X-Virus-Scanned: clean according to Sophos on Logan.com Return-Path: Received: from mtiwmhc13.worldnet.att.net ([204.127.131.117] verified) by logan.com (CommuniGate Pro SMTP 4.3.6) with ESMTP id 616247 for flyrotary@lancaironline.net; Wed, 27 Jul 2005 01:52:45 -0400 Received-SPF: none receiver=logan.com; client-ip=204.127.131.117; envelope-from=micallahan@worldnet.att.net Received: from unknown (88.birmingham-01-03rs.al.dial-access.att.net[12.74.162.88]) by worldnet.att.net (mtiwmhc13) with SMTP id <2005072705515611300pbc1se>; Wed, 27 Jul 2005 05:51:57 +0000 Message-ID: <00cc01c5926f$29cc30c0$ada24a0c@unknown> From: "Michael D. Callahan" To: "Rotary motors in aircraft" References: Subject: Re: [FlyRotary] Re: different take on the P-38 issue Date: Wed, 27 Jul 2005 00:50:55 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_00C9_01C59245.3EEDD5A0" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1409 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1409 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_00C9_01C59245.3EEDD5A0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Bill, All American 38s had counter rotating props, but the Birts ordered = them with common rotation for the exact reasons I stated. Not only that, = but the P-38's couter rotating props were set up so as to make BOTH = engines critical. If you lost an engine (especially on takeoff or = initial climb) you had no choice but to pull power and go straight = ahead. That is, if you were fast or lucky enough to get the power off = before you snapped inverted. Yes indeed, maybe a pair of 800 cu in Wankels? heheh. Mike C. ----- Original Message -----=20 From: WRJJRS@aol.com=20 To: Rotary motors in aircraft=20 Sent: Wednesday, July 27, 2005 12:08 AM Subject: [FlyRotary] Re: different take on the P-38 issue In a message dated 7/26/2005 9:57:56 PM Pacific Standard Time, = micallahan@worldnet.att.net writes: Yup I'm still here and Rusty is right... You BET I'll throw in two = cents worth here! Now, if I am thinking correctly, the Brit/Canadian version of = the P-38 had Allisons with no turbos and also did not have = counter-rotating props. That was one of the mods. You had to have a = nearly entirely different parts inventory for the backwards engine. I = don't think there were any backwards Merlins, either, so that makes a = lot of sense in the supply line. This is an amazing find, Todd. Charlie is right, too. The Navy = can use maritime law to reclaim anything in any country for an unlimited = time. The Air Force doesn't care once it is written off their inventory. = Sounds like you just bought yourself a P-38 my friend! This looks WAY too far gone to salvage as a restoration, though. = Might be nice to build a model and paint it up as this one appeared = originally. That way you could show visitors what that ball of metal = sticking out of the ground really is. The RCAF might be able to help you = track down the records if you contact their historical dept. Contact one = of the museums up there and they will probably jump at the chance to = help track this down. The number on the clamp is really not very useful. That would be = like trying to identify a car by a radiator clamp number. You might look = for a number on that prop, though. That should be traceable. You can email me directly about this if everybody gets pissy = about this being "off topic". This is extremely cool. Mike C. Guys, I may be wrong but I believe that all the '38's had counter rotating = Allisons. The turbos were in short supply for both the 38 and the P-47 = durring the war. Probably why the non-turbo versions were sold.=20 To make this a more "on-topic" discussion, wouldn't the rotary make a = perfect engine for a P-38 replica! PP rotaries will run in either = direction as well so you could even do the counter rotating props! Spur = gear PSRU (Mistral or Powersport) would work fine backward. Just = dreaming. Bill Jepson ------=_NextPart_000_00C9_01C59245.3EEDD5A0 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Bill,
    All American 38s had counter rotating props, but = the=20 Birts ordered them with common rotation for the exact reasons I stated. = Not only=20 that, but the P-38's couter rotating props were set up so as to make = BOTH=20 engines critical. If you lost an engine (especially on takeoff or = initial climb)=20 you had no choice but to pull power and go straight ahead. That is, if = you were=20 fast or lucky enough to get the power off before you snapped = inverted.
    Yes indeed, maybe a pair of  800 cu in = Wankels?=20 heheh. Mike C.
----- Original Message -----
From:=20 WRJJRS@aol.com
Sent: Wednesday, July 27, 2005 = 12:08=20 AM
Subject: [FlyRotary] Re: = different take=20 on the P-38 issue

In a message dated 7/26/2005 9:57:56 PM Pacific Standard Time, micallahan@worldnet.att.net=20 writes:
Yup I'm still here and Rusty is right... = You BET I'll=20 throw in two cents worth here!
    Now, if I am thinking = correctly, the=20 Brit/Canadian version of the P-38 had Allisons with no turbos and = also did=20 not have counter-rotating props. That was one of the mods. You had = to have a=20 nearly entirely different parts inventory for the backwards engine. = I don't=20 think there were any backwards Merlins, either, so that makes a lot = of sense=20 in the supply line.
    This is an amazing find, = Todd. Charlie=20 is right, too. The Navy can use maritime law to reclaim anything in = any=20 country for an unlimited time. The Air Force doesn't care once it is = written=20 off their inventory. Sounds like you just bought yourself a P-38 my=20 friend!
    This looks WAY too far gone = to salvage=20 as a restoration, though. Might be nice to build a model and paint = it up as=20 this one appeared originally. That way you could show visitors what = that=20 ball of metal sticking out of the ground really is. The RCAF might = be able=20 to help you track down the records if you contact their historical = dept.=20 Contact one of the museums up there and they will probably jump at = the=20 chance to help track this down.
    The number on the clamp is = really not=20 very useful. That would be like trying to identify a car by a = radiator clamp=20 number. You might look for a number on that prop, though. That = should be=20 traceable.
    You can email me directly = about=20 this if everybody gets pissy about this being "off topic". This = is=20 extremely cool. Mike C.
Guys,
 I may be wrong but I believe that all the '38's had counter = rotating Allisons. The turbos were in short supply for both the 38 and = the=20 P-47 durring the war. Probably why the non-turbo versions were sold. =
 To make this a more "on-topic" discussion, wouldn't the = rotary make=20 a perfect engine for a P-38 replica! PP rotaries will run in either = direction=20 as well so you could even do the counter rotating props! Spur gear = PSRU=20 (Mistral or Powersport) would work fine backward. Just dreaming.
Bill Jepson
------=_NextPart_000_00C9_01C59245.3EEDD5A0--