X-Virus-Scanned: clean according to Sophos on Logan.com Return-Path: Received: from [24.25.9.102] (HELO ms-smtp-03-eri0.southeast.rr.com) by logan.com (CommuniGate Pro SMTP 5.0.4) with ESMTP id 894474 for flyrotary@lancaironline.net; Fri, 23 Dec 2005 22:32:08 -0500 Received-SPF: pass receiver=logan.com; client-ip=24.25.9.102; envelope-from=eanderson@carolina.rr.com Received: from edward2 (cpe-024-074-025-165.carolina.res.rr.com [24.74.25.165]) by ms-smtp-03-eri0.southeast.rr.com (8.12.10/8.12.7) with SMTP id jBO3VLfU029170 for ; Fri, 23 Dec 2005 22:31:21 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <001301c6083a$8870ff70$2402a8c0@edward2> From: "Ed Anderson" To: "Rotary motors in aircraft" References: Subject: Re: [FlyRotary] Re: Question for Tracy - was: Off Topic "Switch Placements" Date: Fri, 23 Dec 2005 22:31:31 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0010_01C60810.9F536720" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.2180 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2180 X-Virus-Scanned: Symantec AntiVirus Scan Engine This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0010_01C60810.9F536720 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Ok, thanks, Tracy, food for thought. I've actually thought about driving one of my pumps using a PWM signal = to vary its speed and therefore pressure as an investigation into means = of eliminating/minimizing chances of vapor lock (similar to recent auto = EFIs) and eliminating my small header tank.=20 This would require me to isolate - say the secondary injector fuel = line to be fed by the PWM controlled pump and keep the primary pump with = tank as a back up until experiment is conclusive. But, that adds = components (pressure sensor, PWM generator) which could fail - but = presume it could be designed to fail so that pump puts out max pressure = (or some preset value). Hummmm. Ed ----- Original Message -----=20 From: Tracy Crook=20 To: Rotary motors in aircraft=20 Sent: Friday, December 23, 2005 8:14 PM Subject: [FlyRotary] Re: Question for Tracy - was: Off Topic "Switch = Placements" Cold start on for the full lean condition is a good idea. Punching the = program button in mode 0 (Primer function) will not work because the EC2 = disables the primer when it senses that the engine is running. For full rich, Turning a set of injectors off would be good except = that it doubles the injection on the others at the same time. (I sense = a suggestion on the way for yet another switch to disable the injector = doubling function : ) =20 Another thing to do in an emergency would be to cycle the fuel pump on = & off to lower the fuel pressure in order to lean the mixture. Or, = install a fuel pump controller to drop the pressure like some late model = cars do. (No! Just kidding!! even though it would work) Tracy Thanks for the info, Tracy. Until a decision is make on = alternatives, what might be good courses of action (in order to get to a = place to safely land)?? Full rich. Turn the secondary injectors off - intermittently turn = them all off if bogging. Full Lean. Intermittently turn on cold start or repeatedly punch = program button in 0 mode Wander around. Figure that on average it will be "just" right {:>). Ed A ----- Original Message -----=20 From: Tracy Crook=20 To: Rotary motors in aircraft=20 Sent: Friday, December 23, 2005 11:02 AM Subject: [FlyRotary] Re: Question for Tracy - was: Off Topic = "Switch Placements" Good question Perry. Answer would depend on the exact nature of the 'open' . Open at = ground end, hot end, or wiper. Answers in order: mixture goes full = rich, full lean, wanders around at last set point. The pot used is a = high rel part rated for 500,000 cycles but of course anything can fail. Most pot failures are 'dead spots' where the wiper goes open at a = certain spot (usually near where it is used the most). Mixture will = drift at this point and proper pilot response would be to move mixture = to a slightly richer setting, land, get the pot replaced before flying = again. Thanks for the mental nudge, I need to add this to the = instruction manual. I have pondered various fail safe strategies for this scenario = (for example, make the B controller fixed at midrange mixture) but so = far have not been satisfied with any of them. Anyone have other ideas = to be considered? Tracy ----- Original Message -----=20 From: Perry Casson=20 To: Rotary motors in aircraft=20 Sent: Thursday, December 22, 2005 4:50 PM Subject: [FlyRotary] Question for Tracy - was: Off Topic "Switch = Placements" This reminds me to ask a question to Tracy that wanders through = my brain=20 when there is no civilization in sight out the cockpit windows. Tracy: If the mixture pot fails (not all that uncommon to get an = open=20 failure in potentiometers) what does the EC2 firmware do to the = mixture? Perry Casson -- Homepage: http://www.flyrotary.com/ Archive and UnSub: = http://mail.lancaironline.net/lists/flyrotary/ ------=_NextPart_000_0010_01C60810.9F536720 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Ok, thanks, Tracy, food for = thought.
 
