377 Lbs
>
> Wet
>
> Coolant (8 Qts) 16 Lbs
>
> Oil ( 6 Qts) 13 Lbs
>
> Total: 406 Lbs
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Scott"
> To: "Rotary motors in aircraft"
> Sent: Tuesday, October 23, 2007 6:31 PM
> Subject: [FlyRotary] 350 lbs dry
>
>
> I finally reached a point when everything was mounted on the engine and
> wanted to know the dry weight. It came in at around 350 pounds.
>
> Add in a 3 blade IVO prop, oil, and coolant and I am at 400 pounds...
>
> Needless to say that is not what I was ho p ing for as Zenith lists their FWF
> for a wet O360 with a 2 blade metal prop at 400 pounds.
>
> What have others come it at for a dry weight for their 13b setups?
>
>
>
>
>
> __________________________________________________
> Do You Yahoo!?
> Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around
> http://mail.yahoo.com
>
> --
> Homepage: http://www.flyrotary.com/
> Archive and UnSub:
> http://mail.lancaironline.net:81/lists/flyrotary/List.html
>
>
> --
> Homepage: http://www.flyrotary.com/
> Archive and UnSub: http://mail.lancaironline.net:81/lists/flyrotary/List.html
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