Mailing List flyrotary@lancaironline.net Message #19714
From: David Carter <dcarter@datarecall.net>
Subject: Re: [FlyRotary] Re: Cooling -Learned a lot
Date: Sun, 3 Apr 2005 16:42:30 -0500
To: Rotary motors in aircraft <flyrotary@lancaironline.net>
I wonder - is it not more correct to say:  Behind the diffuser, the velocity
will be slower, density higher, therefore there will be "nearly the same
mass flow of air" thru the radiator, with same cooling, BUT "at slower
speed, higher air density, and therefore less cooling drag"?
    -  Drag is a function of velocity squared.  The air density factor is
not squared, thus we seek a reduction of drag by cutting velocity thru the
rad.

Bernie, you are the SR-71 PW engine air duct man - am I even close to
expressing any useful and true info above?

David Carter

----- Original Message -----
From: "Ed Anderson" <eanderson@carolina.rr.com>
To: "Rotary motors in aircraft" <flyrotary@lancaironline.net>
Sent: Sunday, April 03, 2005 4:15 PM
Subject: [FlyRotary] Re: Cooling -Learned a lot


You are absolutely correct, Tracy.

I did not make it clear but the diffuser does the velocity reduction and
increases the pressure in front of the core by recovery of (some) dynamic
pressure component of the air flow.  This higher pressure in front of the
core then results in an increased pressure differential across  the core.
This increase in pressure differential across the core, as you stated,
actually speeds up the air flow through the core itself.

My apologies for being less than careful on that point.,

Ed A.
  ----- Original Message -----
  From: Tracy Crook
  To: Rotary motors in aircraft
  Sent: Sunday, April 03, 2005 12:24 PM
  Subject: [FlyRotary] Re: Cooling -Learned a lot


  Excellent summary Ed, correlates with my experience as well.  Only
exception I would take is in the following excerpt:

  "A good diffuser will reduce airflow
  velocity through the core which will reduces cooling drag.  Pressure
across
  the core is increased which further enhances cooling."

  A good diffuser will reduce velocity but the reduction occurs IN the
diffuser, not through the core.  As counter-intuitive as it may sound,  the
velocity through the core is HIGHER than it would have been without the
diffuser's velocity decrease (and pressure increase).

  Think about it this way,  How could velocity through the core be reduced
by a pressure increase?  It isn't.  The velocity at this point (through the
core) is increased.

  This is the single most misunderstood detail in liquid cooled engine
systems.

  Tracy



  Subject: [FlyRotary] Cooling -Learned a lot


    Too right, Jerry

    My  first 40 hours or so were in the marginal cooling zone. {:>).  As
other
    things in this hobby, there are so many variables that interact, that
what
    may appear simply at first, is almost always a bit more complex.  I
    say(Cooling Axiom 1) if you have enough cooling surface area and air
mass
    flow then it WILL cool.    However, you may incur a high penalty in
cooling
    drag - which may not be as important for draggy airframes (such as
biplanes)
    as it is to sleeker airframes.   Also a system that adequately cools an
    engine producing  150 HP may not cool an engine producing 180 HP.
Picking
    your cooling design point is important.  Optimizing for cruise and your
will
    be less than optimum for take and climb.  Optimize for climb and you
will
    probably have more cooling drag than required at cruise.  Compromise,
    compromise - cowl flaps are sometimes used to try to have the best of
both
    worlds.

    Some folks advocate a thinner, larger surface area core -which is great
for
    slow moving automobiles stuck in traffic with low dynamic pressure
    potential, but I think is not the optimum for most aircraft.  Once you
trip
    the airflow and turn it turbulent you have incurred most of the drag
    penalty.  Larger surface area cores disrupt a larger airstream and incur
    more drag.  Yes, thicker cores produce a bit more drag than the SAME
frontal
    area thinner cores.  But, with a thicker core you can use a core with
    smaller frontal area.

      The NASCAR radiator's average 3" thick and on the long tracks where
speeds
    are higher some even go up to 7" thick.  My contention is their
operating
    environment is more akin to ours than regular automobiles moving at
slower
    speeds.  You know that the NASCAR folks will spend $$ for just a tiny
    advantage - so clearly they don't use thick cores because it is a
    disadvantage. But, some folks will continue to point to the large thin
    radiators designed for environments with much lower dynamic pressure as
    being the way to go.  Will it cool? sure it will (Cooling axiom 1
above).
    Is it the lowest drag option for an aircraft of the RV/TailWind type, I
am
    convinced it is not.

    The diffuser makes a considerable amount of difference and can made the
    difference between a system that cools adequately and one which does
not.
    The biggest culprit that lessens cooling effectiveness is turbulent
eddies
    that form inside the duct due to flow detachment from the walls.  These
    eddies in effect act to block effective airflow through part of the
core.
    So keeping the airflow attached to the sides of the diffusers is crucial
for
    good cooling from two standpoints. A good diffuser will reduce airflow
    velocity through the core which will reduces cooling drag.  Pressure
across
    the core is increased which further enhances cooling.

    I have gone from a total of 48 sq inches opening (total) for my two GM
cores
    and that provided marginal cooling - down to 28 sq inches (total) with
    adequate cooling with an engine now producing more HP.  Experimenting
with
    the diffuser shape made the difference.

    The K&W book (Chapter 12) really provided the insight to how and which
    diffuser shapes provided the better dynamic recovery.  The Streamline
duct
    was shown to be able to provide up to 82% recovery of the dynamic
pressure.
    Some folks reading the chapter misinterpreted the chart to show only 42%
    recovery where there chart was actually only showing the pressure
recovery
    contribution due to the duct walls and did not include the contribution
due
    to the core.  On the same chart, an equation (which apparently gets
ignored)
    clearly shows that the TOTAL  pressure recovery is 82%.

    I have taken the Streamline duct as a starting point, but since I do not
    have the space to provide the 12-14" for a proper Streamline duct, I did
    some "creative" things to try to insure that there was no separation
even
    though my walls diverge more rapidly than the Streamline duct.  Won't
claim
    mine are as good as a Streamline, but they clearly are much better than
the
    previous design which basically just captured the air and forced it
through
    the cores.

    FWIW

    Ed Anderson
    RV-6A N494BW 275 Rotary Hours (Plugs Up)
    Matthews, NC
    eanderson@carolina.rr.com


    ----- Original Message -----
    From: "Jerry Hey" <jerryhey@earthlink.net>
    To: "Rotary motors in aircraft" <flyrotary@lancaironline.net>
    Sent: Sunday, April 03, 2005 9:27 AM
    Subject: [FlyRotary] Re: phase I flight restrictions was:N19VX flys


    > It was not long ago that "cooling" was the major issue.  Now it seems
    > that we have learned enough to make several different configurations
    > work.   I can't lay my finger on what it is we have learned but my
    > recommendation is to use smaller radiators and EWPs.   Jerry
    >
    >
    >




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