I've actually thought about driving one = of my=20 pumps using a PWM signal to vary its speed and therefore pressure as an=20 investigation into means of eliminating/minimizing chances of vapor lock = (similar to recent auto EFIs) and eliminating my small header=20 tank. 
 
  This would require me to isolate = - say the=20 secondary injector fuel line to be fed by the PWM controlled pump and = keep the=20 primary pump with tank as a back up until experiment is = conclusive. =20 But, that adds components (pressure sensor, PWM generator) which could = fail -=20 but  presume it could be designed to fail so that pump puts out max = pressure (or some preset value).  Hummmm.
 
Ed
 
 
----- Original Message -----
From:=20 Tracy = Crook
Sent: Friday, December 23, 2005 = 8:14=20 PM
Subject: [FlyRotary] Re: = Question for=20 Tracy - was: Off Topic "Switch Placements"

Cold start on for the full lean condition is a good=20 idea. Punching the program button in mode 0 (Primer=20 function) will not work because the EC2 disables the primer = when it=20 senses that the engine is running.
 
For full rich, Turning a set of injectors off would be good = except=20 that it doubles the injection on the others at the same time.  (I = sense a=20 suggestion on the way for yet another switch to disable the injector = doubling=20 function : ) 
 
Another thing to do in an emergency would be to cycle the fuel = pump on=20 & off to lower the fuel pressure in order to lean the = mixture.  Or,=20 install a fuel pump controller to drop the pressure like some late = model cars=20 do.  (No! Just kidding!! even though it would work)
 
Tracy
Thanks for the info, Tracy.  = Until a=20 decision is make on alternatives, what might be good courses of = action (in=20 order to get to a place to safely land)??
 
Full rich.  Turn the secondary = injectors=20 off - intermittently turn them all off if bogging.
Full Lean.  Intermittently = turn on cold=20 start or repeatedly punch program button in 0 mode
Wander around.  Figure that on = average it=20 will be "just" right {:>).
 
Ed A
 
----- Original Message ----- =
From:=20 Tracy=20 Crook
To: Rotary motors in = aircraft=20
Sent: Friday, December 23, = 2005 11:02=20 AM
Subject: [FlyRotary] Re: = Question for=20 Tracy - was: Off Topic "Switch Placements"

Good question Perry.
 
  Answer would depend on the exact nature of the=20 'open' .  Open at ground end, hot end, or = wiper.  =20 Answers in order:  mixture goes full rich, full lean, wanders = around=20 at last set point.  The pot used is a high rel part rated for = 500,000=20 cycles but of course anything can fail.
 
Most pot failures are 'dead spots' where the wiper goes = open at=20 a certain spot (usually near where it is used the = most). =20 Mixture will drift at this point and proper pilot response = would be=20 to move mixture to a slightly richer setting, land, get the pot = replaced=20 before flying again.  Thanks for the mental nudge, I need to = add this=20 to the instruction manual.
 
   I have pondered various fail safe strategies for = this=20 scenario (for example, make the B controller fixed at midrange = mixture)=20 but so far have not been satisfied with any of them.  Anyone = have=20 other ideas to be considered?
 
Tracy
----- Original Message ----- =
From: Perry=20 Casson
To: Rotary motors in = aircraft=20
Sent: Thursday, December = 22, 2005=20 4:50 PM
Subject: [FlyRotary] = Question for=20 Tracy - was: Off Topic "Switch Placements"

This reminds me to ask a question to Tracy that = wanders=20 through my brain
when there is no civilization in sight out = the=20 cockpit windows.

Tracy: If the mixture pot fails (not all = that=20 uncommon to get an open
failure in potentiometers) what does = the EC2=20 firmware do to the mixture?

Perry=20 Casson



--
Homepage:  http://www.flyrotary.com/
Archi= ve=20 and UnSub:   http://mail.lanca= ironline.net/lists/flyrotary/
------=_NextPart_000_0010_01C60810.9F536720--